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GBRf to buy Colas 47s

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TimboM

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Thanks for the info.

0M68 was an STP as it's Tuesday and it normally only runs on Sunday/Monday.

Living quite local to Bescot I get to see the loco off this quite regular on a Sunday. But not today as obviously dark and weather is quite poor in Birmingham at present. 66779 would be nice though.

Of course another STP could go in from Hams Hall, only a thought though. Locos have worked without showing on RTT. The last delivery of 70's from Crewe to Bescot immediately springs to mind. No one knew where they were until sightings were logged in other ways. Waited at Bescot for hours for those, not knowing if it was running or not.

This working could be a total surprise tomorrow then or predictable

Wait with baited breath as they say.
I understand two of those above 66s are now at Bescot (not the EWS ones and not 779 I'm afraid) - so that could be one for the "normal" duties and one for 0Z47... will find out in the morning!
 
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Mag_seven

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I understand two of those above 66s are now at Bescot (not the EWS ones and not 779 I'm afraid) - so that could be one for the "normal" duties and one for 0Z47... will find out in the morning!

66717 looks like the loco for 0Z47 - to be confirmed later.

EDIT: Confirmed as 66717.
 
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TimboM

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66717 looks like the loco for 0Z47 - to be confirmed later.

EDIT: Confirmed as 66717.
Ever reliable TOPS is reporting it as 47739 that is the ex-Duff that's now been collected by 66717 and en route to Eastleigh.
 

TimboM

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Some additional info from a couple of reliable sources elsewhere:

47739 is now at Eastleigh for new livery - most probably 'standard' GBRf colours

47727's overhaul by Boden Rail at Washwood Heath is well underway and estimated to be completed mid/end of this month - it is already in Midnight Teal. Once released (and possibly subject to a bit of testing) it will go to Scotland to take over on the Sleeper support work from 47749

47749 will then go to Eastleigh for repainting - again most probably GBRf colours
 

cj_1985

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This probably seems irrelevant in the grand scheme of things, but does anyone know whether the plates on 47749 were included in the sale/purchase, or have they just not been removed due to the fact that the loco is/was away from 'home'.
I doubt the plates from the other 2x would be part of the sale/purchase as AIUI they were names of current/retired staff.... and we know the plates from 47739 were removed and fitted to 56049.
 

TimboM

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This probably seems irrelevant in the grand scheme of things, but does anyone know whether the plates on 47749 were included in the sale/purchase, or have they just not been removed due to the fact that the loco is/was away from 'home'.
I doubt the plates from the other 2x would be part of the sale/purchase as AIUI they were names of current/retired staff.... and we know the plates from 47739 were removed and fitted to 56049.
I’d be a little surprised if nameplates were explicitly covered in the sale/purchase agreement - probably something more about the loco’s general condition.

739 was still in Colas’ hands at the time of the sale and the name was important to them (and not GBRf) so stacks up the name plates and transferred to 56049.

749 was in GBRf hands at the point of sale and is carrying the loco’s original name, so I can’t see Colas wanting the nameplates back or GBRf wanting particularly to get rid of them.

727 is being reliveried and bar the initially hired-in 67s in CS livery, no loco so far in the Sleeper livery has been named, so possible 47727 will stay that way (unnamed) for now.
 

Domh245

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bar the initially hired-in 67s in CS livery, no loco so far in the Sleeper livery has been named, so possible 47727 will stay that way (unnamed) for now.

[pedant]Other than 86101 "Sir William A Stanier FRS", 86401 "Mons Meg", and 87002 "Royal Sovereign" you mean?[/pedant]
 

BRX

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Which unit move contracts are these expected to be used on? To/from Derby?
 

cj_1985

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So fair to assume it's for the movement of Aventras to GA and SWR...?

Still seems strange to buy, outright, these 47s rather than just hire them from the likes of HNRC.
ISTR someone telling me that they had read part of an interview with John Smith, where it was indicated than any 'used' traction would be sourced in such a way... Obviously for the sake of argument, GBRf don't consider the 66/0s to be used
 

TimboM

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Still seems strange to buy, outright, these 47s rather than just hire them from the likes of HNRC.
ISTR someone telling me that they had read part of an interview with John Smith, where it was indicated than any 'used' traction would be sourced in such a way... Obviously for the sake of argument, GBRf don't consider the 66/0s to be used
I think the key parameter for GBRf/John Smith in expanding their traction options (e.g. buying these 47s and the 66s, reinstating the 92s etc.) is that it makes business/commercial sense for GBRf.

If you look a these three 47s, the only real use they'd had over the past year or so was on the Sleeper support work at Polmadie - firstly 739, then 749; with 727 stored all that time. After 749 and 739 swapped on the "beds support" role last Spring I believe 739 only made two round trips from/to Washwood Heath for loco moves. GBRf really have been the only FOC using, or planning to use, these 47s for the past year or so.

Not sure who made the first move, but somewhere along the line having the 3x 47s made sense to GBRf's traction options (i.e. for this new contract). 2 were serviceable and the third already undergoing overhaul for a return to traffic which helped too vs some other options. Colas had little use for them, and as above GBRf were the only people using them. Evidently a price was agreed that Colas were happy with in terms of selling in effect surplus locos which there were only going to get hire revenue from but would still need to maintain etc. and that GBRf were happy with as a more attractive option to continually hiring locos for a relatively long-term contract.

Whilst I wouldn't say I was expecting it to happen, the deal works well for both Colas and GBRf and made a lot of sense to me.
 

Far north 37

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I think the key parameter for GBRf/John Smith in expanding their traction options (e.g. buying these 47s and the 66s, reinstating the 92s etc.) is that it makes business/commercial sense for GBRf.

If you look a these three 47s, the only real use they'd had over the past year or so was on the Sleeper support work at Polmadie - firstly 739, then 749; with 727 stored all that time. After 749 and 739 swapped on the "beds support" role last Spring I believe 739 only made two round trips from/to Washwood Heath for loco moves. GBRf really have been the only FOC using, or planning to use, these 47s for the past year or so.

Not sure who made the first move, but somewhere along the line having the 3x 47s made sense to GBRf's traction options (i.e. for this new contract). 2 were serviceable and the third already undergoing overhaul for a return to traffic which helped too vs some other options. Colas had little use for them, and as above GBRf were the only people using them. Evidently a price was agreed that Colas were happy with in terms of selling in effect surplus locos which there were only going to get hire revenue from but would still need to maintain etc. and that GBRf were happy with as a more attractive option to continually hiring locos for a relatively long-term contract.

Whilst I wouldn't say I was expecting it to happen, the deal works well for both Colas and GBRf and made a lot of sense to me.
With colas losing the boston steel job to dbs i think that was one of there main flows under colas was it?
 

cj_1985

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Are the 47s just to receive new dellner coupling equipment , or will they receive other mods, like the (iirc) cooler group mods carried out on DRS's 47s and 57s??

I mean the ventilation vent work replacing the slats with the open mesh set up as used on 57/3 and 57/6s
 

TimboM

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Possible plans are in place for 47727's release from Barrow Hill and move to Craigentinny on Friday...?

0Z22 Barrow Hill L.I.P. to Barrow Hill L.I.P. via Doncaster Down Decoy (possible test run)
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/R03830/2018/03/23/advanced


0Z47 1350 Barrow Hill L.I.P. to Craigentinny T.&R.S.M.D
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/R00649/2018/03/23/advanced

Although there's also an 0Z47 path going the other way tomorrow (Wed) - possibly 47749? Although 47749 might be needed again on the beds tonight, so this may not happen...

0Z47 0748 Craigentinny T.&R.S.M.D to Barrow Hill L.I.P.
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/R00648/2018/03/21/advanced
 
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whhistle

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Yes correct, I suspect you can go to the moon on your old knackered push bike if you had the money, however my point is you can't on cost grounds and nothing to do with the wibble being posted on here.
It's about pedantry here though; Unless you specify everything someone will call you out.

What you should have said is "it's not econimically viable to fit delner couplers..." - perhaps @headshot119 was thinking physically (as in, on the loco), which would make them right.
 

ScottDarg

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Few updates on these since the last post:

47727: Left Barrow Hill and ran up to Polmadie yesterday with 86101 in tow. Posts elsewhere suggesting it'll be making its debut on the Carstairs portion of the Lowlander Sleeper tonight (1C11/1B26).

47739: No visible progress - pic on Facebook that I believe was taken today shows it still in this position and still in Colas colours: https://flic.kr/p/HyL9h1

47749: Sat in the corner at Peterborough after failing on 'The York Moors Venturer' tour on 21/04/2018: https://flic.kr/p/25tospW
 

Scotrail84

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Few updates on these since the last post:

47727: Left Barrow Hill and ran up to Polmadie yesterday with 86101 in tow. Posts elsewhere suggesting it'll be making its debut on the Carstairs portion of the Lowlander Sleeper tonight (1C11/1B26).

47739: No visible progress - pic on Facebook that I believe was taken today shows it still in this position and still in Colas colours: https://flic.kr/p/HyL9h1

47749: Sat in the corner at Peterborough after failing on 'The York Moors Venturer' tour on 21/04/2018: https://flic.kr/p/25tospW

It is on 1C11. Dark livery
 

ScottDarg

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Been a while since this thread was active, and the naming of 47727 makes this a good time to give an update on the trio.

47727: CS Stag Logo was applied in the last week or so and it was named 'Edinburgh Castle' at Glasgow Queen St less than an hour ago. It's also worked 1M11 out of Glasgow Central since the last post: https://flic.kr/p/27vUwn5

47739: No visible progress on this one - still at Eastleigh in Colas colours as of 23/05: http://www.carlswatson.com/Trains/Galleries 2018/Galleries 201805/20180523ArlingtonEastleighWorks/eastleighworks23rdmay20182.html

47749: Now at Leicester L.I.P.: https://flic.kr/p/KCuGHf
 
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