Full Virgin Timetable to Start

[87015]

West Coast would not be right in my opinion with the huge investment VT have made.

What would all this investment by Virgin, as opposed to by the taxpayer be then?

Trains = Rosco (taxpayer guaranteed)
Track = Railtrack/Network Rail (taxpayer then)
All franchise costs 1998-2005 = taxpayer

Not so much left then.

 

[ukrob]

I think it's safe to say Northern are more than a step up from FNW, particularly looking at the reliability records of the 323 fleet now than FNW: It's almost 3x the miles-per casualty, they last on average three times as long before breaking down, than FNWs was.

However, I don't think Northern would cancel services along our route as it's rather profitable, even in our part thanks mostly to the passenger demands at Sandbach and Holmes Chapel although Goostrey and Chelford come into the equation as well.

Do you know that, or are you guessing because it is well loaded?

 

[350401]

Do you know that, or are you guessing because it is well loaded?

Reliability has improved alot since the days of FNW, and NT generally do a good job, within its regulatory and franchise constraints. NT were told to run fewer trains past Alderley Edge in the new timetable, and they've had to comply. It raises a whole separate argument over franchises and how much meddling the DaFT should really do.

The trains are generally well-loaded by the time they get to Chelford, when 1 142 turns up at 07.51, its rare to find a seat. I think the main problem with NT is that they are not actually very good/efficient at collecting fares on the train. Given that a fair few of the stations are unmanned with no ticket machine, this really hits revenue. Its comparatively rare for the conductor to get to me by the time the 07.51 reaches Picc/Oxford road - and a less scrupulous person as myself could easily evade paying the full fare at the barriers by claiming to have got on at Levenshulme? Fare-collection is similarly erratic on the return service in the evening. The only trains where fare-collection is consistently reliable are the mid-morning/mid-afternoon trains which are quiet and the conductor can easily acertain who got on where. If NT introduced ticket machines at all thier stations, I'd guess revenue would probably increase significantly?

 

[jamesontheroad]

Plus the fast 16.30 Euston to Glasgow in 4 hours 10 minutes.

Is there a southbound fast service to mirror this? I don't recall one being mentioned...

 

[voyagerdude220]

no, all of the southbound services still stop between Glasgow and Preston, as per the first phase of the VHF timetable.

 

[djw1981]

1140 ex Glasgow does 4h22 (calls Carlisle, Penrith, Preston only)

 

[gingerheid]

I've found Virgin's fares to Glasgow have gone up a lot by way of the advance tickets being hard to get hold of. I've been using NXEC (or Ryanair ) for that reason.

 

[Trains06]

I think that now that between Salford Keys and MKC Pendo's can run @ 135 the full Virgin service will be interesting

 

[voyagerdude220]

Where abouts can the Pendos run at 135 mph?

Are there any areas where 221's can as well, or are they limited to 125 EPS?

 

[D306]

what a great first day of the full timetable. I don't know about virgin but London Midland had some major problems today

 

[The Planner]

Where abouts can the Pendos run at 135 mph?

Are there any areas where 221's can as well, or are they limited to 125 EPS?

Must be a typo, nothing runs at more than 125.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Are you sure?

I'm certain that VWC Pendolinos (but not sure if the Super Voyagers are as well?) are now running at 135 mph in certain areas, after the implementation of the VHF timetable??

 

[First ScotRail]

For 135mph did signalling not need updating? Also do the 221s not have a top speed of 125mph?

 

[voyagerdude220]

I thought that the signalling only needed to be updated for 140+ mph running?

You could be right about the Super Voyagers though.

 

[devon_metro]

125mph EPS is maximum afaik.

 

[Mojo]

I do recall Virgin wanted 135mph on the Trent Valley, which was reported as the maximum for conventional signalling but I don't think it's currently in operation.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Perhaps that's where i got mixed up then..

 

[33056]

what a great first day of the full timetable. I don't know about virgin but London Midland had some major problems today

London Midland ARE a problem in themselves

Much to my surprise, everything other than the usual LM shambles managed to keep going until lunchtime before the first farce kicked in (axle counter problems between Wembley and Euston) just in time to screw me up getting home :roll:

 

[voyagerdude220]

Much to my surprise, everything other than the usual LM

To be precise, the first one or two North Wales services ex Holyhead were delayed/cancelled due to over-running engineering up around Bangor :roll:

But you're certainly right about LM!

 

[37401]

Sorry to wander slightly off topic but....
Is there still one Holyhead Pendo drag?
If so when does it run?

nope sorry mate no more drags, some of the 57s have gone to ATW

 

[MCR247]

nope sorry mate no more drags, some of the 57s have gone to ATW

Oh well never mind :cry:

 

[Pumbaa]

And with it came the advent of the new Southern through service to Milton Keynes. And boy was that unexpected - proved to be very popular. Although it is halfterm, I took the journey twice today. Both times it was difficult to find standing room. From what I could see, most passengers were commuters, with the odd family chucked in for good measure.

I think the service is very good, although it's a shame it only goes as far as East Croydon. Running it to at least Gatwick would give the service even more popularity. I'd like to think that it becomes half-hourly in the near future if this level of patronage keeps up. It's either that, or run longer trains - which they can't.

 

[tbtc]

And with it came the advent of the new Southern through service to Milton Keynes. And boy was that unexpected - proved to be very popular. Although it is halfterm, I took the journey twice today. Both times it was difficult to find standing room. From what I could see, most passengers were commuters, with the odd family chucked in for good measure.

I think the service is very good, although it's a shame it only goes as far as East Croydon. Running it to at least Gatwick would give the service even more popularity. I'd like to think that it becomes half-hourly in the near future if this level of patronage keeps up. It's either that, or run longer trains - which they can't.

Out of interest, how would you say the loadings compared to the Euston bound services? I'd like to see services like this up and running, but I can see the operators wanting more "risk free" services into Euston and Victoria/ London Bridge than taking a chance on the less tried market that avoids central London.

Maybe the way to increase the service to half hourly would be (say) Brighton/ Gatwick to Watford PLUS East Croydon to Milton Keynes/ Northampton, giving a half hourly East Croydon to Watford "core" service, meaning four trains an hour from Clapham Junction to Shepherd's Bush? (assuming the ex Silverlink service is still half hourly to Willsden Junction? - shame trains running from Watford to Shepherd's Bush can't stop at Willsden, due to the layout)

 

[The Planner]

I do recall Virgin wanted 135mph on the Trent Valley, which was reported as the maximum for conventional signalling but I don't think it's currently in operation.

Certainly isnt, no part of the WCML is more than 125mph and its highly unlikely it will ever be.

 

[Pumbaa]

Well - it's difficult to say. Lots of people were impressed on platforms and onboard that you didn't have to change to access SW London. In the morning due to LM being farcical, a lot of people opted to take the Southern service to Clapham to continue their journey from there. In the evening, it was just as busy as LMs local services (well, the ones that were running) that were coming out Euston.

 

[Trains06]

Pendo's running at 135 between just south of Stafford and somewhere in the Milton Keynes area, had it direct from a Retail Service Manager and 3 Train Managers

 

[Pumbaa]

Pendo's running at 135 between just south of Stafford and somewhere in the Milton Keynes area, had it direct from a Retail Service Manager and 3 Train Managers

And you've just had it direct from the timetabling department at NR that it isn't the case

 

[Danielo]

Pendo's running at 135 between just south of Stafford and somewhere in the Milton Keynes area, had it direct from a Retail Service Manager and 3 Train Managers

Is there an EPS speed limit sign that says 135 in those sections?

 

[devon_metro]

Max speed is 125...

 

[voyagerdude220]

And you've just had it direct from the timetabling department at NR that it isn't the case

I thought last time (2nd January) i was going along the WCML (several times in one day) that we seemed to be going even faster than usual, but i find it really hard to tell, simply because the Pendolino's are simply fantastic already, let alone at 135 mph
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Max speed is 125...

Are you saying that because that was the original max speed, or do you have proof that 135 mph running is not in operation?