Go North East

[kez19]

The one thing I will credit GNE as an outsider is in terms they were far ahead than my local up north.

Examples: mobile app (qr code?) as well as real time tracking, buses have WiFi and usb and have updated buses (I use xplore Dundee), for me locally have more rust buckets, just getting some new buses with WiFi and USB’s on board (app use was show active time onscreen) and have got real time tracking - seems to me at least one bus company is well ahead than my bus service

Xplore Dundee was up until recently ran by National Express but is now under McGills (whether they will invest in newer buses is debatable)

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The one thing I will credit GNE as an outsider is in terms they were far ahead than my local up north.

Go North East has been ahead of the competition for some time.

Stagecoach Busways are perhaps best described as competent, though it feels like that's damning with faint praise. There's been a bit of network development with the X24 and, further back, with the X47 (helped by Kickstart money) and they introduced gas buses to Sunderland. They're just a solid, if slightly dull, operator.

However, Arriva North East is really a shadow of what it was. Compare to 20 years ago, and they've been ousted for the most part from East Durham; they were the main operator in Peterlee and now are reduced to running in from Durham and Darlington. Even in Durham, the operations aren't what they were. There was a noticeable absence of investment in the mid-noughties (plus general apathy) that emboldened Peter Huntley to embark on a strategy to steal their lunch. GNE purchased some smaller outfits (Northumbrian Coaches, Jayline) to support the attack on Arriva; an attack that they didn't know was happening such was their complacency.

Now the retirement of Steve Noble from Arriva brought Jonathan May instead. In fairness, he had a lot to sort out; some moves were good (vehicle investment) and some not so good (more depot closures and service cuts). A lot was made about the peace being made and secret conversations, but Huntley had outmaneuvered Arriva and got the Tyne Valley operations from them, as well as getting East Durham by default. Peter Huntley did a real job on Arriva, and did a lot of good work on areas such as branding. The fleet had some investment too but there was also quite a lot of old London/Oxford/Brighton stuff as well.

Again, there were management changes. Peter Huntley left GNE and handed over to Kevin Carr, but PH sadly died in a climbing accident. Kevin Carr, being a Northern General veteran with an engineering background, back to look at things from a more operational viewpoint, and that probably explained why a substantial number of brands were discontinued in favour of all over red Northern or the later red and blue. There were still some developments like the introduction of the Tynedale Express again the Stagecoach/Arriva 685. Similarly, under a new team of Nigel Featham and Nick Knox, Arriva seemed to be steadier and was looking to both improve their offer with changes to the Northumberland routes and introducing Sapphire and MAX brands plus some continued investment through the early to mid 2010s.

However, and I confess I don't get back to the homeland like I did (and certainly not in 2020!) but it feels a bit like a re-run of 15 years ago. GNE are busy upgrading their offer on routes and expanding, ever so slightly, over Arriva territory, such as extending the X21 to West Auckland. The gulf in quality between GNE and Arriva is pretty pronounced - between West Auckland and Durham, with 4 year old Streetdecks vs Arriva's mix of 13 plate Pulsars and a few new e400s in Sapphire garb. Between Durham and Newcastle, it's older Pulsars and Geminis to MAX spec vs GNE, whilst the Hexham to Newcastle (via West Road) sees new GNE e400mmcs vs 14 year old Arriva Omnicities. In fact, you go to Durham and it is beginning to feel more like GNE territory than Arriva!

GNE are a good firm. Not perfect, and they do make mistakes but a good outfit. Arriva has a collection of half decent vehicles (but ageing), no investment for 4 years in new fleet, and a range of liveries including original Cotswold (yes, still), the later Arriva aqua, the "new" livery, then the subs of Sapphire, MAX and Frequenta all appearing with the premium ones now looking rather tired, and seemingly, bereft of direction.

 

[overthewater]

The best brand they ever did up in Go Ahead north east was "Whey Aye Five O" Which has to be rather clever with locals. I think they have cut back too much on the brands.

Go North East 5258 NK56KJN in Chester le Street with a 50 service bound for Durham.

Explore Gobbiner's 12940 photos on Flickr!

flic.kr

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The best brand they ever did up in Go Ahead north east was "Whey Aye Five O" Which has to be rather clever with locals. I think they have cut back too much on the brands.

Go North East 5258 NK56KJN in Chester le Street with a 50 service bound for Durham.

Explore Gobbiner's 12940 photos on Flickr!

flic.kr

As with all of these things, there's a bit of a balance to be struck.

This is one of the brands that I thought did resonate. I also though the Fab 56 and Fab 57 with their grooviness and flower power caught the eye, as did Red Kite. I actually agree with some of what @MackTen said - some of those that have gone did work and it's a shame to see some of them disappear. Especially when they have been replaced by stuff like City Rider, City Link and Coast & Country - stuff that is so anodyne and bland. There were some duff ones in there as well in the Huntley days as we've discussed at length.

It might be worth a thread of its own.... how many different brands with the word "City" can be recalled around the UK? Let alone how many with the word "Coaster" in them? I think Pulse might even have had a few incarnations around the UK!

 

[Andyh82]

I think normally when Best Impressions get deployed, they are introducing branding where previously there was a bland boring operation. This doesn't apply to GNE which is why I think it was a retrograde step

But as I've said before, introducing Ray Stenning's flair at EYMS has worked really well, as they had nothing before hand

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I think normally when Best Impressions get deployed, they are introducing branding where previously there was a bland boring operation. This doesn't apply to GNE which is why I think it was a retrograde step

But as I've said before, introducing Ray Stenning's flair at EYMS has worked really well, as they had nothing before hand

I think that true in part. We've been over the ground on X Lines (and don't wish to repeat) but it was a change to introduce, rightly or wrongly, a different identity over certain links. There were losses such as Red Kite and Red Arrows, brands that seemed to resonate whilst others like Castles Express or X9/X10 seemed less effective. So I think it's a bit mixed.

That's just the branding; there's the interiors and the timetable publicity as well so BI do bring quite a bit than just a paint job.

Voltra is fair enough - would seem odd not to rebrand and make something of the new electric vehicles. Crusader is a quite nice update on the older scheme. QuayCity and Cityrider - yeah, don't think they're a step forward on what was there before. I think overall, it's a "net gain" but it isn't uniform and, as you say, GNE weren't in a bad place to begin with.

 

[cnjb8]

As with all of these things, there's a bit of a balance to be struck.

This is one of the brands that I thought did resonate. I also though the Fab 56 and Fab 57 with their grooviness and flower power caught the eye, as did Red Kite. I actually agree with some of what @MackTen said - some of those that have gone did work and it's a shame to see some of them disappear. Especially when they have been replaced by stuff like City Rider, City Link and Coast & Country - stuff that is so anodyne and bland. There were some duff ones in there as well in the Huntley days as we've discussed at length.

It might be worth a thread of its own.... how many different brands with the word "City" can be recalled around the UK? Let alone how many with the word "Coaster" in them? I think Pulse might even have had a few incarnations around the UK!

While I do agree the Fab 56/57 are vibrant, I didn't particularly like the brand and livery

 

[kez19]

While I do agree the Fab 56/57 are vibrant, I didn't particularly like the brand and livery

What happened to the 57? I have been familar with the 56? Did the routes merge?

 

[Anvil1984]

What happened to the 57? I have been familar with the 56? Did the routes merge?

it became part of Citylink instead of the Fab.. brand. Basically at the time of the change the 57 took over the Citylink 58s route East of Newcastle to Hadrian Park. Then it was curtailed back at Newcastle with the rest being replaced by a Cobalt and Coast (or whatever it is) branded service 311

 

[kez19]

it became part of Citylink instead of the Fab.. brand. Basically at the time of the change the 57 took over the Citylink 58s route East of Newcastle to Hadrian Park. Then it was curtailed back at Newcastle with the rest being replaced by a Cobalt and Coast (or whatever it is) branded service 311

aah right got you now, I can understand it can get a muddled even for an outsider!

 

[cnjb8]

Apparently the B9s at Deptford in GNE livery that are covering for the Cityrider refurbs, will replace the remaining Scania OmniDekkas in daily frontline work, such as ones at Chester-le-Street on 13/25 and Percy Main on the DFDS contract.
Does anyone know what the plan is for 93/94? Will they use the former Toon Link B9s?

 

[kez19]

I noticed that the Little Pinks has appeared...

*not my photo/not been to area (source Flickr/credit photographer)

684 Go North East Optare Solo SR on Little Pinks Service 83

Repainted from Indigo and into a new brand called Little Pinks which replaces the Indigo brand at Washington depot seen here in Concord on Little Pinks Service 83 to Washington Galleries © All rights reserved. Images are copyrighted to myself. Photographs lifted from my photostream and being...

www.flickr.com

Also I may add it must be weird when (photo is dated 2012 and again credit photographer), seeing a Brighton bus appear in Newcastle advertising the Brighton area route!

Go North East - 0441 - BG61SXS - GoNorthEast20121115

Volvo B5LH - Wright Eclipse Gemini 2 Go North East

www.flickr.com

 

[tbtc]

Arriva North East is really a shadow of what it was. Compare to 20 years ago, and they've been ousted for the most part from East Durham; they were the main operator in Peterlee and now are reduced to running in from Durham and Darlington. Even in Durham, the operations aren't what they were. There was a noticeable absence of investment in the mid-noughties (plus general apathy) that emboldened Peter Huntley to embark on a strategy to steal their lunch. GNE purchased some smaller outfits (Northumbrian Coaches, Jayline) to support the attack on Arriva; an attack that they didn't know was happening such was their complacency

It'd be interesting to see a map of where the operators were at deregulation/ millennium to compare to now - I've mentioned this before but I've always struggled with the pattern of "United" vs "Northern General" vs "Busways" operations in that neck of the woods. For example, South Shields was part of "Busways", whilst North Shields/ Whitley Bay were split between "United" and "Northern General" along the Coast Road - it always felt like much more of a muddle than other regions.

Other regions have their apparent contradictions (e.g. all the urban operations in big places in West Yorkshire were part of Yorkshire Rider apart from Wakefield, all of the urban operations in big places in South Yorkshire were part of SYT apart from Barnsley), but generally the overlapping areas in north east England have always seemed a bit messier to me than elsewhere.

The map of the North East has been complicated by purchasing of other operators (OK Travel, the Northumbrian ones that you mention above too). It certainly looks like GNE have a much stronger set of operations, they've kept their heads above water whilst Stagecoach seem to have stagnated (other than the X24, and I guess the 22 has expanded their operational area slightly in Newcastle?) and Arriva seem to have gone some distance backwards.

 

[Anvil1984]

It'd be interesting to see a map of where the operators were at deregulation/ millennium to compare to now - I've mentioned this before but I've always struggled with the pattern of "United" vs "Northern General" vs "Busways" operations in that neck of the woods. For example, South Shields was part of "Busways", whilst North Shields/ Whitley Bay were split between "United" and "Northern General" along the Coast Road - it always felt like much more of a muddle than other regions.

Other regions have their apparent contradictions (e.g. all the urban operations in big places in West Yorkshire were part of Yorkshire Rider apart from Wakefield, all of the urban operations in big places in South Yorkshire were part of SYT apart from Barnsley), but generally the overlapping areas in north east England have always seemed a bit messier to me than elsewhere.

The map of the North East has been complicated by purchasing of other operators (OK Travel, the Northumbrian on es that you mention above too). It certainly looks like GNE have a much stronger set of operations, they've kept their heads above water whilst Stagecoach seem to have stagnated (other than the X24, and I guess the 22 has expanded their operational area slightly in Newcastle?) and Arriva seem to have gone some distance backwards.

To be honest that's a fair summary especially with Arriva. I don't think that much has changed since the early to mid 90's (except maybe Tyne Valley and Peterlee). There have been times where things have altered for a short period for example Go North East buying Northumbria Coaches to challenge Arriva with a "Bargain Bus" brand but that got changed with Go North East swapping those routes for Hexham based routes so that Arriva kept their stronghold in that part of Northumberland. I believe Go North East abandoned Bishop Auckland handing those routes to Arriva but could be remembering it slightly wrong

Tyne and Wears blurred lines probably are just historical pre-dating deregulation. Tyneside PTE which turned into Tyne and Wear PTE only operated routes formerly operated by Newcastle, South Shields and Sunderland Corporations which turned into Busways and now Stagecoach. The NBC still had control of ex Gateshead and District, Sunderland and District, Tynemouth and District and Tyneside Omnibus areas which all became Northern General (- Go Ahead Northern - Go North East). United had NBC depots in Whitley Bay, Jesmond and Newcastle which on deregulation went to Northumbria then became Arriva. Obviously things are going to be blurred where in places like South Shields you have an NBC depot and a PTE depot and in a lot of places where the NBC were operating services for the PTE in a hybrid livery. I know this happened in the other PTEs but was more obvious here

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

It'd be interesting to see a map of where the operators were at deregulation/ millennium to compare to now - I've mentioned this before but I've always struggled with the pattern of "United" vs "Northern General" vs "Busways" operations in that neck of the woods. For example, South Shields was part of "Busways", whilst North Shields/ Whitley Bay were split between "United" and "Northern General" along the Coast Road - it always felt like much more of a muddle than other regions.

Haven't a map but here it is (mainly)

Northumberland
Arriva vacated North Northumberland except for the main routes direct via A1, or via Bamburgh, to Berwick. Berwick operations were sold to Perrymans (now Borders Buses) and they closed that depot, Alnwick and the outstation at Wooler. In the Tyne Valley, they sold Hexham depot to Go Ahead as part of the deal for GNE to cease competitive services, retaining only the 685 to Carlisle. Services in South Northumberland are not too dissimilar though they have dropped a few routes around Cramlington (picked up by GNE) and the local services in most towns are now integrated into longer routes.

Co Durham
Arriva bought out both Stagecoach Darlington (effectively a monopoly there) and the former OK operations in Bishop. However, having bought GNE at Bishop, they have since given up all the routes except to Toft Hill and the main one to Cockfield & West Auckland, as well as keeping some of the traditional United routes to Darlington, Tow Law, Durham and Newton Aycliffe. However, even a number of their traditional routes (incl ones acquired with the TMS purchase in 1990) have disappeared in recent years, not helped by them closing Bishop depot and hence having some very complex interworking. The main beneficiaries have been Weardale, and Scarlet Band who also gained services in Teesdale when Arriva culled everything but the main route to Darlington. Around Durham City, the city services are much reduced but they still have the Deerness Valley routes. GNE have mopped up all the indies (Diamond, Gypsy Queen) but it's really out towards Peterlee where GNE have simply taken on the lesser services as Arriva have pulled out all but the main route to Peterlee. In Peterlee, again GNE have largely taken hold of everything except Arriva's main routes. Durham depot had an allocation c.65-70 in United days; it now is about 90 but that's after the closure of both Bishop and Peterlee depots.

Tyne and Wear
As you say, this was always more complex. Northumbria had the main routes into the Tyne Valley via Prudhoe. Everything else Gateshead side was GNE, same across through Jarrow and only in Sunderland and Shields did Stagecoach challenge that. North of the river, Newcastle was Stagecoach so the real complexity is, as always, with North Tyneside where the lines were blurred. As it is, Arriva pulled out of stuff like Whitley Bay locals (now Nexus tenders) but still operate through on the core 306/308 but GNE have consolidated their position so it's still quite mixed.

I'd imagine that Arriva NE is about half the size in terms of vehicles as it was when it was United (excl Scarborough) 35 years ago.

 

[MotCO]

Arriva bought out both Stagecoach Darlington (effectively a monopoly there) and the former OK operations in Bishop.

I had it in mind that Go Ahead bought out OK - am I wrong?

whilst Stagecoach seem to have stagnated (other than the X24,

Stagecoach also run the E routes in South Shields / Sunderland (E1, E2 and E6) amongst others.

 

[Anvil1984]

I had it in mind that Go Ahead bought out OK - am I wrong?



Stagecoach also run the E routes in South Shields / Sunderland (E1, E2 and E6) amongst others.

Go Ahead bought out OK Travel but in more recent times moved out and the area went over to Arriva

I’m pretty sure they know what routes Stagecoach operate, all they said was Stagecoach was stagnating ie not coming up with much new except for the X24

 

[NorthOxonian]

The map of the North East has been complicated by purchasing of other operators (OK Travel, the Northumbrian ones that you mention above too). It certainly looks like GNE have a much stronger set of operations, they've kept their heads above water whilst Stagecoach seem to have stagnated (other than the X24, and I guess the 22 has expanded their operational area slightly in Newcastle?) and Arriva seem to have gone some distance backwards.

Stagecoach have launched a few lower key changes in recent times. They ran an open top service along the seafront in North Tyneside in the summer of 2019, though this didn't return last summer. Despite being cut off from their other operations, it was relatively popular. Another (less successful) venture saw them extend one of their South Tyneside routes to Cobalt at peak times. That extension seemed to only carry fresh air, even before working from home decimated that flow, but you have to give them credit for trying.

The problem they've got is that they're quite penned in and don't really have a lot of options with where to innovate. Almost every route Stagecoach run in the North East is fairly short and urban (the 685, X24, X34, and 1/36 in Pools are the exceptions). Unlike Go North East, they don't really have the longer distance "flagship" routes where you can do an X Lines or a Gold.

 

[rg177]

I must say that the Stagecoach movements into North Tyneside have been useful for myself personally.

The 22 running through Silverlink and Howdon into Newcastle isn't the fastest route to town but provides access to the likes of Monument and Central Station without the need to walk or change modes. More relevant to now, it provides a direct link to the Centre for Life vaccination centre. Whether it's persuaded anyone away from Go North East remains to be seen, but the bizarre re-routing of the 41 so that it comes within touching distance of Hadrian Park (having looped around Howdon) only to then go all the way back to Wallsend first has probably encouraged a few to use the 22 for short journeys towards Howdon.

The 10/11 being extended through from South Shields and Jarrow (via the world) to Cobalt was an odd one. Yet, when work had me training in South Shields for a few weeks it was remarkably useful- connecting well with the Metro at Jarrow and having me in South Shields within about 35 minutes. It goes without saying though that aside from one regular who seemed to go from Cobalt to the Tyne Tunnel Trading Estate (a journey covered by the GNE 19) and v/v, I was the only passenger on that section.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I had it in mind that Go Ahead bought out OK - am I wrong?

Go Ahead bought OK Travel in 1995; OK had expanded massively. Problem was that they had a fleet of very old vehicles and needed to meet various requirements for TWPTE tenders so they needed to upgrade the fleet with a load of Merc 709s and B6s. At the same time, Go Ahead decided they'd had enough of various incursions and launched a competitive assault on the main 724 route from Newcastle to Bishop Auckland and extended to West Auckland (similar to now), as well as shorts from Bishop to West.

After cessation of hostilities, Go Ahead enquired on a sale but were rebuffed though they agreed that if they wished to sell, Go Ahead would have first refusal. This was also because there was a clause in one of the Emmerson wills (I think I've not dreamed this up) that precluded selling out to United! So Go Ahead bought them out, subsequently branding it as Go OK Travel; it was called something politically incorrect locally but I won't repeat that. The depots at Team Valley and Peterlee were subsequently absorbed into the Go NE depots in Chester le Street, Winlaton and Gateshead in the main, but Bishop was retained.

That was the position until 2006 and Go North East had really been drifting a bit as a business. They agreed the sale of the Bishop Auckland operations to Arriva but no assets. The depot was demolished and is now a car park. Arriva had to bring in a number of vehicles including ex Murkeyside B6s, resurrecting some Vectas out of store, some ex London Olympians, and a number of Metroriders freed by the closure of Richmond depot and withdrawal of most of those routes.

Go Ahead did retain the 724 though from Chester le Street depot and this is now the X21. Hope this helps

 

[kez19]

Go Ahead bought OK Travel in 1995; OK had expanded massively. Problem was that they had a fleet of very old vehicles and needed to meet various requirements for TWPTE tenders so they needed to upgrade the fleet with a load of Merc 709s and B6s. At the same time, Go Ahead decided they'd had enough of various incursions and launched a competitive assault on the main 724 route from Newcastle to Bishop Auckland and extended to West Auckland (similar to now), as well as shorts from Bishop to West.

After cessation of hostilities, Go Ahead enquired on a sale but were rebuffed though they agreed that if they wished to sell, Go Ahead would have first refusal. This was also because there was a clause in one of the Emmerson wills (I think I've not dreamed this up) that precluded selling out to United! So Go Ahead bought them out, subsequently branding it as Go OK Travel; it was called something politically incorrect locally but I won't repeat that. The depots at Team Valley and Peterlee were subsequently absorbed into the Go NE depots in Chester le Street, Winlaton and Gateshead in the main, but Bishop was retained.

That was the position until 2006 and Go North East had really been drifting a bit as a business. They agreed the sale of the Bishop Auckland operations to Arriva but no assets. The depot was demolished and is now a car park. Arriva had to bring in a number of vehicles including ex Murkeyside B6s, resurrecting some Vectas out of store, some ex London Olympians, and a number of Metroriders freed by the closure of Richmond depot and withdrawal of most of those routes.

Go Ahead did retain the 724 though from Chester le Street depot and this is now the X21. Hope this helps

I was going to ask this earlier but might as well, I did note on some pics on Flickr in terms of bus numbers, I wondered why numbers were so high but reading what you posted explains it!

 

[cnjb8]

Acquired by GoNorth East for the impending Euro 6 zone are:
Optare Versa YD63UZN
Yutong CB12 YH66VMO and YD70CDZ
The Levantes used on the X9/X10 are being sold to Ensign
EDIT:
Here is proof

Go North East: 8347 / YD63UZN

Go North East's Optare Versa V1110/Optare 8347 (YD63 UZN), which carries a plain white base livery, is pictured here in the yard at Riverside Depot, Gateshead, following delivery from Dawson Rentals. 06/03/21 New as a demonstrator vehicle for Optare in October 2013; this vehicle has served with...

www.flickr.com

Go North East: 5500 / YD70CDZ

Go North East's Yutong ZK6126HGA/Yutong CB12 5500 (YD70 CDZ), which carries a plain white base livery, is pictured here in the yard at Yutong's UK Pelican Engineering dealership, Castleford, whilst undergoing a full health check, prior to delivery to Go North East. 26/02/21 Go North East has...

www.flickr.com

 

[kez19]

Acquired by GoNorth East for the impending Euro 6 zone are:
Optare Versa YD63UZN
Yutong CB12 YH66VMO and YD70CBZ
The Levantes used on the X9/X10 are being sold to Ensign

I noticed there is a few pics on flickr in terms of the Versa/Yutong(s), GNE must have confidence in the Yutongs!

**credit to photgraphers


VERSA

Go North East: 8347 / YD63UZN

Go North East's Optare Versa V1110/Optare 8347 (YD63 UZN), which carries a plain white base livery, is pictured here in the yard at Riverside Depot, Gateshead, following delivery from Dawson Rentals. 06/03/21 New as a demonstrator vehicle for Optare in October 2013; this vehicle has served with...

www.flickr.com

YUTONGS

Go North East: 5500 / YD70CDZ

Go North East's Yutong ZK6126HGA/Yutong CB12 5500 (YD70 CDZ), which carries a plain white base livery, is pictured here in the yard at Yutong's UK Pelican Engineering dealership, Castleford, whilst undergoing a full health check, prior to delivery to Go North East. 26/02/21 Go North East has...

www.flickr.com

I notice on Flickr that GNE have a couple of other buses/coaches

Go North East: 7157 / YX14SFZ

Go North East's unallocated Volvo B9R/Plaxton Elite 7157 (YX14 SFZ), which carries a plain red base livery, is pictured here in the yard at Saltmeadows Road Depot, Gateshead, whilst freshly repainted. 05/03/21 This vehicle was new to and previously with East Yorkshire, as their fleet number 90...

www.flickr.com

Go North East: 6172 / YN57FYP

Explore danielgrahamm's 22115 photos on Flickr!

www.flickr.com

I notice the interior on 6172

https://www.flickr.com/photos/danie...Hw7PC-2kHzMXk-2kHyMyF-2kHyMvV-2kHxfaA-2kHxaSC - was this bus part of East Yorkshire originally and transfer to GNE or was it a former GNE (or Go Ahead vehicle?).

 

[cnjb8]

I noticed there is a few pics on flickr in terms of the Versa/Yutong(s), GNE must have confidence in the Yutongs!

**credit to photgraphers


VERSA

Go North East: 8347 / YD63UZN

Go North East's Optare Versa V1110/Optare 8347 (YD63 UZN), which carries a plain white base livery, is pictured here in the yard at Riverside Depot, Gateshead, following delivery from Dawson Rentals. 06/03/21 New as a demonstrator vehicle for Optare in October 2013; this vehicle has served with...

www.flickr.com

YUTONGS

Go North East: 5500 / YD70CDZ

Go North East's Yutong ZK6126HGA/Yutong CB12 5500 (YD70 CDZ), which carries a plain white base livery, is pictured here in the yard at Yutong's UK Pelican Engineering dealership, Castleford, whilst undergoing a full health check, prior to delivery to Go North East. 26/02/21 Go North East has...

www.flickr.com

I notice on Flickr that GNE have a couple of other buses/coaches

Go North East: 7157 / YX14SFZ

Go North East's unallocated Volvo B9R/Plaxton Elite 7157 (YX14 SFZ), which carries a plain red base livery, is pictured here in the yard at Saltmeadows Road Depot, Gateshead, whilst freshly repainted. 05/03/21 This vehicle was new to and previously with East Yorkshire, as their fleet number 90...

www.flickr.com

Go North East: 6172 / YN57FYP

Explore danielgrahamm's 22115 photos on Flickr!

www.flickr.com

I notice the interior on 6172

https://www.flickr.com/photos/danie...Hw7PC-2kHzMXk-2kHyMyF-2kHyMvV-2kHxfaA-2kHxaSC - was this bus part of East Yorkshire originally and transfer to GNE or was it a former GNE (or Go Ahead vehicle?).

6172 was new to Brighton & Hove, and transferred here on loan in September last year. A few months ago it was made a permanent member of the fleet.

 

[kez19]

6172 was new to Brighton & Hove, and transferred here on loan in September last year. A few months ago it was made a permanent member of the fleet.

Thanks for that, mind you it does make sense if it has a fleet number! (lol)

 

[robertclark125]

Haven't a map but here it is (mainly)

Northumberland
Arriva vacated North Northumberland except for the main routes direct via A1, or via Bamburgh, to Berwick. Berwick operations were sold to Perrymans (now Borders Buses) and they closed that depot, Alnwick and the outstation at Wooler. In the Tyne Valley, they sold Hexham depot to Go Ahead as part of the deal for GNE to cease competitive services, retaining only the 685 to Carlisle. Services in South Northumberland are not too dissimilar though they have dropped a few routes around Cramlington (picked up by GNE) and the local services in most towns are now integrated into longer routes.

Co Durham
Arriva bought out both Stagecoach Darlington (effectively a monopoly there) and the former OK operations in Bishop. However, having bought GNE at Bishop, they have since given up all the routes except to Toft Hill and the main one to Cockfield & West Auckland, as well as keeping some of the traditional United routes to Darlington, Tow Law, Durham and Newton Aycliffe. However, even a number of their traditional routes (incl ones acquired with the TMS purchase in 1990) have disappeared in recent years, not helped by them closing Bishop depot and hence having some very complex interworking. The main beneficiaries have been Weardale, and Scarlet Band who also gained services in Teesdale when Arriva culled everything but the main route to Darlington. Around Durham City, the city services are much reduced but they still have the Deerness Valley routes. GNE have mopped up all the indies (Diamond, Gypsy Queen) but it's really out towards Peterlee where GNE have simply taken on the lesser services as Arriva have pulled out all but the main route to Peterlee. In Peterlee, again GNE have largely taken hold of everything except Arriva's main routes. Durham depot had an allocation c.65-70 in United days; it now is about 90 but that's after the closure of both Bishop and Peterlee depots.

Tyne and Wear
As you say, this was always more complex. Northumbria had the main routes into the Tyne Valley via Prudhoe. Everything else Gateshead side was GNE, same across through Jarrow and only in Sunderland and Shields did Stagecoach challenge that. North of the river, Newcastle was Stagecoach so the real complexity is, as always, with North Tyneside where the lines were blurred. As it is, Arriva pulled out of stuff like Whitley Bay locals (now Nexus tenders) but still operate through on the core 306/308 but GNE have consolidated their position so it's still quite mixed.

I'd imagine that Arriva NE is about half the size in terms of vehicles as it was when it was United (excl Scarborough) 35 years ago.

Worth mentioning that United also had a depot at Toward Road, Sunderland. The site was recently demolished (2019 I think), and this depot wasn't for local services wholly within Tyne and Wear. Instead, it was for longer distance services from southern country Durham, and Cleveland, heading to Newcastle.

With regards to North Tyneside, I was first on holiday in Whitley Bay in 1991, and it was strange seeing a town being dominated by two ex NBC companies, Go Ahead Northern, and Northumbria. The latter had the bus station and depot there, but it seemed that North Tyneside should've been, logically, United territory, not split between both. I wonder if the NBC, during the splitting up of firms prior to deregulation, had thought about transferring the Northern depots at Wallsend and Percy Main to the new Northumbria company, as opposed to leaving them with Northern.

 

[Bwsbro]

I’ve been fortunate to use YH66VMO when it was a demonstrator in 2018, it was a lovely bus, the only downside is that theres only one panel for the side of the vehicle so could become expensive if needs replacing

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Worth mentioning that United also had a depot at Toward Road, Sunderland. The site was recently demolished (2019 I think), and this depot wasn't for local services wholly within Tyne and Wear. Instead, it was for longer distance services from southern country Durham, and Cleveland, heading to Newcastle.

Now you're getting on more historic complications in the North East. So.... there was an agreement in terms of territory between BET and Tilling about their respective subsidiaries. So United could not buy out firms in a certain territory so it had to be done by another entity, Durham District Services. This was a green liveried (rather than red) firm that operated as a sister to United but shared the same HQ etc and vehicles were transferred between fleets. They had their own depots and the one in Sunderland was built for DDS in the early 1960s to operate services that had been purchased with various acquisitions.

When the NBC was formed with the 1968 Transport Act, the need for DDS disappeared so it got folded into the main United fleet, services were renumbered, buses repainted etc. The depots in Durham and Darlington were closed and amalgamated into the United ones, whilst Ferryhill, Barnard Castle and Sunderland became United depots. Sunderland depot had a very small allocation of buses with 8 allocated there in the mid 1980s, though it was also a major coaching depot. The allocation was 7 Mk1/Mk2 Nationals and a solitary LH, and they did contribute to the services from Sunderland to Stockton (212), Darlington (213), Middlesbrough (214) and Coxhoe (218).

Once United sold their coaching ops, the depot was too small and closed in 1989, though three vehicles were outbased at the Busways depot for a while as an outstation of Peterlee.

With regards to North Tyneside, I was first on holiday in Whitley Bay in 1991, and it was strange seeing a town being dominated by two ex NBC companies, Go Ahead Northern, and Northumbria. The latter had the bus station and depot there, but it seemed that North Tyneside should've been, logically, United territory, not split between both. I wonder if the NBC, during the splitting up of firms prior to deregulation, had thought about transferring the Northern depots at Wallsend and Percy Main to the new Northumbria company, as opposed to leaving them with Northern.

Again, it was a historic quirk about BET buying up the Tynemouth company but a long time back. The late split of United was probably enough to worry about rather than splitting up Northern

 

[tbtc]

it was a historic quirk about BET buying up the Tynemouth company but a long time back. The late split of United was probably enough to worry about rather than splitting up Northern

I'm sure I'm not the only one enjoying @TheGrandWazoo 's history lessons here - it's fascinating stuff - the North East must have been the messiest bit of pre-deregulation "map", given the way that United/ Northern/ Busways were a public transport version of the Schleswig-Holstein Question (or the way that the border for Belgium/ Netherlands has places where an enclave of Belgium is inside an enclave of the Netherlands which is surrounded by Belgium)!

The small Northern operation north of the Tyne sticks out like a sore thumb, but wasn't the only oddity - then again, the North East has always done things a bit differently (in most urban areas, the city is on both sides of the river - e.g. Glasgow, Leeds, London - but Gateshead was traditionally County Durham and therefore Not Newcastle) - so it's not just the buses that don't fit the neat pattern that you might expect based on experience elsewhere in the UK.

Even the local Newcastle services were apparently split between "Newcastle Busways" and "City Busways" (though I appreciate that this was more about giving identity to two separate garages, but always seemed a bit strange to me, being used to all the depots in places like Edinburgh and Glasgow having one common name/fleet)!

Presumably the "Tyne Valley" bits of United/ Northumbria/ Arriva have never had much to do with the rest of that operation (other than in central Newcastle)? I can't remember any services between the "A1" bits of the operation and the "A69" bits (though there may have been some token stuff?) - whereas the Tyne Valley stuff must have rubbed shoulders with Northern services at Blaydon/ Metro Centre/ Gateshead?

Also... since this thread has expanded beyond just GoNorthEast... Arriva still run their share of the 685 (alongside "Cumbria")? Is it a very profitable service? Seems strange that it didn't either change hands with the rest of the Hexham stuff or be taken over fully by Stagecoach (who have depots at both ends)?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Glad you're enjoying this. You raise a few more things that are worthy of clarification....

Even the local Newcastle services were apparently split between "Newcastle Busways" and "City Busways" (though I appreciate that this was more about giving identity to two separate garages, but always seemed a bit strange to me, being used to all the depots in places like Edinburgh and Glasgow having one common name/fleet)!

Newcastle Busways was Slatyford depot whilst City Busways was Byker though they shared the same burgundy trim on their cadmium yellow and white livery; eventually, they both adopted Newcastle Busways. Why? Don't know

Presumably the "Tyne Valley" bits of United/ Northumbria/ Arriva have never had much to do with the rest of that operation (other than in central Newcastle)? I can't remember any services between the "A1" bits of the operation and the "A69" bits (though there may have been some token stuff?) - whereas the Tyne Valley stuff must have rubbed shoulders with Northern services at Blaydon/ Metro Centre/ Gateshead?

Back on topic here.... We look at the territories in a certain way but this has changed over time. It might seem that Northumbria/Arriva operations in the Tyne Valley were on a limb. However, it wasn't always the case. Before the Metro came along, the boundaries were different and there were many route swaps at that time. So places like Heddon or Throckley or Newbiggin Hall were firmly United until they were transferred to the PTE - see photo

Bristol VR no. APT819W @ Newcastle, c.1980 [slide 8081]

Eastern Coachworks bodied Bristol VR no. APT819W is seen as United fleet no. 819 at Marlborough Street bus station, Newcastle-upon-Tyne, c.1980. It features individual seating.

www.flickr.com

Meanwhile, what was a Northern service, 306 Newcastle to Tynemouth transferred to United in 1981; I don't know what other services changed around that time but the boundaries were certainly redrawn. Even after that, places like Prudhoe was still firmly United. So what is regarded as traditional areas of operation for Go Ahead, Busways or Arriva to the north of the Tyne are very different to 50 years ago.

As an aside, before dereg, the Hexham - Prudhoe - Newcastle (601/2 now 10) actually interworked with the X25/X26 to Blyth so there was a really odd link!

Also... since this thread has expanded beyond just GoNorthEast... Arriva still run their share of the 685 (alongside "Cumbria")? Is it a very profitable service? Seems strange that it didn't either change hands with the rest of the Hexham stuff or be taken over fully by Stagecoach (who have depots at both ends)?

The 685 is another odd story. United had a depot at Carlisle until 1969 and so operated the predecessor (34? as well as other services from that side of Carlisle) from there and Hexham. When Carlisle passed to Ribble, so did their share of the route, eventually passing to Cumberland in 1986.

When Arriva sold the Hexham depot to Go Ahead, the reason that GA didn't go for the 685 was (as it was explained to me) that Peter Huntley wanted sole control of the routes that he had so he could market them as he wished. So Arriva instead retained their share from the 685 and moved it to Jesmond depot. Of course, Go Ahead subsequently introduced the competitive X85.

Might also add that Go Ahead did gain some additional Tyne Valley routes when they acquired OK Travel who had won certain routes on tender from Northumbria, of which one was the 684 that was operated from OK's Bishop Auckland depot, running dead.