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Greater Anglia Rolling Stock Updates

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306024

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Everything is restricted until it is proven to be safe. It may never have been unsafe, but until you prove it and do all the paperwork restrictions will apply. This is particularly onerous for electric stock and the potential to interfere with signalling.
 

Class 170101

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SPZ is Signal Protection Zone. Basically only the relevent test train(s) can operate in the defined area and in the case of testing electric trains all other trains stabled within such a zone must have pantographs lowered so as not to interfere with any test results.

More to it than that but that's the basics.

And one feeder station feeding the test site I understand as well for electric testing. Must only be feeding the test site too.

Yes it must have been, I was not on duty, but the SPZ's are only Trowse - Norwich as you know ! The paperwork we now have says; DIESEL ONLY Liverpool Street to Bow Depot Junction and Ipswich to Needham Market: must be in diesel mode an pan lowered.
Can run with 1 pan raised Bow Depot Jct to Ipswich & Needham Market to Norwich.

SPZs Trowse to Diss I think based on what RTT published before otherwise it would be a short test site ;).
 

LAX54

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And one feeder station feeding the test site I understand as well for electric testing. Must only be feeding the test site too.



SPZs Trowse to Diss I think based on what RTT published before otherwise it would be a short test site ;).

Indeed the paperwork for SPZ's are for running Trowse to Diss, the actual 'zone is Haughley Junction to Trowse Junction, but as they say that it can run with one pan up under drawing power, then assume they are happyish with this, SPZ's still apply for 2 and 3 pans. (we are told triple pan test next week)
 

306024

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When the class 360s were the new kids on the block, one SPZ test was from Clacton to Chelmsford with 2 x 12 car trains passing each other. i.e. 6 pantographs raised in section. That seemed to satisfy all concerned.
 

LAX54

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When the class 360s were the new kids on the block, one SPZ test was from Clacton to Chelmsford with 2 x 12 car trains passing each other. i.e. 6 pantographs raised in section. That seemed to satisfy all concerned.

Clacton to Shenfield :) I suppose it was fortunate there were far less freights back then ! but sure the runs were just Clacton - Colchester

edit; SPZ 1 were Buffer Stops Clacton / Walton to CO11 / CO23 / CO14 within SPZ 1 only the test train(s) could run.

SPZ 2 went to Chelmsford.
SPZ 3 Colchester to Harwich/
SPZ 4 Clacton to Shenfield.

Then we had some similar ones for the 379 tests :)
 
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306024

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Certainly one test reversed at Chelmsford, but the SPZ would have gone to Shenfield. I remember as we stood on the down platform at about 03.00 watching a fight break out in Duke Street below. Blue lights and police running around. The German test engineers were most amused.
 

Trainfan344

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I've heard a rumour that the 755's power car is too wide to fit over Somerleyton Swing Bridge, which is why they've not made it to Lowestoft yet.
 

LAX54

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I've heard a rumour that the 755's power car is too wide to fit over Somerleyton Swing Bridge, which is why they've not made it to Lowestoft yet.

Think it was to do with the cameras fitted to the bridge, which I understand have now been moved clear :)
 

Railperf

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I was out and about across Anglia today riding Cambridge to Norwich , Ipswich to Cambridge and Ely. Also Norwich to Ipswich. Shame the Gt Yarmouth line was shut - so no 37's. A summary follows.
On a dry rail with a good 'pilot' those 90's give a fair shove in the back. But the interiors look soooooo dated. A UK Traxx loco and some new IC coaches would have been a nice replacement because the loco hauled stock does have a special feel about it. It will be missed except when it rains!!

The 170's are a pretty good unit -but today the Norwich to Cambridge service was full and almost standing. The incoming 755's with more than 3 coaches will be welcome. And if the 745/755s have the same interior feel as the Norwegian ones, then they will be a real comfy and high quality train to sit in. Those 170's are also feeling a bit tired internally.

The 2-car 170s on the Ipswich Peterboro service are again way too short in capacity. The longer bi-modes will be welcome. I guess the 755;s will accelerate well in electric mode, but not sure yet how they will fare on diesel. It will be good that the Ipswich to Cambridge/ Peterboro can use electric power from Ipswich to Haughley. And the Cambridge ones can get back on the 'juice from Ely down to Cambridge and possibly Stansted.
Seems hardly worth spending the money to be able to pan up just for the short section between browse Jn and Norwich. The 755;s can pan up In Norwich station as soon as they have landed. and then use the 'leccy' back out to Trowse.

it is a shame that the line speed limits of these secondary routes is mainly 75mph. We should be aiming for at least 90mph. The 170's are slow at getting even to 60mph on some of the steeper climbs! The bulk of both Ely to Norwich and Newmarket to Haughley is quite straight, so i guess it is block length and signalling issues rather than the trains. Also adding to the performance difficulties are single lead junctions at Haughty, Ely, plus singe track between Soham and Ely, the lack of grade separated junctions too.
does anyone know whether the 755's will be able run run at Sprinter (SP) speed limits?
But overall , i thought the secondary services on current form are quite respectable - reasonably frequent, and not too slow. I cannot wait to try the 755's s and compare. Last thought was that there should be a trolley on these trains, especially as Norwich to ely, and Ipswich to Cambridge are 1h20 journeys.
 

dk1

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There was trolley catering on almost every Norwich-Cambridge service from the relaunch in 2002 but was removed a few years later due to poor take up. It has often been mooted to put it back on trains such as the 06:33 & 07:34 ex-Norwich but these trains are often full & standing so would end up being static later in the journey. Very little chance of getting them on other routes such as out of Ipswich as all catering is recoursed from the Norwich base.
 

chubs

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Last thought was that there should be a trolley on these trains, especially as Norwich to ely, and Ipswich to Cambridge are 1h20 journeys.

That really isn't that long, and all those stations have cafes and kiosks that can offer much higher quality products than a trolley could.
 

ScotGG

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The Norwich to Cambridge is remaining at just 1 an hour? The East Midlands service is infrequent and skips a few places
 

ScotGG

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Frequency increases would be far more useful. Who's planning ahead here? Attleborough, for example, gave the green light to double the town and build 4k homes last week.
 

Grumbler

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Frequency increases would be far more useful. Who's planning ahead here? Attleborough, for example, gave the green light to double the town and build 4k homes last week.
Even more reason to upgrade the bridge at Trowse.
 

Trainfan344

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Cambridge Half Hourly all day, Lowestoft and Yarmouth Half hourly peak services would be great. But Greater Anglia clearely aren't expecting to significantly increase services anytime soon judging by the rolling stock ordered.
 

Class 170101

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Even more reason to upgrade the bridge at Trowse.

The bridge at Trowse isn't really the route's biggest problem. Ely North Jn needs sorting first. Frankly if you want more trains to stop at Attleborough and Wymondham its more likely to have to be provided by existing services on the route, and as GA already stop there it have to be by EMT.
 

Class 170101

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Cambridge Half Hourly all day, Lowestoft and Yarmouth Half hourly peak services would be great. But Greater Anglia clearely aren't expecting to significantly increase services anytime soon judging by the rolling stock ordered.

Great Yarmouth is already half hourly from about 16:30 to 18:40 departing Norwich and roughly half hourly 06:20 to 09:20 from Great Yarmouth.
 

Trainfan344

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Yes, and during Summer as well it gets half hourly, but Lowestoft still gets one train an hour apart from the 07:35/07:47...
 

trebor79

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I do wonder if a Norwich - Thetford and return all stations service, in between the existing hourly semi-fast would be a goer. Possibly with a new Attleborough South station to serve the extensive new developments.
Avoids the Ely problem until it's sorted, the services could then extend to Ely or Cambridge.
 

Trainfan344

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Not sure if signalling would permit it, but a xx:10 Norwich to Thetford service calling at Wymondham, Spooner Row (1tp2h), Attleborough, Attleborough South, Eccles Road, Harling Road (1tp2h?) and Thetford arriving in Thetford around xx:45 before departing on the current patten around xx:55 with the existing service retimed to depart xx:20 and arrive into Norwich with the East mids hot on it's heels.
 

anamyd

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Certainly one test reversed at Chelmsford, but the SPZ would have gone to Shenfield. I remember as we stood on the down platform at about 03.00 watching a fight break out in Duke Street below. Blue lights and police running around. The German test engineers were most amused.
oh wow :lol:
 

anamyd

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The 170's are a pretty good unit -but today the Norwich to Cambridge service was full and almost standing.

Those 170's are also feeling a bit tired internally.

The 2-car 170s on the Ipswich Peterboro service are again way too short in capacity.

The 170's are slow at getting even to 60mph on some of the steeper climbs!

After the 170s transfer to round my way in October you won't have to worry about them anymore :p
 

trebor79

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Not sure if signalling would permit it, but a xx:10 Norwich to Thetford service calling at Wymondham, Spooner Row (1tp2h), Attleborough, Attleborough South, Eccles Road, Harling Road (1tp2h?) and Thetford arriving in Thetford around xx:45 before departing on the current patten around xx:55 with the existing service retimed to depart xx:20 and arrive into Norwich with the East mids hot on it's heels.

Yes something like that, except the East Mids needs to preceede the GA as it does now. Otherwise folks have a long wait at Ely or Thetford.
 
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jopsuk

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If the bottlenecks could handle it, I'd advocate for an hourly all-stations Norwich-Stansted and an hourly Norwich-Thetford-Ely-Cambridge-Whittlesford-Audley End-Stansted. A proper fast service to connect the principal towns, and a true local service.
 

Trainfan344

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Yes something like that, except the East Mids needs to preceede the GA as it does now. Otherwise folks have a long wait at Ely or Thetford.

The East Mids does, but by the time the existing service retimed reaches Norwich the East Mids is only 5-10 minutes behind, Gives a roughly half hourly service from Ely.
 

Railperf

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After the 170s transfer to round my way in October you won't have to worry about them anymore :p
To be honest, they are a good train in many ways - very nice sized windows, very airy etc. And when i compared driving times from Norwich to Cambridge and Ely - overall journey times are on a par if not slightly quicker than driving. And probably our secondary services are far better than some European mainline trains!!
To be fair though, the 170's were cleaner and looked in better shape than a French Corail train I travelled on recently - those Corail coaches were some of the best around in their time - deemed to be equal or better than our beloved MK3's but looks like SNCF have left them to rot!!
 
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