GBRf Trialling Commuter Trains for NHS Supplies

[BenW390Fan]

GB Railfreight trials express delivery trains for vital NHS supplies - GB Railfreight Limited

GB Railfreight, one of the UK’s largest rail freight operators, has successfully trialled using former commuter trains for the express delivery of parcels. A service was run into Euston station earlier this month using a 100mph, Class 319, EMU train, which until recently was providing commuter...

www.gbrailfreight.com

As seen here, seems like they're using 319's from the looks of it.

"GB Railfreight, one of the UK’s largest rail freight operators, has successfully trialled using former commuter trains for the express delivery of parcels. A service was run into Euston station earlier this month using a 100mph, Class 319, EMU train, which until recently was providing commuter services in the West Midlands.

The trial showed the trains could successfully be loaded and offloaded with standard roll cages at most mainline stations across the UK and when seats are removed the carriages can carry significant volumes of parcels.

This is the first time that successful trial of using a converted commuter train has been undertaken in the UK and GB Railfreight is in discussion with Government about how the service could play a role in helping with the logistical challenge of delivering supplies to UK hospitals."

 

[A0wen]

Best use for a 319 by far.....

 

[185143]

Probably the best use for a 319!

Can see the headlines now, "Passengers in the North West forced to endure cast off trains London uses for PARCELS!"...

 

[BenW390Fan]

Best use for a 319 by far.....

Probably the best use for a 319!

Can see the headlines now, "Passengers in the North West forced to endure cast off trains London uses for PARCELS!"...

I loved them as passenger stock, probably my favourite EMU. Although I suppose it's better than them going to scrap!

 

[Iskra]

It’s a good use of otherwise redundant units and it’s a massive potential growth area. I’m assuming most trains would have to run at night though due to pathing and platform capacity issues.

 

[StephenHunter]

When the 319s were introduced, they had a section for parcels in fact.

 

[PeterC]

It’s a good use of otherwise redundant units and it’s a massive potential growth area. I’m assuming most trains would have to run at night though due to pathing and platform capacity issues.

Not an issue at the moment but once services get back to normal we will be back to all the issues raised in various threads about using old EMUs for parcels.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

A very good use of existing assets and yes, when introduced, the then DTSO(B) on the 319/0s had a small section between the cab and vestibule with longitudinal tip-up seats that could be secured (via a lockable door) for parcels use - however I rarely saw this in practice

Perhaps a couple of 377's in Southernland could be mustered up for this purpose - or even any spare 700s?

 

[PeterC]

A very good use of existing assets and yes, when introduced, the then DTSO(B) on the 319/0s had a small section between the cab and vestibule with longitudinal tip-up seats that could be secured (via a lockable door) for parcels use - however I rarely saw this in practice

Perhaps a couple of 377's in Southernland could be mustered up for this purpose - or even any spare 700s?

I thought that the lockable compartment was intended primarily for Royal Mail rather than general parcels.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

I thought that the lockable compartment was intended primarily for Royal Mail rather than general parcels.

My memory is a bit vague but yes, I suspect you're right. But I rarely ever saw it being used in practice

 

[westcoaster]

I thought that the lockable compartment was intended primarily for Royal Mail rather than general parcels.

Also had this on 321/4's, there was a switch in the cab labelled DPIS (deisolate parcel interlocking section). Lit up the out of use lights by the passenger doors, and above the internal door.

 

[Shimbleshanks]

Another day, another short-term rail freight trial...

 

[Iskra]

I wonder if this is successfully implemented, if it could be a catalyst for Royal Mail to run (additional) similar services?

 

[Islineclear3_1]

I wonder if this is successfully implemented, if it could be a catalyst for Royal Mail to run (additional) similar services?

Royal Mail did use to run services in specially liveried stock. But I believe a robbery from a Post-Office liveried MLV put a stop to it

 

[PeterC]

I wonder if this is successfully implemented, if it could be a catalyst for Royal Mail to run (additional) similar services?

Two problems:
1. Move to regional processing centres away from the rail network
2. Lack of handling facilities at stations.

 

[StephenHunter]

You can use trolleys and wheel them out to waiting vans.

 

[gazthomas]

I wonder if this is an attempt to shut down Varamis or to develop a concept with clear opportunity for growth with multi-vendors?

 

[gazthomas]

Another day, another short-term rail freight trial...

I think Shimbeshanks would be a great name for such a service. "I'm just going to Shimbleshanks my stuffed ferret to Aunty Nelly in Doncaster"

 

[Aictos]

Also had this on 321/4's, there was a switch in the cab labelled DPIS (deisolate parcel interlocking section). Lit up the out of use lights by the passenger doors, and above the internal door.

Believe the Class 317s also had this on the Great Northern too.

I thought that the lockable compartment was intended primarily for Royal Mail rather than general parcels.

Actually it was used for both Red Star and Royal Mail: http://dysgraphyk.madasafish.com/156/class156_interior.htm

 

[Meerkat]

provide online retailers with a more sustainable and reliable options for overnight parcel deliveries,

Isn’t road more reliable than rail overnight? Roads are open 24/7, rarely totally closed for repairs (and easier to divert if they are) and traffic is no problem, even into city centres.
i just can’t see it making sense unless the client has a siding in their premises at at least one end, you are adding handling, and increasing your staffed locations.

 

[StephenHunter]

Depends on distance. From London to Edinburgh, rail will always be faster.

 

[Tom B]

Regarding capacity, if the 'new normal' post covid involved less commuter traffic (increased wfh) - perhaps some paths may be available?

 

[Meerkat]

Depends on distance. From London to Edinburgh, rail will always be faster.

If speed matters they will fly it.

 

[StephenHunter]

That costs more. Also, you have to get it to and from the airport.

 

[AM9]

Probably the best use for a 319!

Can see the headlines now, "Passengers in the North West forced to endure cast off trains London uses for PARCELS!"...

Surely now it would be: "parcels for North-West hospitals relegated to cast-off London trains!", followed with some inference that London hospitals get their supplies hand delivered via Harrods.

 

[Meerkat]

That costs more. Also, you have to get it to and from the airport.

Does it? The big firms will have a set up using the airport for a wide area.
Either you are only sending Edinburgh parcels by train, in which case you need to sort them near the station and have a split model, or you are trucking the wide area’s parcels into the City Centre.

I just don’t think it works unless you build your whole system around rail connected sorting hubs. Like Royal Mail did...but even then they barely use it any more.
Their best hope is to get someone to offer a separate ‘green‘ service for firms needing some greenwash.
The obvious candidates might be UKG/SG capital to capital, but I dont know how much actually gets sent around any more.

 

[jagardner1984]

I would have thought the obvious use case would be Anglo Scottish Parcel traffic tied to one of the parcel networks. Train berthed in Glasgow/London mid evening. Parcels collected from Parcelshops / Lockers by Road, separated into Roll cages of West Midlands / Edinburgh / Glasgow. Vehicle access onto platforms. Roll cages onto appropriate cars of the train. Southbound departs Glasgow 11 ish to Edinburgh. Picks up more parcels. Onto London via intermediate stop near Midlands hub (virtually all courier networks have a Midlands Hub). Exchange of Roll Cages and onwards to London / Scotland. Stock capable of running via ECML or WCML. Arrival 4/5am and unload to waiting trucks, onwards to hubs.

With stock not usable for passenger service, minimal interaction en route, not requiring any additional station opening (with possible exception of the Midlands stop) and ability to follow the route of the sleeper for maintenance etc, and numerous companies requiring Green PR releases (Amazon etc), maybe some market/funding for a limited trial ? The lines of hub to hub HGV traffic on the M74 would suggest the traffic is there, at least.

 

[Meerkat]

I would have thought the obvious use case would be Anglo Scottish Parcel traffic tied to one of the parcel networks. Train berthed in Glasgow/London mid evening. Parcels collected from Parcelshops / Lockers by Road, separated into Roll cages of West Midlands / Edinburgh / Glasgow. Vehicle access onto platforms. Roll cages onto appropriate cars of the train. Southbound departs Glasgow 11 ish to Edinburgh. Picks up more parcels. Onto London via intermediate stop near Midlands hub (virtually all courier networks have a Midlands Hub). Exchange of Roll Cages and onwards to London / Scotland. Stock capable of running via ECML or WCML. Arrival 4/5am and unload to waiting trucks, onwards to hubs.

With stock not usable for passenger service, minimal interaction en route, not requiring any additional station opening (with possible exception of the Midlands stop) and ability to follow the route of the sleeper for maintenance etc, and numerous companies requiring Green PR releases (Amazon etc), maybe some market/funding for a limited trial ? The lines of hub to hub HGV traffic on the M74 would suggest the traffic is there, at least.

That’s a lot of handling, and mixing of different companies parcels outside their control.

 

[Romsey]

Two problems:
1. Move to regional processing centres away from the rail network
2. Lack of handling facilities at stations.

Which is why Post Office terminals were built at Tonbridge, Low Fell(Newcastle), Warrington, Willesden RM terminal and a few other locations. Some postal traffic was handled when there was minimal passenger traffic, examples which come to mind are Redhill, Coventry and Derby. New terminals would be needed at some places or platforms with road access adapted at stations which are suitably located.

Any designated parcel service would need to be planned from first principles as much of the infrastructure like the mailbag carriers at Bristol TM and Redhill have been demolished and postal sorting offices (Exeter, Bristol, Reading are ones which I can remember) have been moved to out of town locations.

Just to push the concept further, would there be separate trains for each parcel carrier or would it be open access and DHL, PO Parcels, Amazon etc reserve space on scheduled train services?

UPS is considering rail transport instead of air freight in Europe
https://www.railwaygazette.com/poli...ift-from-air-to-high-speed-rail/56195.article

Once the services are in the WTT and established, they would become part of the engineering planning process. It's already done for sleeper services and important freight flows. It's no different to only blocking the B&H or Swindon overnight to allow a route for the GW sleepers and Mendip stone or two line only blocks on the WCML or Brighton Main Line.

 

[pdeaves]

would there be separate trains for each parcel carrier or would it be open access and DHL, PO Parcels, Amazon etc reserve space on scheduled train services?

No reason why it couldn't be one train for many customers, just the same as a container train can carry boxes for many customers.