First Group: General Discussion

[TheGrandWazoo]

We are veering off topic so hopefully this will help clarify the issue of local councils and bus companies...

The 1985 Transport Act introduced the deregulation of bus services in Great Britain (excl London) in 1986. All PTE and council owned businesses had to be formed into arms length businesses so that they were on an equal footing with private businesses. The shareholders were the local authority(s) or PTAs. This was to ensure that they were on an equal footing with private businesses - they could obtain loans from their shareholders but not be subsidised. Most were subsequently privatised via outright purchase by large groups, either directly or via sale to management and employees who later sold out. Some still exist - notably Lothian, Reading and Nottingham among others.

However, there was provision for services to be provided where there was no other alternative or in terms of specialist provision of services by local authorities (and in these times of austerity, LAs have been forced to use welfare vehicles for local bus services such as North Yorkshire).

The 2017 Buses bill seeks to provide options to local authorities etc in terms of additional powers but specifically precludes them from setting up their own bus companies:

Bus companies: limitation of powers of authorities in England

(1)A relevant authority may not, in exercise of any of its powers, form a company for the purpose of providing a local service.
(2)Subsection (1) applies whether the relevant authority is acting alone or with any other person.
(3)In this section—
“company” has the same meaning as in the Companies Acts (see sections 1(1) and 2(1) of the Companies Act 2006);
“form a company” is to be construed in accordance with section 7 of the Companies Act 2006;
“local service” has the same meaning as in the Transport Act 1985 (see section 2 of that Act);
“Passenger Transport Executive”, in relation to an integrated transport area in England or a combined authority area, means the body which is the Executive in relation to that area for the purposes of Part 2 of the Transport Act 1968;
“relevant authority” means—
(a)a county council in England;
(b)a district council in England;
(c)a combined authority established under section 103 of the Local Democracy, Economic Development and Construction Act 2009;
(d)an Integrated Transport Authority for an integrated transport area in England;
(e)a Passenger Transport Executive for—
(i)an integrated transport area in England, or
(ii)a combined authority area.


Hope that explains why councils can't go buying bus companies (aside from their finances). Now.....back to First Group

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The thing is, what are you actually buying? A load of buses and ageing depots, and existing T&Cs of staff? It's hard to suggest that FirstGroup has an awful lot of goodwill.

Why wouldn't you simply buy your own buses, recruit and set up competing routes? Or if you couldn't be bothered with the competition, wait for First to shut up shop and go in and set up, much to everyone's delight? (Not least your own when you have a ready pool of unemployed staff to recruit on any T&Cs you like?)

I think you're missing what "goodwill" actually means.

And yes, you could set up your own business from scratch but you'll find that there isn't a ready pool of unemployed staff to recruit and indeed, many firms have found out that it isn't so easy to simply go in and compete against First.

 

[winston270twm]

Coast Capital have increased their stake again, up to 10.01% now:

https://otp.tools.investis.com/generic/regulatory-story.aspx?newsid=1272606&cid=858

Released : 31.05.2019
TR-1: Standard form for notification of major holdings

Identity of the issuer or the underlying issuer of existing shares to which voting rights are attached FirstGroup plc

Reason for the notification An acquisition or disposal of voting rights

% of voting rights attached to shares (total of 8. A) 10.01%

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I suspect the interesting thing is that this has probably been on the cards for some considerable time, but like it seems everything at First it takes an age, and still comes out half-baked. Unite's response is smart and throws a well timed and aimed spanner in the works. It's at least a master of clarity compared to anything First say - what does their strategy statement on First Bus actually mean? Yes we all have our own interpretation, but that's the point. It still looks to me like a Board stumbling around in the dark, trying to find the exit.

First Bus have done some good things, but none of it has looked to me to be co-ordinated with a sense of planning and direction or even to have demonstrated a commitment to the UK bus industry; rather more opportunistic. Like taking advantage of grants, where available, and a few good appointments. It's the sort of thing an old-fashioned cowboy operator might have done. The local example that did it for me was when local operator Essex invested in new depots a few years ago, and then gave up. The MD left for whatever reason (and First seem to have a history of senior people giving up - and admittedly others getting stuck, but may be the wrong way around), and wasn't replaced, and the services just treaded water when everyone else was busy restructuring and investing in their networks. £53m is not a small operation, and when costs still exceed income something is seriously awry. Isn't part of the job of the senior management to make sure it's sorted out? First locally just tinkered, passing time. That's not a strategy. (Yet their strategy talks of Clacton, a tiny depot; that's not a strategic Board matter). It all looks like a right muddle. Communication is two way, but not it appears in First's case, internally or externally. Perhaps because they have nothing to say. Like kids, local management need support, not just being "told what to do" all the time. It's insecurity, not strategy. Bad parenting. What has really happened in First Bus over the last 5 years? Their published "strategy" and still, with the exception of this latest "statement", appears to have been written in the Moir years.

This is a cynical (even unfair) and certainly incomplete view. Of course. But is it too far off the mark? Crude impressions are sometimes a very good guide. We can defend First, of course. But perhaps the question is why we have to?

I think you're confusing a few things together here, and yes, it is cynical and incomplete. Perhaps a reflection of your own experiences and influenced by your own experiences; I don't know First Essex, how good or bad it is, etc.

First have often been criticised (rightly) in the Moir era of being centralised and having to do what Aberdeen demanded. No local innovation and just executing centrally ordained orders with little or no local insight etc. Nowadays, local managers have a lot more autonomy to do things. They aren't given carte blanche to do what they like but they are much freer to do so.

I have been on a number of First OpCos in the last year - 8 I reckon. The local variations are quite noticeable even those sharing the same senior management (Kernow vs. Somerset). In short, there is a lack of consistency. First Essex may be poor but to extrapolate that across the entire group is really not accurate. In fact, were you to travel about, you'd understand the line "Like kids, local management need support, not just being "told what to do" all the time. It's insecurity, not strategy. Bad parenting." is wholly inaccurate. If anything, it feels like the decentralisation has allowed some OpCos to flourish and kick on and consequently, it seems to have highlighted weaker management capability at all levels in other OpCos - I will caveat that in saying that some are not helped by some external factors like councils, congestion, local economic factors etc. You could almost argue maybe more central control not less, or greater support for local management, might have helped?

UNITE's response is not a well timed spanner in the works. It is their default response at a time like this. That's not a criticism - it is simply what you'd expect them to say and it seems rather cut and paste as some parts make little sense viz:

“On one hand, FirstGroup has praised staff for their hard work and commitment and then, in the next breath, it announces it is selling off First Bus because of so-called ‘limited synergies’ between the parent company and the bus operations.

This is a slap in the face to the dedication that our members show on a daily basis in all the weathers that the British climate can throw at them."

As regards your other criticisms - like taking public funding? "rather more opportunistic. Like taking advantage of grants, where available, and a few good appointments. It's the sort of thing an old-fashioned cowboy operator might have done" Why wouldn't you? Stagecoach are probably even more adept at that, but hell, even a cowboy firm like Nottingham City Transport are getting new gas buses that are, in part, funded by grants.

Said it before, said it again - the entire bus industry is in an almost existential crisis. There are major disruptors (like Uber) allied to major changes in shopping patterns plus we've reached a tipping point on road congestion. All operators have suffered but First were simply in the worst position beforehand to cope with these. Worth remembering that despite that, UK Bus have managed to maintain revenue and increase profit so their strategy is working in some part.

As I've said before, there are some areas that are clearly still challenging. Somerset is a place where operators will always struggle. South Yorkshire looks a poor operation. Perhaps Essex falls into the same category? I would have thought Essex would be an area where they could unleash potential - maybe new management is needed at all levels?

PS - that's not to lay the blame on all local management and clearly there are constraints placed on them because of the issues in the group. First West of England under James Freeman (but also a good team below them) are having to make do and mend with limited investment over the last few years. They are doing good things despite the limitations that they have.

 

[90sWereBetter]

Can't really speak for Basildon, but from my experiences First Hadleigh is a decent operation with well-turned out buses and a frequent network with good loadings sprawing out to the east of Southend. Their Trident fleet may be elderly but they look like new, such is their presentation. First seem to co-exist well with Arriva Southend, and indeed until a year or so ago First had a much younger fleet than Arriva

First Colchester was a relatively poor operation from my experiences in 2014/15 with dozens of battered, superannuated Scania single deckers dominating the fleet, but it seems like they've turned the corner with new Streetlites and cascaded B9 deckers from Scotland in the last few years.

Chelmsford might have its operational issues, but they've had plenty of new E200s in the last few years, and various cascades in the last year have managed to completely eliminate the 02-reg Solos which dominated the fleet. True, there is room to improve but I don't think First Essex is in as bad a shape as it is made out to be.

 

[DD12]

https://www.worcesternews.co.uk/new...sell-greyhound-and-split-off-uk-bus-business/

In this Press Association article it claims that Matthew Gregory is still saying that a sale of PART of UK Bus is a possibility -- --
IS he still saying that, - or have they incorrectly included something he has previously said ??

(Sorry if my brain is working incorrectly !)

 

[InspectorBloke]

As someone with some inside knowledge, it feels like First Essex are keeping their head above water, but paddling frantically underneath to provide a daily service. Seeing what the engineering and operations staff deal with just to provide a day to day service would shock an outsider.

Some may be common to First and other operators but these are my observations.

Poor decisions made in the past have to be addressed. Take the X30 service, a premium service which charges premium fares, so it should be the flagship of First Essex. The buses ordered in 2016 are woefully underpowered and under capacity. 2 buses were bought in from Berkshire to address capacity issues, but are far from fit for purpose for a premium airport service.

Presentation is questionable at some depots. Cleaning is sub contracted to an external company and buses are supposed receive a daily sweep out and external wash, with a deep clean every month, but it doesn't look like it happens consistently. Some buses are left for weeks/months running around with old accident damage or old advertising. One bus that comes to mind has been operated by Chelmsford for years but still has faded rear advertising for Coop Funerals from the time it was in Colchester. It feels like there is no one to take responsibility or accountability for fleet presentation. First Essex seems to take a large amount of cascades from group, which in my opinion isn't a bad thing if the bus is reliable, providing the buses receive some sort of mid life refurbishment. The issue with First Essex and the wider First Group is that mid life refurbishments seem to be rare.

Congestion has an impact on timekeeping and punctuality, especially in the City of Chelmsford and the larger towns of Colchester, Southend and Basildon, and the road networks surrounding the M25 and A12. Some services account for this, with generous recovery time or point to point timings, but others only allow recovery time of 5 minutes, or point to point travel time which doesn't account for traffic or passenger loadings. Some services are over provisioned. For example, some daytime services may carry as little as 10-15 passengers on a half hourly service. Perhaps moving the available resources to where they are needed would allow for reliability improvements elsewhere.

 

[Jordan Adam]

https://www.worcesternews.co.uk/new...sell-greyhound-and-split-off-uk-bus-business/

In this Press Association article it claims that Matthew Gregory is still saying that a sale of PART of UK Bus is a possibility -- --
IS he still saying that, - or have they incorrectly included something he has previously said ??

(Sorry if my brain is working incorrectly !)

NX have interest in the Scottish Ops, specifically Glasgow and the "Midland Bluebird" side of FSE.

On the flip-side they've also been saying Aberdeen would remain the HQ of FirstGroup, somewhat ruling out "Aberdeen being sold".

 

[Volvodart]

On the flip-side they've also been saying Aberdeen would remain the HQ of FirstGroup, somewhat ruling out "Aberdeen being sold".

See text below:-

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...ll-greyhound-as-it-bows-to-activist-investors

While the chief executive said there were no plans at present to change First’s UK listing or head office, he added: “Once we get through this we might reconsider it.”

 

[Jordan Adam]

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...ll-greyhound-as-it-bows-to-activist-investors

Thanks, another article was saying otherwise. But i'd trust the Guardian over it anyway! It wouldn't take much to move the HQ anyway given that very few functions are still held here.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

As someone with some inside knowledge, it feels like First Essex are keeping their head above water, but paddling frantically underneath to provide a daily service. Seeing what the engineering and operations staff deal with just to provide a day to day service would shock an outsider.

Some may be common to First and other operators but these are my observations.

Poor decisions made in the past have to be addressed. Take the X30 service, a premium service which charges premium fares, so it should be the flagship of First Essex. The buses ordered in 2016 are woefully underpowered and under capacity. 2 buses were bought in from Berkshire to address capacity issues, but are far from fit for purpose for a premium airport service.

Presentation is questionable at some depots. Cleaning is sub contracted to an external company and buses are supposed receive a daily sweep out and external wash, with a deep clean every month, but it doesn't look like it happens consistently. Some buses are left for weeks/months running around with old accident damage or old advertising. One bus that comes to mind has been operated by Chelmsford for years but still has faded rear advertising for Coop Funerals from the time it was in Colchester. It feels like there is no one to take responsibility or accountability for fleet presentation. First Essex seems to take a large amount of cascades from group, which in my opinion isn't a bad thing if the bus is reliable, providing the buses receive some sort of mid life refurbishment. The issue with First Essex and the wider First Group is that mid life refurbishments seem to be rare.

Congestion has an impact on timekeeping and punctuality, especially in the City of Chelmsford and the larger towns of Colchester, Southend and Basildon, and the road networks surrounding the M25 and A12. Some services account for this, with generous recovery time or point to point timings, but others only allow recovery time of 5 minutes, or point to point travel time which doesn't account for traffic or passenger loadings. Some services are over provisioned. For example, some daytime services may carry as little as 10-15 passengers on a half hourly service. Perhaps moving the available resources to where they are needed would allow for reliability improvements elsewhere.

Interesting observations. Poster firstgreateastern has mentioned the X30 before in the same terms. Given that both Bristol and Glasgow have now received e400s for their main airport runs, it probably would make sense for First to have invested in something similar for the X30?

Mid-life refurbs are an interesting point and again, it points to a fragmented approach rather than a centralised instruction. There are (and have been) some OpCos that have pursued refurbishments, most notably West of England and Hampshire. They continue to do so. Others are seeming to do so on specific routes allied to a relaunch - see Worcester.

 

[DragonEast]

Fair points, as I said my post was deliberately provocative, prejudiced and incomplete. Yes I do travel elsewhere on First and other companies. Buses, outside the Mets at least, are facing an existential crisis: yes; but against that I think they are doing surprisingly well and deserve, with the Councils, all credit for getting a quart out of a pint pot.

All operators it seems to me, the bigger ones at least, are a patchwork quilt to a greater or lesser degree, with both routes and depots providing services of quite noticeable different quality, so that sometimes we can wonder if it is the same company.

Still, to me, First have a unique difficulty which any successor has to face. I find it hard to put my finger on it, but it seems to me that the other operators have been better at consolidation which makes it easier for the stronger bits to support the weaker ones. First is still a disparate collection of units with less coherence. It is not perhaps for want of trying, their electronic ticketing, gps and twitter have improved considerably along with many of their support functions. But as with any organisation it is easier to take credit for superficial change than to address underlying issues. And that seems to be something that afflicts First too.

Of course everyone with any sense takes advantage of public funding, but like suckling the skill is to turn that into growth rather than dependence. Others seem to do it better, perhaps? I accept the First animal is at a historic disadvantage, with neither in many cases the advantage of local roots nor size. But this attention to the principle of making the most of what you have is something I would have expected senior management to address, and I am not sure they have. I think may be First have to work harder at it, rather they appear to have been more laissez faire. I accept that I am not expressing myself very well. Sorry. But the successful operators seem to me to be those that identify what they can do well, and then make the very best job of it they can. Success is as much about what we don't do as what we do. With First it more often seems to be "do everything we can", and "never mind the quality feel the width".

History plays a part. In Essex, Hadleigh I think started off as Hadleigh and District, separate from Eastern National and always had a better reputation and "pride in the job". (Thought locals tell me things have got worse more recently). Perhaps similar at Leicester CityBus and more locally with the former Great Yarmouth Transport compared to Eastern Counties (who provided their operations manager). Generally, the bigger operators have reduced those historic discrepancies. May be less so with First? When they get into a rut, which we all do from time to time, it seems much harder to pull themselves up by their own bootstrings.

My concern is that whatever structure is adopted, we may find ourselves in the same cycle of stagnation, again, if we are not careful. How do we avoid the same fate?

 

[winston270twm]

NX have interest in the Scottish Ops, specifically Glasgow and the "Midland Bluebird" side of FSE.

On the flip-side they've also been saying Aberdeen would remain the HQ of FirstGroup, somewhat ruling out "Aberdeen being sold".

Is that a just a rumour or has it come from someone familiar with inside knowledge?

First Bristol, Glasgow, South Yorkshire & West Yorkshire all have familiar operating characteristics & scale as per NXWM plus Leicester / Worcs are also local units to the West Midlands.

https://www.worcesternews.co.uk/news/17673217.firstgroup-to-sell-greyhound-and-split-off-uk-bus-business/

In this Press Association article it claims that Matthew Gregory is still saying that a sale of PART of UK Bus is a possibility -- --
IS he still saying that, - or have they incorrectly included something he has previously said ??

(Sorry if my brain is working incorrectly !)

All options are currently on the table for First UK Bus including demerger from First Group Plc, part or full sale, that said their activist largest shareholder Coast Capital wants First Group to split and float its US ops on the NYSE, but wants to also retain the UK bus business. So it depends on potentially offers from suiters / Coast Capital getting their way etc....​

 

[Jordan Adam]

Is that a just a rumour or has it come from someone familiar with inside knowledge?

First Bristol, Glasgow, South Yorkshire & West Yorkshire all have familiar operating characteristics & scale as per NXWM plus Leicester / Worcs are also local units to the West Midlands.

Allegedly management from NX were visiting Caledonia recently regarding it. I can't vouch for the accuracy of it all, however based on what has been said by insiders it seems pretty solid, albeit a rumour until proven fact. Obviously the area would be quite fitting for them given they already have a base in Dundee.

 

[overthewater]

I have always believed National express would happily take all of scotland and keep Mr Jarvis in control, just extending his role to Dundee aswell. That by n by for now. We could all be betting in Red of Black and 0 pops up!

 

[DD12]

All options are currently on the table for First UK Bus including demerger from First Group Plc, part or full sale, that said their activist largest shareholder Coast Capital wants First Group to split and float its US ops on the NYSE, but wants to also retain the UK bus business. So it depends on potentially offers from suiters / Coast Capital getting their way etc....​

Thanks Winston !

 

[winston270twm]

Allegedly management from NX were visiting Caledonia recently regarding it. I can't vouch for the accuracy of it all, however based on what has been said by insiders it seems pretty solid, albeit a rumour until proven fact. Obviously the area would be quite fitting for them given they already have a base in Dundee.

It wouldn't surprise me & totally agree, it ticks quite a few boxes & is very similar to NXWM, I know they've looked at Manchester Depots but chose not to pursue it further.

 

[freetoview33]

Can someone give me a list of all the current First bus UK depots?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Can someone give me a list of all the current First bus UK depots?

Is it not on Steve White's site?

 

[carlberry]

Most municipal bus companies were sold off or went bust between 1976 and 1984 when competition was introduced.

?????
What evidence have you got for this?
From memory (which may be aging) I can think of one during this time period, Burton upon Trent was sold. Very few have ever gone bust and mostly late 1980s, early 1990s.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

?????
What evidence have you got for this?
From memory (which may be aging) I can think of one during this time period, Burton upon Trent was sold. Very few have ever gone bust and mostly late 1980s, early 1990s.

Waveney (Lowestoft) didn't go bust but they were increasingly propped up the council who sold out to Eastern Counties in 1977.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Can someone give me a list of all the current First bus UK depots?

Here it is - thought it was there http://www.swhite.org.uk/steve/fg18.xlsx

 

[WatcherZero]

?????
What evidence have you got for this?
From memory (which may be aging) I can think of one during this time period, Burton upon Trent was sold. Very few have ever gone bust and mostly late 1980s, early 1990s.

This is a list of council bus companies absorbed between 1968 and 1974 with the introduction of PTE's

Birkenhead
Liverpool
St Helens
Southport
Wallasey
Ashton-under-Lyne
Bolton
Bury
Leigh
Manchester
Oldham
Ramsbottom
Rochdale
Salford
Stalybridge, Hyde, Mossley and Dukinfield
Stockport
Wigan
Doncaster
Rotherham
Sheffield
Glasgow
Newcastle upon Tyne
South Shields
Sunderland
Birmingham
Coventry
Dudley Midland Red operations
Walsall
West Bromwich
Wolverhampton
Bradford
Halifax
Huddersfield
Leeds

The fate of the larger entities were:
South Yorkshire sold 1993
West Yorkshire sold 1988
West Midlands sold 1991
Strathclyde sold 1993
GM North sold 1994
GM South sold 1994
Merseyside sold 1993
Tyne and Wear sold 1989

Then outside Metro areas:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_former_municipal_bus_companies_of_the_United_Kingdom

Has about a dozen that went bust or absorbed by a commercial competitor with about 2 dozen others sold between the late 80's and early 2000's (and a couple later)

Then you had the National Bus Company
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Bus_Company_(UK)

which was formed in 1968 to buy out failing municipal bus companies which would continue to be locally run, it acquired about 70 failing municipal and 25 commercial bus companies in 1968 and 69, which then went through a process of mergers and failures, in 1978 these were consolidated into 30 regional companies with some also being given to Selnec and West Midlands. Then these fractured as in the early 80's as they were split to save the good parts so that the bad parts could shutter (all the long distance arms were shuttered) leading to the number of companies rising to 52 before ultimately all were privatised in 1987/88.

 

[Robertj21a]

I think that may need a rewrite !

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I think that may need a rewrite !

T

Then you had the National Bus Company
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Bus_Company_(UK)

which was formed in 1968 to buy out failing municipal bus companies which would continue to be locally run, it acquired about 70 failing municipal and 25 commercial bus companies in 1968 and 69, which then went through a process of mergers and failures, in 1978 these were consolidated into 30 regional companies with some also being given to Selnec and West Midlands. Then these fractured as in the early 80's as they were split to save the good parts so that the bad parts could shutter (all the long distance arms were shuttered) leading to the number of companies rising to 52 before ultimately all were privatised in 1987/88.

Robert - I think you may be being kind. The NBC (IIRC) was constituted of the already state owned Tilling/BTC, and then BET sold out in order to avoid a forced purchase at rock bottom rates. The only municipals that NBC bought were Exeter and Luton in 1970 (neither in great shape) and Waveney some years later.

As for the split, it was done to maximise sales revenues and to promote competition, AFAIK.

 

[carlberry]

This is a list of council bus companies absorbed between 1968 and 1974 with the introduction of PTE's

Birkenhead
Liverpool
...............................
Huddersfield
Leeds

Then you had the National Bus Company
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Bus_Company_(UK)

which was formed in 1968 to buy out failing municipal bus companies which would continue to be locally run, it acquired about 70 failing municipal and 25 commercial bus companies in 1968 and 69, which then went through a process of mergers and failures, in 1978 these were consolidated into 30 regional companies with some also being given to Selnec and West Midlands. Then these fractured as in the early 80's as they were split to save the good parts so that the bad parts could shutter (all the long distance arms were shuttered) leading to the number of companies rising to 52 before ultimately all were privatised in 1987/88.

None of which relates to your statement 'Most municipal bus companies were sold off or went bust between 1976 and 1984 when competition was introduced.'

The statement above about the NBC is wildly inaccurate. It wasn't setup to buy out failing municipal companies. It did acquire at least one by default (Waveney as stated by TGW). It consolidated fairly early on (1968-1971) and was required to move some services to Selnec and WMPTE in 1972/73. Some companies were split in the early 1980s to make them more saleable however none was split to produce 'bad' parts.
None of which is relevant to this thread however!

 

[overthewater]

I take it Coast Capital really want its view point to happen? I wonder who is selling?

Coast Capital have increased their stake again, up to 10.01% now:

https://otp.tools.investis.com/generic/regulatory-story.aspx?newsid=1272606&cid=858

Holding(s) in Company
Released : 31.05.2019

TR-1: Standard form for notification of major holdings

NOTIFICATION OF MAJOR HOLDINGS
1a. Identity of the issuer or the underlying issuer of existing shares to which voting rights are attachedii: FirstGroup plc
1b. Please indicate if the issuer is a non-UK issuer (please mark with an “X” if appropriate)
Non-UK issuer
2. Reason for the notification (please mark the appropriate box or boxes with an “X”)
An acquisition or disposal of voting rights X
An acquisition or disposal of financial instruments
An event changing the breakdown of voting rights
Other (please specify)iii:
3. Details of person subject to the notification obligationiv
Name Coast Capital Management LP
City and country of registered office (if applicable) New York City, NY, USA
4. Full name of shareholder(s) (if different from 3.)v
Name
City and country of registered office (if applicable)
5. Date on which the threshold was crossed or reachedvi: 29/05/2019
6. Date on which issuer notified (DD/MM/YYYY): 30/05/2019
7. Total positions of person(s) subject to the notification obligation
% of voting rights attached to shares (total of 8. A) % of voting rights through financial instruments

(total of 8.B 1 + 8.B 2) Total of both in % (8.A + 8.B) Total number of voting rights of issuervii
Resulting situation on the date on which threshold was crossed or reached 10.01% 1,214,125,617
Position of previous notification (if

applicable) 9.77%


8. Notified details of the resulting situation on the date on which the threshold was crossed or reachedviii
A: Voting rights attached to shares
Class/type of

shares

ISIN code (if possible) Number of voting rightsix % of voting rights
Direct

(Art 9 of Directive 2004/109/EC) (DTR5.1) Indirect

(Art 10 of Directive 2004/109/EC) (DTR5.2.1) Direct

(Art 9 of Directive 2004/109/EC) (DTR5.1) Indirect

(Art 10 of Directive 2004/109/EC) (DTR5.2.1)
GB0003452173 121,570,445 10.01%
SUBTOTAL 8. A 121,570,445 10.01%
B 1: Financial Instruments according to Art. 13(1)(a) of Directive 2004/109/EC (DTR5.3.1.1 (a))
Type of financial instrument Expiration

datex Exercise/

Conversion Periodxi Number of voting rights that may be acquired if the instrument is
exercised/converted. % of voting rights
N/A N/A N/A N/A N/A
SUBTOTAL 8. B 1 N/A N/A
B 2: Financial Instruments with similar economic effect according to Art. 13(1)(b) of Directive 2004/109/EC (DTR5.3.1.1 (b))
Type of financial instrument Expiration

datex Exercise/

Conversion Periodxi Physical or cash
settlementxii Number of voting rights % of voting rights
N/A N/A N/A N/A N/A N/A
SUBTOTAL 8.B.2



9. Information in relation to the person subject to the notification obligation (please mark the

applicable box with an “X”)
Person subject to the notification obligation is not controlled by any natural person or legal entity and does not control any other undertaking(s) holding directly or indirectly an interest in the (underlying) issuerxiii
Full chain of controlled undertakings through which the voting rights and/or the

financial instruments are effectively held starting with the ultimate controlling natural person or legal entityxiv (please add additional rows as necessary)
Namexv % of voting rights if it equals or is higher than the notifiable threshold % of voting rights through financial instruments if it equals or is higher than the notifiable threshold Total of both if it equals or is higher than the notifiable threshold
Coast Capital Management LP 10.01% 10.01%
10. In case of proxy voting, please identify:
Name of the proxy holder N/A
The number and % of voting rights held N/A
The date until which the voting rights will be held N/A
11. Additional informationxvi


Place of completion New York City, NY USA
Date of completion 30 May 2019


Other Information
Information provided in accordance with the requirements of the FCA’s Disclosure Guidance and Transparency Rule (DGTR) 6.2.2AR:


Legal Entity Identifier: 549300DEJZCPWA4HKM93


Classification as per DGTR 6 Annex 1R: 2.3

Enquiries:


Ndiana Ekpo

Company Secretarial Consultant, FirstGroup plc

+44 (0)7970 183974

 

[Cesarcollie]

Allegedly management from NX were visiting Caledonia recently regarding it. I can't vouch for the accuracy of it all, however based on what has been said by insiders it seems pretty solid, albeit a rumour until proven fact. Obviously the area would be quite fitting for them given they already have a base in Dundee.

Given that the new Group strategy was only announced yesterday, and MD’s told the night before, I think it highly unlikely NX were inspecting Caledonia, given Glasgow (subject to whatever happens post yesterday) has thus far not been for sale. They may well have been there for other purposes - but most unlikely they were measuring it up!! In any event, even if they were buying, they’d be highly unlikely to physically visit - odd though that may sound. All the effort would be data analysis and other number-crunching.

 

[winston270twm]

Given that the new Group strategy was only announced yesterday, and MD’s told the night before, I think it highly unlikely NX were inspecting Caledonia, given Glasgow (subject to whatever happens post yesterday) has thus far not been for sale. They may well have been there for other purposes - but most unlikely they were measuring it up!! In any event, even if they were buying, they’d be highly unlikely to physically visit - odd though that may sound. All the effort would be data analysis and other number-crunching.

Just because the new group strategy was only formally announced Thurs, Group will of had a idea for a while before the annoucement & will no doubt have tested buyer interest .

Just because an interested party could have been seen visiting it doesn't mean the opposition will know what they are going to bid.

 

[Volvodart]

You wonder how long, though, as it is obvious that they kept Greyhound being for sale as the "good news" for the results announcement when they could have said this at the update earlier this year.