Greater Anglia Rolling Stock Updates

[HLE]

Does anybody know why the Renatus bins are in the livery they are? Just as the fleet gradually gains GA colours another variation comes along.

Also a couple of weeks after the loss of the 68s we have 11 shameful cancellations today on the local routes out of Norwich.

Dogbox conked again?

 

[dk1]

Dogbox conked again?

Been spare units this last week but just knew it wouldn't last. So embarrassing.

 

[dk1]

Thanks for the information @Defiance.

@dk1, the Renatus livery is similar enough to the new livery applied to some of the class 317s and the refurbished 170s and 90/Mk3s to suggest that this was the intended scheme for GA. I applaud them for making minor changes to suit each unit.

Of course things change and the new trains will have a new design too. I think we'll miss the variety we currently have.

The Renatus livery is nothing like that recently applied to any unit in the GA fleet. Don't get the reason for this flaw in uniformity unless it's ready for their future home.

 

[Wivenswold]

I think you're assuming that there was an intention of uniformity and that the Renatus livery is in some way an error. Operators often go for an adaption of theme for each type of unit.

The units in mostly white, green, light and dark blue with pink doors have inherited liveries so the only units in house colours by design are the aforementioned refurbs.

The 321 livery was designed well over a year ago anyway, there's nothing to say that wasn't going to be standard GA EMU livery before the plan changed dramatically.

There was never a future plan for Renatus units beyond GA, as the project was underway before GA's long-term award and there was a pressing need to get on with DDA compliance.

 

[dk1]

I think you're assuming that there was an intention of uniformity and that the Renatus livery is in some way an error. Operators often go for an adaption of theme for each type of unit.

The units in mostly white, green, light and dark blue with pink doors have inherited liveries so the only units in house colours by design are the aforementioned refurbs.

The 321 livery was designed well over a year ago anyway, there's nothing to say that wasn't going to be standard GA EMU livery before the plan changed dramatically.

There was never a future plan for Renatus units beyond GA, as the project was underway before GA's long-term award and there was a pressing need to get on with DDA compliance.

Apart from dropping the 'Abellio' from the title, what has changed to that extent in the GA livery for years now? Base white, red doors, don't get Renatus at all.

 

[Wivenswold]

The base white was thanks to a repaint contract signed in the National Express days, first they arrived with NatEx stripes, then when they lost the franchise they came through in plain white but still with NatEx dark blue doors then when Abellio took over they managed to change the spec to red doors.

Some other refreshed units did get all white bodies with red doors but refurbished trains get the real deal livery. You'll remember First Group did similar with their "Barbie" livery on Buses, low floor DDA compliant buses got the full livery, older step-entrances vehicles which would have to be replaced soon got a watered-down version.

"Abellio" was dropped by order of the DfT. It's in the franchise agreement.

 

[dk1]

The base white was thanks to a repaint contract signed in the National Express days, first they arrived with NatEx stripes, then when they lost the franchise they came through in plain white but still with NatEx dark blue doors then when Abellio took over they managed to change the spec to red doors.

Some other refreshed units did get all white bodies with red doors but refurbished trains get the real deal livery. You'll remember First Group did similar with their "Barbie" livery on Buses, low floor DDA compliant buses got the full livery, older step-entrances vehicles which would have to be replaced soon got a watered-down version.

"Abellio" was dropped by order of the DfT. It's in the franchise agreement.

I know the basics having worked for them since BR & Anglia Railways days & you've still not explained why this livery is absolutely nothing like the standard GA livery of base white & red doors which is standard & being applied to our fleet as they are due repaint. It has nothing to do with anything inherited from the dreadful NX days.

 

[Wivenswold]

I'm only surmising, if it's such a burning issue for you and you work for them then you're better placed to find out than I am. I look forward to you reporting back with your findings.

 

[dk1]

I'm only surmising, if it's such a burning issue for you and you work for them then you're better placed to find out than I am. I look forward to you reporting back with your findings.

I will pass them on. Curious I'd say rather than burning but you came across as cock sure.

 

[Wivenswold]

Well most of what I've said is fact but I'm surmising on the actual reason for the Renatus units having grey doors.

 

[dk1]

Well most of what I've said is fact but I'm surmising on the actual reason for the Renatus units having grey doors.

Most?

 

[Wivenswold]

321 310 in Colchester yard today with what appears to the new AC kit in unrefurbished condition though. Seen from Renatus 321 311 which is now in service.

Haven't seen any units in the 330-366 & 439-447 ranges without the internal refresh in a while so I assume that project is complete.

 

[samuelmorris]

Given that they've now started applying it to the ex-GN units in FCC colours I think that's probably true. Frankly that change seems like an unnecessary downgrade as there was nothing wrong with the previous interior (unlike the ex-FGE interiors which were pretty dog-eared). Still very slow progress at introducing Renatus units, given 2018 is fast approaching.

 

[Wivenswold]

I wouldn't be surprised if there was an option to extend the Renatus leases into 2020. If the Aventra 10 cars are late and the 360/379s are cover for any hiccups with the Stadler introduction, there will be a need for additional DDA-compliant legacy stock.

Perhaps someone with inside knowledge will have a view on that.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Hope the 90+Mk3s won’t be scrapped. However, the sad reality is that they most likely will be.

 

[LAX54]

I am sure many are looking forward to the demise of the hauled sets, but no doubt once the new units have been running for a month or so, the loss will be lamented ! It seems nowadays it is all down to getting from A to B as quick as possible, comfort takes second place, not sure why anyone needs to get from A to B so quickly ! does 15 mins or so make that much difference over all

 

[chubs]

I am sure many are looking forward to the demise of the hauled sets, but no doubt once the new units have been running for a month or so, the loss will be lamented ! It seems nowadays it is all down to getting from A to B as quick as possible, comfort takes second place, not sure why anyone needs to get from A to B so quickly ! does 15 mins or so make that much difference over all

I for one will not miss the constant squeaking and screeching, as a cold draft blasts through the carriage from multiple stuck open vestibule doors. The seats aren't comfortable anyway!

Roll on cheap razor blades.

 

[Wivenswold]

I tend to avoid the IC trains when I can now. I know many fans will miss them but it's a commuter railway first and foremost and the MK3s have had their day. I'm looking forward to commuting on the Stadlers.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I tend to avoid the IC trains when I can now. I know many fans will miss them but it's a commuter railway first and foremost and the MK3s have had their day. I'm looking forward to commuting on the Stadlers.

I'm quite sad we can't have any Stadlers for WCML IR type services like the Trent Valley stopper. I like 350s (and indeed sometimes use the LM services even when I'm on an interavailable ticket for that reason), but some FLIRTs would be enough to make me totally rule out VT except when in a hurry, they really are nice units.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

VT beat 350s any day for me.

 

[dp21]

I wouldn't be surprised if there was an option to extend the Renatus leases into 2020. If the Aventra 10 cars are late and the 360/379s are cover for any hiccups with the Stadler introduction, there will be a need for additional DDA-compliant legacy stock.

Perhaps someone with inside knowledge will have a view on that.

317s which are getting PRM'd are staying on longest and recently a lease extension was signed for the 360s and 379s "just in case". As far as I'm aware that's the only action so far of this nature. Not 100% sure about when the renatus 321s go but I think they'll be off to a new home rather than hanging about.

 

[Wivenswold]

Thanks as always for the info dp21. I did have the dates for the 321/3, I seem to remember they go off lease in October 2019 but that may have changed.

321 406 is now refreshed GA style, looks like they're all getting the treatment. Wouldn't have happened in NatEx days.

321 314 now has AC package along with 310, both not yet given refurb.

 

[dk1]

Few things have come up recently involving the new fleet/timetable...

Bi-mode fleet will only be able to work 500-600 miles between fuelling. This compares poorly with the 1300-1500 miles currently attained with the DMU fleet. Some major diagram changes & fuelling outside of Crown Point (FL do currently help out at Ipswich) will have to be sourced.

Sudbury Branch will not now work through to/from Colchester. This performance nightmare is a non-starter not least because of the foot crossing issues at Marks Tey. Never was the brightest idea on the aspiration list.

Bombardier Aventra units may yet retain first class accommodation after all. A decision must be made soon but the jury is still out on this one.

 

[samuelmorris]

The Bimode range issue is no great surprise, but it could be an issue for the units that spend almost their entire diagrams off the wires. The curtailing of Sudbury is also perhaps unsurprising, though it does reduce the connections from Colchester Town, is anything being added in its place?

 

[dk1]

The Bimode range issue is no great surprise, but it could be an issue for the units that spend almost their entire diagrams off the wires. The curtailing of Sudbury is also perhaps unsurprising, though it does reduce the connections from Colchester Town, is anything being added in its place?

It's going to be a mighty fine juggling act to sort the bimode fleet out & daytime fuelling will become the norm. Doubt anything will replace the Colchester extension from Sudbury. Just needs, as now, decent connections.

 

[eastdyke]

It's going to be a mighty fine juggling act to sort the bimode fleet out & daytime fuelling will become the norm. Doubt anything will replace the Colchester extension from Sudbury. Just needs, as now, decent connections.

Thanks for the updates.
I'm sure a local fuel station in Sudbury will oblige with a few cans when the unit gets low! LOL.

 

[Wivenswold]

Interesting now that reality is hitting home on a few aspirations. Shame about the Sudbury service, I was looking forward to getting a Flirt from Colchester Town. Not a surprise about the 1st class issue, it's popular on commuter trains and no doubt a good source of income. I've been thinking of shelling out on it myself as my arthritis gets worse; sell the car and have a nice seat to work instead.

 

[dp21]

Thanks as always for the info dp21. I did have the dates for the 321/3, I seem to remember they go off lease in October 2019 but that may have changed.

321 406 is now refreshed GA style, looks like they're all getting the treatment. Wouldn't have happened in NatEx days.

321 314 now has AC package along with 310, both not yet given refurb.

Quite welcome. Latest I have is that all 321s will be gone by December 2019. Renatus stay longest.

 

[F Great Eastern]

But I thought the 720 Aventras are mandated to have a certain number of seats in the franchise specification? If they're going to have First Class back in they're still going to have the same number of seats overall which means the rest are going to have to be bunched up even further in order to make it work? That's a retrograde step if true.

In relation to the fueling, where can DMU's be refueled and what is the diagrams like now in relation to proximity to refueling areas? I guess I'm asking theoretically how much distance does each diagram tend to do a day for them?

Sudbury Branch will not now work through to/from Colchester. This performance nightmare is a non-starter not least because of the foot crossing issues at Marks Tey. Never was the brightest idea on the aspiration list.

I heard previously this was something they committed to, but unsure whether that was in the franchise bid or something that was committed to outside of this?

Interesting now that reality is hitting home on a few aspirations.

Been saying it since day one, replacing the full fleet was pretty much headline grabbing from Abellio to look good and corners would have to be cut to deliver such a fleet as I couldn't see them doing that and meeting some of the other plans without some corners being cut somewhere or cuts to passenger comfort.

Whilst the retention of the 360/379 fleets for longer has calmed some of my fears, I am still skeptical about how this whole episode is going to turn out and there will be too made trade-offs made in the design, operation and specification of the new fleet in order to make the plan to replace everything viable.

 

[306024]

Interesting now that reality is hitting home on a few aspirations. Shame about the Sudbury service, I was looking forward to getting a Flirt from Colchester Town. Not a surprise about the 1st class issue, it's popular on commuter trains and no doubt a good source of income. I've been thinking of shelling out on it myself as my arthritis gets worse; sell the car and have a nice seat to work instead.

No different to all the previous bids to run trains in East Anglia. Lots of bright ideas by those who have little idea of the day to day practicalities, and then left to those few that do know to put it all right. The Sudbury to Colchester Town suggestion being a perfect example.