Flixbus Discussion

[Boo_]

Megabus in Scotland are all run by Citylink M11 and M20 is a joint Service with the service from Manchester/Preston handed over to citylink or Stagecoach if heading south with M20 it is stagecoach as far as Newcastle

Megabus does not reg routes in England as don`t sell local tickets think it classed as local route if under 30km

Now back to Flixbus

BM coaches I know them well as I work in Rail Replacement

They are known as Bad Manage coaches as there not the best contractor with issues with drivers getting lost or other issues.

The coach they used was used on a Euro route and would be ok to run dupes to EU from London I don`t know how many coaches they have that could be used but you would think they need 5 coaches for flixbus work. I kno

 

[Bletchleyite]

Based on these two comments though, there are plenty of non PSVAR scheduled coaches running. Thandi, New Bharat, Snap (partly debatable as it depends on the vehicle sent), Zeelo.Berrys has been mentioned a few times. There has to be a workaround with all routes being unregistered and operating under EU rules for long distance services (With zero passengers making trips of less than 15 miles). IF there is no workaround, these other companies would have been pulled in for it by now.

No, there is no sensible[1] workaround. So if those other companies are indeed doing it they need reporting. It's probably just not been noticed yet.

[1] The only one I can think of is to make it a holiday tour by charging £1 extra for theoretical access to a dorm bunk somewhere. But I know Flix are not doing this, and I doubt the others are either.

There will also be paid corporate services out there which are non compliant.

I believe the qualification is that it carries the public at separate fares for travel only. So that includes RRBs but doesn't include any form of private hire. I'm not sure of the situation regarding a coach organised by an employer but charged at separate fares, bu

I thought RRBs were done under separate legislation.

They are in terms of operation, but PSVAR, by legal precedent, does apply to them as they carry passengers who are paying separate fares for travel only. That those are nominally train fares is legally irrelevant (the TOCs previously thought it was relevant but a Court disagreed and set precedent, I understand).

 

[Bletchleyite]

Megabus does not reg routes in England as don`t sell local tickets think it classed as local route if under 30km

There are exceptions, but NatEx isn't really interested in selling local tickets either. The reason to register parts of NatEx routes as local bus routes is simply to be able to claim BSOG and get a bit of extra money. The X5 is a bit different as while it uses posh coaches it's just a limited stop bus route in reality, just a long one.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Megabus in Scotland are all run by Citylink M11 and M20 is a joint Service with the service from Manchester/Preston handed over to citylink or Stagecoach if heading south with M20 it is stagecoach as far as Newcastle

Citylink have no involvement with the M11/M20, those are entirely Megabus routes operated by Stagecoach (or independents in England). The only reason some Citylink services use Megabus style numbers is for marketing reasons following the Scottish Express bus war in the mid 00s Stagecoach effectively in short dropped Megabus services in return for some shares in Citylink. The reason the M numbers were adopted for the Citylink routes was to highlight the fact that tickets could be bought via the Megabus website, however this is the case for all Citylink services including the 9xx routes.

 

[SouthEastBuses]

I think we all want everyone to have an easy journey.
Also, you can't brush everything with the same paint. The Panther LE in most cases doesn't reach requirements for operators, probably because they either don't want a triaxle coach (I know Plaxton said they would make a twoaxle version) and the capacity for passengers and luggage isn't good enough for some routes (which would be worse on a twoaxle). This is why it's only purchase has been Stagecoach and the only other operator I can see purchasing it is TrentBarton for Red Arrow.
I'm not saying the Panther LE is bad, it just does a job a wheelchair lift coach can do with more capacity and capabilities.

Of course, the low floor bus (or bus/coach hybrid) in general doesn't come without disadvantages. Everything isn't perfect and can have their drawbacks.
With that being said, the problem about low floor coaches is the lack of enough luggage space and seats, a key factor required in National Express, Megabus and Flixbus services. Sure, there's the double decker coach (like the Astromega, Skyliner or Panorama) which both have easy access and enough luggage space, but the problem is that they can be too long for some routes (being typically 14-15m - that's the length of a typical tri-axle coach) as well as too high and not able to negotiate low bridges, being as high as a standard double decker bus like an Enviro400 or a Wright Gemini 2, for example.

However in most cases, the advantages of low floor technology and easy access outweighs the disadvantages. Whilst most coaches do have lifts which is a good thing, the problem is that they only really provide access to wheelchair users - the elderly will continue to have difficulties in having to negotiate 3-4 steps. Which is why in my opinion low floor should be used wherever possible.

And more thing - the Panther LE isn't the only type of low floor coach on the UK & Ireland market. There's the Sunsundegui SB3 LE (which uses the same chassis as the Panther LE), which despite it only being 12m, it can have 49 seats in total (@F Great Eastern can correct me on this!). And if you take a look at the mainland, even 8-9m low floor coaches exist!

 

[Bletchleyite]

The Sunsundegui SB3 LE isn't a coach, it's a regional bus. It'd fit the X5 well but wouldn't be a jot of use for Megabus - no luggage space for a start.

While some might need the driver to assist, most older people live in houses with stairs and manage to climb those. If it was a problem, coach tours wouldn't (in normal times) be full of older people, and they are.

 

[F Great Eastern]

The Sunsundegui SB3 LE isn't a coach, it's a regional bus. It'd fit the X5 well but wouldn't be a jot of use for Megabus - no luggage space for a start.

While some might need the driver to assist, most older people live in houses with stairs and manage to climb those. If it was a problem, coach tours wouldn't (in normal times) be full of older people, and they are.

Technically it is classified as a coach by Sunsundegui and has coach like luggage racks showing in the windows rather than above.

In reality it's pretty much a coach body hacked off the highline Volvo B8R coach chassis and onto the B8RLE bus chassis with as little modifications as possible and once you've been on-board one it becomes quite obvious that is the case.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Technically it is classified as a coach by Sunsundegui and has coach like luggage racks showing in the windows rather than above.

In reality it's pretty much a coach body hacked off the highline Volvo B8R coach chassis and onto the B8RLE bus chassis with as little modifications as possible and once you've been on-board one it becomes quite obvious that is the case.

Not a very pleasant interior at all, very dull and cluttered...

 

[Bletchleyite]

Not a very pleasant interior at all, very dull and cluttered...

I was going to say that it looked very industrial. That said, regional buses in mainland Europe usually do have overhead luggage racks similar to those found on trains.

 

[SouthEastBuses]

The Sunsundegui SB3 LE isn't a coach, it's a regional bus. It'd fit the X5 well but wouldn't be a jot of use for Megabus - no luggage space for a start.

While some might need the driver to assist, most older people live in houses with stairs and manage to climb those. If it was a problem, coach tours wouldn't (in normal times) be full of older people, and they are.

That's the point. Due to a lack of luggage space these Sunsundegui low floor bus/coach hybrids would be more suited to long distance local / short distance regional express services like the X5 and 99 as you rightly said. Or in my case of Italy, the "linee extraurbane" (Italian for regional / interurban routes). But recently some companies (like GTT Torino, ATV Verona and TPER Bologna) are trying to improve accessibility by ordering low floor bus/coach hybrids which are far more suited to the local regional routes of our country than the current step entrance crap. Our new low floor bus/coach hybrids are mostly Iveco Crossway LEs and sometimes Setra Multiclass S415/S416/S418LE Business. ATV Verona has ordered the MAN Lion's City LE A78 as their new low entry regional bus.

If it wasn't for the school contracts requiring 70 seater coaches, these Sunsudengui SB3 LE would work well in the Scottish Highlands too. I mean, they seem to be working well in Ireland (which has a local bus service situation similar to that of the Scottish Highlands in that they prefer coach-type vehicles than the bus-type vehicles we're used to in England) on routes previously served by pure high floor coaches (example: Scania Irizar Intercentury). Then again @F Great Eastern can correct me on this (whether the Irish low floor Sunsudegui are working or not) as I've only been to Ireland in 2009 and 2013, way long before the Bus Eireann / Go Ahead Ireland Sunsundegui low floor bus/coach hybrids were introduced.

As for the interior, I agree. As much as there is need for enough space luggage, it does make the interior look really ugly.

 

[SouthEastBuses]

I was going to say that it looked very industrial. That said, regional buses in mainland Europe usually do have overhead luggage racks similar to those found on trains.

Indeed they do. These include the new low entry regional buses in Italy that are being introduced throughout various companies, although some (like Cotral in Lazio or various companies around Tuscany such as CTT Nord Livorno) prefer to continue to order step entrance vehicles.

 

[markymark2000]

Of course, the low floor bus (or bus/coach hybrid) in general doesn't come without disadvantages. Everything isn't perfect and can have their drawbacks.
With that being said, the problem about low floor coaches is the lack of enough luggage space and seats, a key factor required in National Express, Megabus and Flixbus services. Sure, there's the double decker coach (like the Astromega, Skyliner or Panorama) which both have easy access and enough luggage space, but the problem is that they can be too long for some routes (being typically 14-15m - that's the length of a typical tri-axle coach) as well as too high and not able to negotiate low bridges, being as high as a standard double decker bus like an Enviro400 or a Wright Gemini 2, for example.

However in most cases, the advantages of low floor technology and easy access outweighs the disadvantages. Whilst most coaches do have lifts which is a good thing, the problem is that they only really provide access to wheelchair users - the elderly will continue to have difficulties in having to negotiate 3-4 steps. Which is why in my opinion low floor should be used wherever possible.

And more thing - the Panther LE isn't the only type of low floor coach on the UK & Ireland market. There's the Sunsundegui SB3 LE (which uses the same chassis as the Panther LE), which despite it only being 12m, it can have 49 seats in total (@F Great Eastern can correct me on this!). And if you take a look at the mainland, even 8-9m low floor coaches exist!

That is why I really like the Altano and the Interdeck. Low floor area for the driver, wheelchair users and less able. Upstairs has more passengers over a comparable length single floor coach, has the excellent view on the front few seats. Plenty of luggage space as well below. Not sure on their draw backs but it looks the part but I would say as a passenger, they are the best buses for intercity travel.

 

[SouthEastBuses]

That is why I really like the Altano and the Interdeck. Low floor area for the driver, wheelchair users and less able. Upstairs has more passengers over a comparable length single floor coach, has the excellent view on the front few seats. Plenty of luggage space as well below. Not sure on their draw backs but it looks the part but I would say as a passenger, they are the best buses for intercity travel.

The drawback is that whilst they are great in providing level access for wheelchair people and the elderly, only two seats are available on the lower deck. The rest all have to climb a steep set of 7-8 steps. And the other problem about those two types is that being the same height as a standard double decker bus/coach, they wouldn't be able to negotiate low bridges.

But other than that, I like the Interdeck and Altano too. Very innovative type of coach!

 

[Bletchleyite]

The drawback is that whilst they are great in providing level access for wheelchair people and the elderly, only two seats are available on the lower deck. The rest all have to climb a steep set of 7-8 steps.

But then as I mentioned most elderly people who are going to be fit and well enough to travel on a long-distance coach journey do that every day in their house. It's only a small proportion of non-wheelchair-using people who can't, and there are those downstairs seats for those people.

 

[Jamesrob637]

I've been very impressed with Flix on the old continent and would love to see them here next year even if only on limited services.

 

[Jordan Adam]

That is why I really like the Altano and the Interdeck. Low floor area for the driver, wheelchair users and less able. Upstairs has more passengers over a comparable length single floor coach, has the excellent view on the front few seats. Plenty of luggage space as well below. Not sure on their draw backs but it looks the part but I would say as a passenger, they are the best buses for intercity travel.

The Altano and Interdeck are only suited to long distance express work like Megabus. On more local work (which is the case in most of Scotland) they're about the worst products on the market. We're veering far too off topic here!

 

[SouthEastBuses]

But then as I mentioned most elderly people who are going to be fit and well enough to travel on a long-distance coach journey do that every day in their house. It's only a small proportion of non-wheelchair-using people who can't, and there are those downstairs seats for those people.

Of course, not all the elderly have difficulties. As you rightly imply, it's important to not generalise.
However, if we can help the elderly who specifically have difficulties in negotiating steps, then I don't see why we shouldn't help them.

And also, the problem is, 2 isn't enough. The Altano/Interdeck should have been designed with at least 5-6 seats on the mini lower deck.

 

[Bletchleyite]

And also, the problem is, 2 isn't enough. The Altano/Interdeck should have been designed with at least 5-6 seats on the mini lower deck.

Yes, it did occur to me that one option would be to make the low-floor section a bit longer.

 

[GusB]

We have drifted somewhat off-topic. If anyone wishes to discuss low-entry vs step-entrance coaches, feel free to do so in a new thread. Likewise, discussion of whether or not coach services are registered should go elsewhere, although I will leave the existing posts in place as they have some relevance to the topic of this thread.

 

[carlberry]

I've been very impressed with Flix on the old continent and would love to see them here next year even if only on limited services.

They are here, running to Bristol, Birmingham and Manchester from London.

 

[WestCoast]

I've been very impressed with Flix on the old continent and would love to see them here next year even if only on limited services.

Same here - I've used their services in Germany, Austria, Poland and Croatia and generally had good experiences. I've found their app very good. In fact, they got me out of a tricky situation in Krakow once where I missed another operator's service and I was able to rebook instantly on the app for their service departing in half an hour.

The only other long-distance operator I've used that has equally impressed me has been Deutsche Bahn's IC buses, if only for the great legroom and vending machine stocked with beer!

 

[cnjb8]

Which is why in my opinion low floor should be used wherever possible.

But in most cases this isn't possible, so therefore the lift option is completely fine

 

[Jamesrob637]

They are here, running to Bristol, Birmingham and Manchester from London.

Oh right I've not seen one here in Manchester but then I've not been into the city centre post-COVID and I don't live on/near the main road the coaches take into and out of town.

 

[darloscott]

Flixbus are launching twice daily service between Leeds and London from Thursday, calling at Meadowhall in both directions

 

[Bletchleyite]

I note from Twitter that the operator of the Manchester service has gone into administration. Have they operated today?

 

[markymark2000]

I note from Twitter that the operator of the Manchester service has gone into administration. Have they operated today?

There's been some discussion on this on the Flixbus enthusiasts Facebook Group and the general response was that the operators were still running.

Something possibly interesting to note is that one of the coaches had Thandi legals and disc so they were running a trip (I don't know which Thandi but it was one of them. They are based in Birmingham so perhaps they will jump on the Manchester/Birmingham). Turners I believe do the Bristol run so that is unaffected.


Unrelated, Rumored in what is normally a very reliable source, the Oxford & Chiltern Bus Page is reporting that Flixbus are close to introducing an Oxford to London service.

Editorial

 

[MotCO]

Unrelated, Rumored in what is normally a very reliable source, the Oxford & Chiltern Bus Page is reporting that Flixbus are close to introducing an Oxford to London service.

Editorial

Despite Go-Ahead just pulling out of this service????

 

[Bungle965]

Unrelated, Rumored in what is normally a very reliable source, the Oxford & Chiltern Bus Page is reporting that Flixbus are close to introducing an Oxford to London service.

It'll be interesting to see if they can get it to work, given that one operator has just pulled out citing a lack of passenger numbers.
Competing against the well known Oxford Tube in addition to rail (You can get relatively reasonable priced tickets, booking not that far ahead of travel) means I imagine they'll have their work cut out.

 

[Deerfold]

Flixbus are launching twice daily service between Leeds and London from Thursday, calling at Meadowhall in both directions

Not quite daily - there's no service Tuesday or Wednesday.

 

[carlberry]

It'll be interesting to see if they can get it to work, given that one operator has just pulled out citing a lack of passenger numbers.
Competing against the well known Oxford Tube in addition to rail (You can get relatively reasonable priced tickets, booking not that far ahead of travel) means I imagine they'll have their work cut out.

Part of the reason Oxford bus pulled out was the improved train services over recent years. I'm sure that Flixbus will give an Oxford service at least as long as they gave their Portsmouth service before giving in!