Future of Newhaven Marine and Harbour Stations?

[jopsuk]

I caught the ferry between Newhaven and Dieppe on a number of occasions after that route took over the night ferry crossings from Dover to Dunkerque. The ferry was moored on the quayside the other side of the station building so you didn’t have far to go to get on board.

I used to try to make my connection off the Manchester to Newhaven Marine loco hauled service rather than the boat train from London Victoria.

Was this in the days when the Dieppe ferry terminal was in the town, with Dieppe Maritime station? My research says that closed in 1994/the new out of town terminal opened.

As far as I understand (and has been said up thread) the ferry at Newhaven still uses the slip alongside the site of Newhaven Marine. But the combination of modern security/lack of demand/cost cutting means the only public entrance to the ferry terminal complex is at Newhaven Town.

 

[AlbertBeale]

Was this in the days when the Dieppe ferry terminal was in the town, with Dieppe Maritime station? My research says that closed in 1994/the new out of town terminal opened.

As far as I understand (and has been said up thread) the ferry at Newhaven still uses the slip alongside the site of Newhaven Marine. But the combination of modern security/lack of demand/cost cutting means the only public entrance to the ferry terminal complex is at Newhaven Town.

Yes - in the '70s and '80s I used the Newhaven-Dieppe crossing several times for an overnight trip between London and Paris, and the connection between train platform and boat gangplank was no distance at all on either side. I remember setting off from the Dieppe quayside to Paris, with the first few minutes of the journey being past people's bedroom windows pre-dawn. (A bit like Weymouth would have been, I guess?)

 

[paul1609]

Was this in the days when the Dieppe ferry terminal was in the town, with Dieppe Maritime station? My research says that closed in 1994/the new out of town terminal opened.

As far as I understand (and has been said up thread) the ferry at Newhaven still uses the slip alongside the site of Newhaven Marine. But the combination of modern security/lack of demand/cost cutting means the only public entrance to the ferry terminal complex is at Newhaven Town.

Newhaven had to build a new ramp to take the larger ferries. The stern of the ship is now opposite the footbridge of Newhaven Harbour Station and further out in to the River Ouse. The new terminal is a short walk from Newhaven Town station and also a very frequent bus service to Brighton/Eastbourne. A bus/ minibus takes you onboard from the terminal. Wouldn't pretend to be a regular customer but when Ive used it there haven't been very many foot passengers and many of them have arrived by car and parked up or been dropped off.

 

[davetheguard]

Yes - in the '70s and '80s I used the Newhaven-Dieppe crossing several times for an overnight trip between London and Paris, and the connection between train platform and boat gangplank was no distance at all on either side. I remember setting off from the Dieppe quayside to Paris, with the first few minutes of the journey being past people's bedroom windows pre-dawn. (A bit like Weymouth would have been, I guess?)

I remember doing the night boat over to Dieppe a few times too. Slamdoor EMU from London Victoria, non-stop -at least in theory- if I recall correctly. Loco hauled train on Corail coaches on the other side of the channel, with the diesel coming off in favour of an electric loco somewhere - presumably Rouen. The train became a busy commuter train on the run to Paris where you finally arrived 12 hours after leaving London.

 

[WesternLancer]

I remember doing the night boat over to Dieppe a few times too. Slamdoor EMU from London Victoria, non-stop -at least in theory- if I recall correctly. Loco hauled train on Corail coaches on the other side of the channel, with the diesel coming off in favour of an electric loco somewhere - presumably Rouen. The train became a busy commuter train on the run to Paris where you finally arrived 12 hours after leaving London.

Growing up in the 70s and 80s in sussex I did this regularly - exactly as you said - loco change in Rouen. If you were not on the boat train french side I recall you made a change to a DMU at Rouen.

The art deco buildings are Dieppe Maritime were esp stylish I thought, and a shame when they were removed.

I didn't use the services through from London of course, apart from on one occasion when I had been in the north west and was travelling direct to Paris.

I also used the 'fast cat' ferry on the route a few times in the 1990s, but for day trips just to Dieppe - and I think in order to get the earliest fast cat, I always drove to Newhaven.

Pretty sure I have seen posters even in the recent past on the Newhaven bound platforms at Lewes advising foot passengers where to get off the train for the ferry - I think this was last summer when I was in the area. An official Southern Railway info poster that is.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

I wonder, given the proximity of Newhaven Harbour station to the Town and the fact it has lost its raison d'etre whether there will be a case to keep the station open. Could GTR propose a case for closure (like the Marine)?

 

[swt_passenger]

I wonder, given the proximity of Newhaven Harbour station to the Town and the fact it has lost its raison d'etre whether there will be a case to keep the station open. Could GTR propose a case for closure (like the Marine)?

I thought there hadn’t actually ever been an application by GTR for closure of Marine? It’s basically the reason this thread has been running so long...

 

[Islineclear3_1]

I thought with the removal of the buildings and no passenger services, the Marine is as good as closed (even though not technically perhaps...)

 

[swt_passenger]

I thought with the removal of the buildings and no passenger services, the Marine is as good as closed (even though not technically perhaps...)

Well yes, but as far as I can tell the DFt would still tell you it’s operational, as was the case back in a June when it was last discussed.

 

[jopsuk]

I wonder, given the proximity of Newhaven Harbour station to the Town and the fact it has lost its raison d'etre whether there will be a case to keep the station open. Could GTR propose a case for closure (like the Marine)?

Passenger figures were up at the last set of figures- whilst there was a massive drop between 2004/05 and 2009/10 (partly due to a change in counting, but not entirely) there's been a general trend up since

 

[trainmania100]

First loco into Newhaven marine since it was relaid? Note the big structur in the background for marine dredged aggregates which will later be loaded into the trains

 

[tsr]

Newhaven Marine will now be referred to as “Marine Siding” for the purposes of turning empty coaching stock. It will also be switched to ground position light shunt signals and stop boards. It may as well be properly closed, as the operational railway no longer recognises that it even exists.

 

[infobleep]

Newhaven Marine will now be referred to as “Marine Siding” for the purposes of turning empty coaching stock. It will also be switched to ground position light shunt signals and stop boards. It may as well be properly closed, as the operational railway no longer recognises that it even exists.

I take it one can still technically request a taxi? I know there isn't much point in doing so.

 

[trainmania100]

I take it one can still technically request a taxi? I know there isn't much point in doing so.

You'd say to the taxi driver you want a taxi from Newhaven harbour now.

Newhaven marine is completely closed off to the public now without any access at all to the signal box area. There's a locked gate and fence at the south end of the northbound platform completely restricting any access beyond the NO ACCESS sign - unlike before where it was just a small metal railing.

 

[infobleep]

You'd say to the taxi driver you want a taxi from Newhaven harbour now.

Newhaven marine is completely closed off to the public now without any access at all to the signal box area. There's a locked gate and fence at the south end of the northbound platform completely restricting any access beyond the NO ACCESS sign - unlike before where it was just a small metal railing.

Would they not have to take you to as close as possible to Newhaven Marine, rather than another station, nearby. It would of course be Govia Thameslink Railway ordering the taxi.

 

[swt_passenger]

Would they not have to take you to as close as possible to Newhaven Marine, rather than another station, nearby. It would of course be Govia Thameslink Railway ordering the taxi.

So from Newhaven station down side to the nearest harbour entrance barriers, about 40 yards away as the crow flies? Then walk through an aggregates terminal? You’d seriously expect to be able to do that just to prove a point?

 

[infobleep]

So from Newhaven station down side to the nearest harbour entrance barriers, about 40 yards away as the crow flies? Then walk through an aggregates terminal? You’d seriously expect to be able to do that just to prove a point?

I don't actually want to do it myself but I wonsered if legally one could do it? There are many pointless things people do in life.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

I would imagine a taxi dropping you off somewhere along Beach Road or adjacent to the security hut near Harbour Station. The vehicle crossing to the Marine was removed over the August bank holiday and fenced off

 

[swt_passenger]

I would imagine a taxi dropping you off somewhere along Beach Road or adjacent to the security hut near Harbour Station. The vehicle crossing to the Marine was removed over the August bank holiday and fenced off

That’s what I thought. It’s basically no longer in a public place, going by earlier posts in this thread. No fares available, doesn’t appear in journey planners, not much going for it really...

 

[Islineclear3_1]

Are the works going as planned? Will the possession be given up on time for start of service tomorrow?

 

[rdm111]

I caught the Victoria service this morning from Newhaven Harbour. Two observations, one is that the Marine station is completely closed off now with high fencing and a security gate. Also the normal Newhaven Harbour terminator that usually waits in the Harbour station waiting the London service to pass was now in the old Marine platform (apologies for the poor quality)

 

[DJ_K666]

Okay so ignoring my idea of Marine becoming Platform 3 of Harbour (which was just a suggestion for interest sake), looking at the entire Newhaven situation...

Just looking at Google maps shows that Newhaven Harbour is only 500 meters from Newhaven Town, which as another contributor has pointed out, is more convenient for ferry connections anyway. With numbers of passengers using the station plummeting to around half of what they were when Marine 'closed' and still on the down - what is the point in this station anyway? With the other station so close up the line then really if it closes it would not affect anyone.
What are your thoughts?

Harbour is more convenient for some of the industrial premises further down Dolphin Road. I know if I was still working for the bus company I'd get off at Harbour for the depot there. I'd be mightily miffed at Southern and NR (as if I needed another excuse in Southern's case. The company that isn't fit to even say that name) if I had to walk another 500 yards unnecessarily. Harbour is handy for that, at least.

 

[BS56]

How did the resignalling go ? Did everything go as planned .

 

[Islineclear3_1]

How did the resignalling go ? Did everything go as planned .

Yes, the switchover happened

 

[trainmania100]

The aggregate terminal looks like it's coming along well as well, lots of work going on in the beach area. Probably won't be long til the marine freight starts running

 

[Islineclear3_1]

I'm curious as to what the engineering works are for today in the Lewes area and Seaford branch. Thought all the work had finished. Does anyone know what they are please?

 

[trainmania100]

Some DB Cargo route learning / refreshment paths in for Monday to Newhaven day aggregates.
Not pathed to marine siding though but to town yard instead, guessing it's to train a few more drivers up in preparation for the marine flow. Don't forget that dB still work Thursday ash train from Newhaven to Acton .

0X30 Hither Green to Newhaven Day Aggregates
https://live.rail-record.co.uk/train?c=75036&d=30/12/2019

0Z31 Newhaven Day Aggregates to Gatwick Airport
https://live.rail-record.co.uk/train?c=75042&d=30/12/2019

0Z32 Gatwick Airport to Newhaven Day Aggregates
https://live.rail-record.co.uk/train?c=75046&d=30/12/2019

0Z33 Newhaven Day Aggregates to Hither Green PAD
https://live.rail-record.co.uk/train?c=75062&d=30/12/2019

 

[Islineclear3_1]

Thanks for posting. That'll be 2 to catch in daylight if they run...

 

[trainmania100]

Apologies for the poor shot, find attached 66154 at Newhaven harbour. I saw the southbound at Lewes because timings showed to Newhaven day aggs only but had to rush to Newhaven when I saw it went into Newhaven marine instead!
Hopefully comes back so I can get better shot at marine

 

[trainmania100]

Please also find below my video of it going into and out of marine along with an attached picture of it coming out of marine siding, hopefully won't be long til the terminal is ready