Great Western Railway Heathrow Express Class 387 Refittment and Service Updates

[class717]

Thameslink has fitted and tested it in the core section, but I don't believe it is used in normal service.

It is used on passenger trains when driver training on ATO is being done, we were expecting full ATO service in the core in December 2020 but its now been delayed

 

[Bald Rick]

The intention was to fit the GW main line with it, and then the ECML.
But the GW plan was canned, except that the Heathrow branch was fitted.
That means Heathrow Express needs it, and also Crossrail when it reaches Heathrow.
HEx decided to use GWR 387s instead of refitting their 332 fleet, hence the project to fit the 387s.
It means GW ATP can be retired on the branch.

It’s a bit more complicated than that.

The Heathrow branch was only fitted with ATP, and not TPWS.

The 332s are maintained at Old Oak Common in a depot that has to be demolished for HS2.

GWR have spare 387s with the ‘pausing’ of Oxford electrification;
387s are not fitted with ATP

345s for Elizabeth Line are not fitted with ATP, but do have ETCS (as almost all new trains have now).

To get the Elizabeth line to Heathrow, it was easier to fit that with ETCS than fit the whole 345 fleet with ATP.

It was much cheaper to use the spare 387s on HEx, adding ETCS to use on the Heathrow branch (which the 387s will need at some point anyway), than to find a location for, and build, a new depot for the 332 s.

Phew.

 

[berneyarms]

Great synopsis!

 

[Mikey C]

What happens when the wires eventually reach Oxford? Will GWR need some more 387s, such as the current C2C ones?

 

[JN114]

What happens when the wires eventually reach Oxford? Will GWR need some more 387s, such as the current C2C ones?

Electric or BiMode stock will be procured as necessary, either new build or cascaded in from elsewhere.

With the uncertainty around when/if electrification north of Oxford actually happens, coupled with uncertainty as to what the future of rail will exactly be; with some forecasts showing as much as 30% permanent reduction in passenger there may well be several of the “classic” 33 387s available if you don’t have to run 12 cars on the inner Thames Valley any more. Presuming you wire to Banbury you only need 3x 4 cars to like-for-like replace the existing diesel shuttle north of Oxford.

 

[Chris125]

The intention was to fit the GW main line with it, and then the ECML.
But the GW plan was canned, except that the Heathrow branch was fitted.

IIRC there's also a scheme underway to fit ETCS between Airport Jct and Paddington, though some way off completion.

 

[rebmcr]

IIRC there's also a scheme underway to fit ETCS between Airport Jct and Paddington, though some way off completion.

Yes that's the long-term goal of Crossrail, to reduce signalling transitions en route as much as possible (including into the Central Operating Section tunnels).

The only reason the COS isn't already ETCS, is that CBTC was chosen as the only Day 1 reliable option. Eventually, there should be ETCS uninterrupted from Heathrow to Abbey Wood, with Crossrail's signalling transitions reduced to a single 'boundary' near Stratford.

 

[Bald Rick]

The only reason the COS isn't already ETCS, is that CBTC was chosen as the only Day 1 reliable option. Eventually, there should be ETCS uninterrupted from Heathrow to Abbey Wood, with Crossrail's signalling transitions reduced to a single 'boundary' near Stratford.

And because some functionality required for Crossrail didn’t then, and still doesn’t, exist in ETCS.

 

[Chris125]

IIRC there's also a scheme underway to fit ETCS between Airport Jct and Paddington, though some way off completion.

I've just had a look, and it seems NR are/were expecting to commission ETCS between Paddington and the Heathrow Branch by December 2022 according to this exemption application for ATP

"Application is made until 31st December 2023 beyond planned ETCS commissioning in December 2022 to allow contingency for ETCS passenger operation given the potential risks with deployment in the complex area"

 

[Trailfinder]

There are a vast number of ETCS balises now installed on all lines between Paddington and Airport Junction. Maybe all are now installed.

 

[3973EXL]

5Q50 57306 387132

Realtime Trains - 574R 1052 West Ealing Emu Sidings to Ilford E.M.U.D.

Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Realtime Trains - 581R 1436 Ilford E.M.U.D. to Reading Traincare Depot

Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[JN114]

Should be 57306+387130 coming back

 

[3973EXL]

Should be 57306+387130 coming back

5Q47 as you say.

 

[Scottychoo]

For the benefit of those of us who are a bit slower off the mark, is this a temporary or permanent situation, please?

You honestly think T4 is closing permanently??

 

[pdeaves]

You honestly think T4 is closing permanently??

No, I simply didn't know what was happening and sought clarity; I hope that's OK. There may, for example, have been a plan to move the terminal, or make it accessible via another route, or any number of other possibilities. I have previously had no interest in what was going on (short term, planned long term) at ground level.

 

[reddragon]

You honestly think T4 is closing permanently??

After today's quarantine announcement, I think Heathrow is to be the site of a major new car free housing development, sort of Beeching 2 (the trains strikes back).

I'd say T4 has had it

 

[Bald Rick]

After today's quarantine announcement, I think Heathrow is to be the site of a major new car free housing development, sort of Beeching 2 (the trains strikes back).

I'd say T4 has had it

No chance!

 

[hozza94]

No, I simply didn't know what was happening and sought clarity; I hope that's OK. There may, for example, have been a plan to move the terminal, or make it accessible via another route, or any number of other possibilities. I have previously had no interest in what was going on (short term, planned long term) at ground level.

There is indeed a few different options for T4, which one of them is to close it as a passenger terminal as it is considered to be "at the wrong location", all planes that need to depart using the northern runway would need to cross the southern runway which constraints the operation, and merging the apron with the cargo zone.

One of the plan would be closing T4, demolish the existing T3 and expand T2 to become Heathrow East, and build an extra terminal between the existing northern runway and new expansion area (T5X).

 

[Mikey C]

T4 is a poor design as well, the check in area is long and thin so that it easily feels overcrowded

 

[yorkie]

Just a gentle reminder this is a Traction & Rolling Stock thread regarding Great Western Railway Heathrow Express Class 387 Refitment and Service Updates

 

[class717]

ORR have approved ETCS Level 2 on the Class 345s for Heathrow

 

[D365]

How much commissioning work is left for the HEx 387s before they can enter service?

 

[JN114]

How much commissioning work is left for the HEx 387s before they can enter service?

A fair bit.

There’s validating ETCS, training drivers on ETCS, finishing training drivers on 387s. Plus not all the units are finished finished yet.

The tentative timescale was late summer for first diagrams before the current situation; however if that slips remains to be seen

 

[sk688]

Apologies if this has been done before , but why didn’t GWR wait for the 379s to come from GA , then they’d have an airport fleet without needing to be redone internally

 

[D365]

Apologies if this has been done before , but why didn’t GWR wait for the 379s to come from GA , then they’d have an airport fleet without needing to be redone internally

One of the key reasons for replacing the Class 332s is that Old Oak Common (the older depot, not the Crossrail depot) needs to be demolished. By using the Reading-based 387s, Heathrow doesn’t need to build a new depot. The 379s wouldn’t have been available in time, and (I believe) the shortened electrification meant there were spare 387s.

 

[Energy]

One of the key reasons for replacing the Class 332s is that Old Oak Common (the older depot, not the Crossrail depot) needs to be demolished. By using the Reading-based 387s, Heathrow doesn’t need to build a new depot. The 379s wouldn’t have been available in time, and (I believe) the shortened electrification meant there were spare 387s.

Crossrail has also freed some 387s from GWR routes.

 

[D365]

Crossrail has also freed some 387s from GWR routes.

Yes, but that was always the plan.

 

[devonexpress]

One of the key reasons for replacing the Class 332s is that Old Oak Common (the older depot, not the Crossrail depot) needs to be demolished. By using the Reading-based 387s, Heathrow doesn’t need to build a new depot. The 379s wouldn’t have been available in time, and (I believe) the shortened electrification meant there were spare 387s.

It seems to be a very long time to convert only 12 4 car units, when the HST refresh programme was done back in 2006 they would have been finished by now and ready for testing.

 

[D365]

It seems to be a very long time to convert only 12 4 car units, when the HST refresh programme was done back in 2006 they would have been finished by now and ready for testing.

Don't forget they also have to fit and commission ETCS signalling to the 387s, and get the HEx drivers trained. As was discussed above.

 

[JN114]

Apologies if this has been done before , but why didn’t GWR wait for the 379s to come from GA , then they’d have an airport fleet without needing to be redone internally

They’d need all the same mods, validation and testing the 387s are undergoing now; but are still not available for release today; whereas the first 387s went away nearly 18 months ago. We’d still be years away, and OOC HEx depot is blocking progress on HS2.