Greater Anglia Bombardier Aventras (Class 720): Technical discussion and introduction

[adc82140]

Is there a list anywhere of units delivered so far?

 

[Metal_gee_man]

To add to the window alignment argument, most won't care about being able to look out, BUT...a 3+2 layout means minimal shoulder/arm room if someone sits next to you if you're in a window seat and you have no window it'll make them very unpopular once someone realises how cramped they'll feel and be.
I refuse to sit on a non window seat on an IET or a SE Javelin (door pocket seats) for the exact reason the window actually gives you more room

 

[86246]

Given how low I found the seats on a 321 in relation to the window, I'm not sure that being able to look out of the windows will be a major issue.

 

[JonathanH]

Don't suppose it will end up in one piece by the time it finishes at 01:25 at Southedn Victoria.

What sort of reasonable excuse do you think someone will have to be travelling on a train from Liverpool Street to Southend Victoria at 0015, and leave the train not in one piece, at the current time?

In any case, 1K55 2300 Southend Victoria to London Liverpool Street appears not to have run so the return working 2K26 0015 London Liverpool Street to Southend Victoria appears to be a pair of bins.

Is there a list anywhere of units delivered so far?

Searching the ukmodernemu group, it appears that, in addition to 720511/15/17/36 used so far in service, 720537/38 are also with Greater Anglia. A lot of the units seem to be at Worksop.

 

[NSE]

What sort of reasonable excuse do you think someone will have to be travelling on a train from Liverpool Street to Southend Victoria at 0015, and leave the train not in one piece, at the current time?

In any case, 1K55 2300 Southend Victoria to London Liverpool Street appears not to have run so the return working 2K26 0015 London Liverpool Street to Southend Victoria appears to be a pair of bins.


Searching the ukmodernemu group, it appears that, in addition to 720511/15/17/36 used so far in service, 720537/38 are also with Greater Anglia. A lot of the units seem to be at Worksop.

I think it was more a reference to the behaviour of a certain type of Southend resident. In all honesty, the stereotype does have some merit haha

 

[chubs]

Which Liverpool St departure was the vomit comet?

 

[JonathanH]

Looks like a pair are out again this morning starting 2K11 0854 Southend Victoria to London Liverpool Street as Tiger at Southend Airport was reporting a 10-coach train. Three hour repeating pattern (eg 1154, 1454, 1754, 2054 from Southend Victoria, 1023, 1323, 1623, 1923, 2223 from Liverpool Street)

​

 

[Gulf1159]

Which Liverpool St departure was the vomit comet?

2K28 0050 Liverpool Street to Southend

 

[samuelmorris]

From watching this video:

Looks like the disabled toilets aren't working yet, and they haven't finished programming the PIS at the Liverpool Street end. CETs are notoriously difficult to get working, but I really don't understand how people continually mess up PIS information like that. It plays in the correct place and announces the correct station which is the important (and difficult) bit, but someone evidently got told to down tools halfway through programming the connections.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Still rather confused as to what those "knee-room blockers" on some of the seats are for! They don't look like the packet being left on.

 

[ashkeba]

Still rather confused as to what those "knee-room blockers" on some of the seats are for! They don't look like the packet being left on.

Has the train designer's spouse recently left them for a tall person, perhaps?

 

[superalbs]

Still rather confused as to what those "knee-room blockers" on some of the seats are for! They don't look like the packet being left on.

I don't understand it either, they're very hard, but seem to be there intentionally as they are on so many seats. Also seem to be leather coated, which is funny considering other trains haven't had leather seats because of the supposed fire risk, yet these can have it on the back of seats for what seems like no purpose.

 

[F Great Eastern]

Having had a quick ride on these for a couple of stops, surprisingly the seats are better and more comfortable than I thought they would be for the most part However I'd be curious how the seating would be in the pays of six facing each other, as I think that might be a little cramped.

Have to say though the airline window seats have too little foot space for my liking due to the way it's fixed to the carriage wall and the knee space blockers are very odd and not a good thing.

Nice touch on the grooves on the seat back tables.

Need a longer ride and sit in a few seats to give an in-depth review.

 

[samuelmorris]

Sounds positive about the seats, how do they compare to the grammers on the 360s?

The knee blockers sound bizarre, I'd love to get to the bottom of what they're for. What proportion of seats have them?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Sounds positive about the seats, how do they compare to the grammers on the 360s?

The knee blockers sound bizarre, I'd love to get to the bottom of what they're for. What proportion of seats have them?

From the video above, they mostly seem to be on the end rows.

 

[TrainTube]

Looks like a pair are out again this morning starting 2K11 0854 Southend Victoria to London Liverpool Street as Tiger at Southend Airport was reporting a 10-coach train. Three hour repeating pattern (eg 1154, 1454, 1754, 2054 from Southend Victoria, 1023, 1323, 1623, 1923, 2223 from Liverpool Street)

​

I wonder whether 720s will be doing off peak services from tomorrow seeing as they have done today.

 

[TitanMike]

I wonder whether 720s will be doing off peak services from tomorrow seeing as they have done today.

Dont the weekday off peaks interwork with Braintree services? If so maybe they will be confined to peak workings for now and weekend workings?

 

[samuelmorris]

From the video above, they mostly seem to be on the end rows.

Ah ok, not quite so bad then given there are so many other seats to choose from! (At least for now) - those are probably already the worst seats anyway given their proximity to the open gangway.

Dont the weekday off peaks interwork with Braintree services? If so maybe they will be confined to peak workings for now and weekend workings?

Not all of them, as there is only 1tph to Braintree but 3tph to Southend.

 

[TrainTube]

Dont the weekday off peaks interwork with Braintree services? If so maybe they will be confined to peak workings for now and weekend workings?

Some do I believe but I'm sure there is at least one diagram that just does Southend runs the whole time

 

[FOH]

Sounds positive about the seats, how do they compare to the grammers on the 360s?

The knee blockers sound bizarre, I'd love to get to the bottom of what they're for. What proportion of seats have them?

They look almost like a hinged shelf. Could it be to bridge the gap to the seat squab to make an impromptu luggage shelf?

 

[387star]

They look almost like a hinged shelf. Could it be to bridge the gap to the seat squab to make an impromptu luggage shelf?

To stop the seats getting dented and damaged?

 

[samuelmorris]

To stop the seats getting dented and damaged?

They'd be on every seat if that was the case.

 

[TheHSRailFan]

Do we know when more than 1 pair(s) will be doing the Southend route? Since i think GA would love to replace the 321s

 

[Wivenswold]

Do we know when more than 1 pair(s) will be doing the Southend route? Since i think GA would love to replace the 321s

Like other fleet rolls-outs the first unit(s) in service will be monitored very closely by the manufacturer's experts but also Greater Anglia's fleet implementation team.

If there are no serious issues then you'll probably see a further set by the end of 2020. It all depends on the driver training programme, what Bombardier find during "in service" testing and mileage accumulation tests on each unit as to when further units will join the passenger fleet. These things go slowly at first but I think the Southend Vic line will be mostly Aventras by Spring. Once all Ilford drivers have signed the 720, then you'll start to see a few on the main line, then Colchester and Clacton drivers come next, then finally West Anglia by the end of 2021.

Though the plan may change.

 

[bramling]

I went on the day it entered service and it's pretty nice it's a definite upgrade from the likes of the 321s and 317s. I also got cab shots too

Can’t help but think interior looks a cluttered mess. A shame because the atmosphere looks quite pleasant, however it does look like they’ve gone that bit too far packing seats in. To me I don’t see what this design offers over something like a 387, apart from that the seats aren’t the unpopular ironing boards!

 

[jon0844]

Can’t help but think interior looks a cluttered mess. A shame because the atmosphere looks quite pleasant, however it does look like they’ve gone that bit too far packing seats in. To me I don’t see what this design offers over something like a 387, apart from that the seats aren’t the unpopular ironing boards!

It's interesting to see a totally different approach to moving loads of people. I think the 700s encourage people to move along the train and use available space, whereas GA has clearly opted to have everyone get a seat even if somewhat cramped, and must acknowledge that the narrow aisles will not encourage people to move through (indeed, at busy times, the aisles are likely to be very hard to use).

The 387s are fine outside of the peaks (or anytime during the pandemic!) but somewhat cramped for the same reasons (and they're only 2+2, but those armrests...). And a 700 or 717 outside of the peak has ample seating.

Time will tell which works best, but personally I think the 700s are better geared for passenger growth. Maybe GA knows passenger numbers will never fully return to normal...?

 

[Class 466]

It's interesting to see a totally different approach to moving loads of people. I think the 700s encourage people to move along the train and use available space, whereas GA has clearly opted to have everyone get a seat even if somewhat cramped, and must acknowledge that the narrow aisles will not encourage people to move through (indeed, at busy times, the aisles are likely to be very hard to use).

The 387s are fine outside of the peaks (or anytime during the pandemic!) but somewhat cramped for the same reasons (and they're only 2+2, but those armrests...). And a 700 or 717 outside of the peak has ample seating.

Time will tell which works best, but personally I think the 700s are better geared for passenger growth. Maybe GA knows passenger numbers will never fully return to normal...?

Given they ordered these units 2-3 years before there was even mention of a pandemic, I doubt passenger numbers not returning had much to do with it!

 

[Bletchleyite]

Given they ordered these units 2-3 years before there was even mention of a pandemic, I doubt passenger numbers not returning had much to do with it!

Indeed. I'd say logic if ordering them now would be a wide 2+2 interior due to (a) reduced demand, and (b) more likelihood of people wanting to work while travelling (3+2 is too narrow for using a laptop, you elbow the person next to you the whole time).

I'd agree they are a bit too packed in. Realigning the bays/airline rows to the windows, which would give a slightly better pitch and window view (removing the row of 3 airline seats), would be an improvement, a bit more like the 350/2 which has aligned and generously spaced bays of 6.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Like other fleet rolls-outs the first unit(s) in service will be monitored very closely by the manufacturer's experts but also Greater Anglia's fleet implementation team.

If there are no serious issues then you'll probably see a further set by the end of 2020. It all depends on the driver training programme, what Bombardier find during "in service" testing and mileage accumulation tests on each unit as to when further units will join the passenger fleet. These things go slowly at first but I think the Southend Vic line will be mostly Aventras by Spring. Once all Ilford drivers have signed the 720, then you'll start to see a few on the main line, then Colchester and Clacton drivers come next, then finally West Anglia by the end of 2021.

Though the plan may change.

On the official Greater Anglia document that someone posted on here as a source for saying they’d enter service last Sunday, the small print says they’re planning them on the Ipswich route on Jan 31st and Colchester Town in the first week of February. I don’t remember who posted it or where it came from but they got last week’s date right so these dates could most likely also be right

 

[iphone76]

I'm on the 1031 from Wickford to London and its just told me I can change at Shenfield for the Elizabeth line. Its might be a long wait. But overall they are ok..