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Great Northern Class 700 diagrams?

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Skimble19

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I'm not on about the CD/RA indicators. I'm not sure they're used any longer (I'll have a check). Attached is the sign I referred to in my earlier post. I assume this a degraded dispatch?

View attachment 39621
The CD/RA indicators are used all day every day for GN services, only 12 cars and VTEC / Hull Trains get manually dispatched. That sign (RA Board) tells a driver the platform is unmanned so they will need to dispatch themselves (or in the case of a 700 not stop). Degraded dispatch also, as said by @Fred26 above, refers to dispatchers locking off parts of a train to enable them to dispatch it safely when short staffed (again not possible with a 700).
 
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Hadders

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Another poor start with today’s 0736 from stevenage delayed by 24 minutes ‘due to a fault on the train’.
 

jamieP

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Another poor start with today’s 0736 from stevenage delayed by 24 minutes ‘due to a fault on the train’.

Problem with unit whilst being prepared in the sidings. Fixed in the end by doing a reboot. Better to be late than cancelled.
 

Failed Unit

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Problem with unit whilst being prepared in the sidings. Fixed in the end by doing a reboot. Better to be late than cancelled.

Agreed, but as far as the customers planning to use it are concerned it was effectively cancelled. No-one would wait for it as other trains would get them into London quicker.
 

sefton

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Problem with unit whilst being prepared in the sidings. Fixed in the end by doing a reboot. Better to be late than cancelled.

22 minutes to do a reboot isn't quick! Effectively 700 people ended up being 29 minutes late.

And being so late the only people on board will have been those who didn't want to stand on the earlier, now overpacked, services.
 

Hadders

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22 minutes to do a reboot isn't quick! Effectively 700 people ended up being 29 minutes late.

And being so late the only people on board will have been those who didn't want to stand on the earlier, now overpacked, services.

I agree but it finally arrived 40 minutes late at Kings Cross. Surprised it takes so long to reboot.
 

sefton

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I believe the taxi was late.

Not according to Great Northern's text alert which said it would be "delayed about 5 minutes - a fault on this train".

Of course Great Northern would never mislead its customers...
 

Starmill

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Given the ongoing requirement for staff dispatch at Stevenage, which can still cause problems when short-staffed, I find it all the more bizarre that they just removed dispatchers entirely from City Thameslink (and elsewhere).
 

sefton

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So they didn't have a driver for the 6.56, and then they found one but the driver for the 7.33 disappeared.

Hmm...
 

Fred26

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Given the ongoing requirement for staff dispatch at Stevenage, which can still cause problems when short-staffed, I find it all the more bizarre that they just removed dispatchers entirely from City Thameslink (and elsewhere).

Stevenage is very rarely short staffed. I cannot remember a time where it has affected operational performance.
Thameslink has lost dispatch, which happened with very short notice. There's no word when the GN will lose dispatch, but it's probably just a matter of time.
 

sefton

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As far as I know there was always a driver for the 0656.

Not according to the text alerts sent by Great Northern.

At 6.50 they announced the 6.56 was cancelled due to shortage of train crew.

10 minutes later they announced the 6.56 was reinstated.

2 minutes later they announced the 7.33 was cancelled due to a shortage of train crew.

Coincidence or not it gives the impression Great Northern couldn't run a ....
 

bramling

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Not according to the text alerts sent by Great Northern.

At 6.50 they announced the 6.56 was cancelled due to shortage of train crew.

10 minutes later they announced the 6.56 was reinstated.

2 minutes later they announced the 7.33 was cancelled due to a shortage of train crew.

Coincidence or not it gives the impression Great Northern couldn't run a ....

It seems it was 1P49 which was cancelled.

No doubt the usual brigade of Thameslink/GTR/Class 700 defenders will dive in and say everything is wonderful. In reality it’s another fiasco, another load of inconvenienced passengers, and another example of how the implementation of this programme is simply incompetent and not robust enough.

On a different note, I've been having a look through the December timetable, so far I've only looked at M-F. Not many changes at all, just some very minor changes to a handful of 365 and 387 diagrams, very little that the passenger will notice. Unless I've missed anything, no changes to formation or changes from/to 365/387. The only thing people will notice is a small handful of services at KX will be made from a different incoming service. There remain plenty of 365 diagrams which Undesiros can be put onto relatively easily.
 
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sefton

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It seems it was 1P49 which was cancelled.

No doubt the usual brigade of Thameslink/GTR/Class 700 defenders will dive in and say everything is wonderful. In reality it’s another fiasco, another load of inconvenienced passengers, and another example of how the implementation of this programme is simply incompetent and not robust enough.

So there is still the question of why Great Northern told everyone the 6.56 was cancelled and then magically found a driver for it but at the same time lost the driver for the 7.33.

It doesn't give the appearance of a company in control.
 

jon0844

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There was a driver for the 0656 but he needed a 'unit refresh'. I guess the official message had to be more generic as I doubt they'd know what the heck that meant!

The 0733 was cancelled due to a lack of train staff, but the 0746 had extra stops added to (partly) compensate. It may not the conspiracy/incompetence people think it was!

Additional: Surely GTR can't get rid of dispatchers on the GN side until ALL trains have bodyside cameras, and even then they don't always work. I would expect staff would remain but rarely do dispatch, but have to keep up their competency for occasional dispatch (unless the alternative is to just cancel trains).
 
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sefton

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There was a driver for the 0656 but he needed a 'unit refresh'. I guess the official message had to be more generic as I doubt they'd know what the heck that meant!

So what does it mean.

The 0733 was cancelled due to a lack of train staff, but the 0746 had extra stops added to (partly) compensate. It may not the conspiracy/incompetence people think it was!

Sorry but I would say not realising you don't have a driver until a service is due to leave is a good definition of incompetence.
 

jon0844

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So what does it mean.

Sorry but I would say not realising you don't have a driver until a service is due to leave is a good definition of incompetence.

Perhaps the driver needed to be accompanied by another member of staff, as s/he was still learning the new stock. They might have been delayed, meaning the train was technically without a driver as s/he could not go alone.

If that was the case, there was no connection between the delay of this train and the second train cancelled due to no driver. Unless someone can show that the driver was nabbed from the later train.

IF that was the case and it was deemed better to add stops to a later train to cover for the later cancelled service, it could have been the less disruptive option overall.

Maybe someone else will explain in more detail, but 'incompetence' is what you'd expect someone on Twitter to say, not here where people are usually more willing to wait for an explanation and accept that things can happen for good reason.
 

sefton

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Maybe someone else will explain in more detail, but 'incompetence' is what you'd expect someone on Twitter to say, not here where people are usually more willing to wait for an explanation and accept that things can happen for good reason.

I think an explanation why on multiple occasions since the 700s were introduced Great Northern have failed to put a driver behind the controls of a working train would be good.

I don't consider it unreasonable to question the company's competence for these repeated failures. All the more surprising as you would expect this to be a showcase project they would pull out all the stops to get right.
 
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