Guard/conductor question

[Philip]

I'm considering a few options for a change of scenery from booking office; I'm currently thinking about Northern Control and the job of a guard. I don't know much about the Control environment, although I'm quite well read when it comes to diagrams and train movements, and I know my way around TRUST and realtimetrains etc.

I'm just interested to hear opinions about the role of the guard and specifically if you really do need to have a confident and assertive personality to succeed both through recruitment, training and in the job itself? I lack self confidence, not severely, but enough to sometimes tie myself in knots when faced with difficult customers and basically not always sound assured. I'm very knowledgable on tickets (as I should be!) and don't think learning the traction or routes would present a problem. I would probably enjoy the role when everything is fine and dandy.

But there is always that scenario when you have to deal with, in the correct manner, for example, a passenger on a busy train refusing to pay, or passengers firing questions in times of severe disruption. Is it critical to have good self confidence and assertiveness to have any chance in this role?

 

[CFRAIL]

I came into the conductor role as an external candidate and the emphasis seemed to be all about customer service and being safe/following rules etc...
As for trouble, you can always find it if you go looking... I don't waste too much time on those who refuse to pay for a ticket, I'll always engage with them to try and understand why and will try to reason with them when appropriate, but I won't force them off a train (on what authority anyway?) that just moves the problem to a colleagues train and causes unnecessary delays. Plus they're not worthy of my customer service since they've not paid for it. I will report them to the relevant teams however.
Confidence comes with experience and knowledge (you'll already have lots of that), the training is great which gives a solid foundation and you can build on that with instructors etc...

 

[Philip]

I came into the conductor role as an external candidate and the emphasis seemed to be all about customer service and being safe/following rules etc...
As for trouble, you can always find it if you go looking... I don't waste too much time on those who refuse to pay for a ticket, I'll always engage with them to try and understand why and will try to reason with them when appropriate, but I won't force them off a train (on what authority anyway?) that just moves the problem to a colleagues train and causes unnecessary delays. Plus they're not worthy of my customer service since they've not paid for it. I will report them to the relevant teams however.
Confidence comes with experience and knowledge (you'll already have lots of that), the training is great which gives a solid foundation and you can build on that with instructors etc...

Thanks for your help and insight. A non-confrontational manner sounds a good approach to take with awkward situations.

 

[Intermodal]

CFRAIL could not be more correct. You will encounter many difficult customers. Do you have to deal with them? No. Ask them to pay once, ask them for their name/address and when they inevitably refuse just walk away.

Contact the BTP and take great delight in seeing them assisted off the train at their destination station. Write a report. Job done!

Incidentally, you will find many guards who take the total opposite approach to this. They are always stressed and their trains are often delayed. The TOCs do not want guards to act like bouncers - the delay costs are far worse than the revenue loss. Let the relevant people deal with it.

Sometimes you will be faced with fights, drunken passengers, aggressive passengers, etc. The same principle applies. If you feel that you are able to deal with the situation yourself, then do, if not, get the BTP to attend. It's their responsibility to police. You look after the safety of the train and then if possible collect some money.

 

[Undiscovered]

Good advice above.

My tuppence worth is to just take a moment to weigh things up. You'll see stuff and it's easy to get caught up in it, so much so that you risk losing oversight. Your primary responsibility is the safe running of trains and the railway, everything else is secondary. Be polite, be calm, be professional.

You and the driver are a team. He's your backup. If it's all going off, give him a heads up. That way, if the doors don't open at the next station, or you dont get back to him in a certain time, he knows you're in the brown!

Also, if you make a decision, stick to it. You'll be given all the training you need to make that decision- everyone will have their opinions but the buck stops with you.

And don't ever take threats of violence to you lightly. Txt BTP with your headcode and that you're a guard and they will come and sort it out. It's what they're there for and they'll send civil Police if they can respond quicker. It does work.

That said 99% of the job is a pleasure. It's the 1% that you earn your money for.
I was an external candidate, from a very secure field previously, and I wouldn't change this for the world.

 

[Philip]

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[185]

a passenger on a busy train refusing to pay, or passengers firing questions in times of severe disruption. Is it critical to have good self confidence and assertiveness to have any chance in this role?

Assertiveness is something you pick up with experience, but there is always the one thing to bear in mind with a non-paying passenger... forget em. Think of the wage, and ask is the quarrel worth it? Offer the UPFN (pay later) if they don't want to give details, you can ask them to get off, bluff them about the police, but in reality no more - your priority is to the paying customers and the companys performance / punctuality. But.... a time will come when a little horror has refused everything and the old bill step on...

In terms of passengers firing questions in the event of service disruption, your best tool in the conductor arsenal is the PA system - more information, clear explanations, no waffle = less questions when you do walk through. Keep them updated, announce to them "as soon as I get any more information I will announce it straight away."

As for control ... I wouldn't want to work in there... seen several leave traincrew roles to go work in there.... many came back.

 

[Philip]

Assertiveness is something you pick up with experience, but there is always the one thing to bear in mind with a non-paying passenger... forget em. Think of the wage, and ask is the quarrel worth it? Offer the UPFN (pay later) if they don't want to give details, you can ask them to get off, bluff them about the police, but in reality no more - your priority is to the paying customers and the companys performance / punctuality. But.... a time will come when a little horror has refused everything and the old bill step on...

In terms of passengers firing questions in the event of service disruption, your best tool in the conductor arsenal is the PA system - more information, clear explanations, no waffle = less questions when you do walk through. Keep them updated, announce to them "as soon as I get any more information I will announce it straight away."

As for control ... I wouldn't want to work in there... seen several leave traincrew roles to go work in there.... many came back.

Thanks again for the excellent feedback. Control must be pretty stressful whenever there is significant disruption.

 

[Steam Man]

I came into the conductor role as an external candidate and the emphasis seemed to be all about customer service and being safe/following rules etc...
As for trouble, you can always find it if you go looking... I don't waste too much time on those who refuse to pay for a ticket, I'll always engage with them to try and understand why and will try to reason with them when appropriate, but I won't force them off a train (on what authority anyway?) that just moves the problem to a colleagues train and causes unnecessary delays. Plus they're not worthy of my customer service since they've not paid for it. I will report them to the relevant teams however.
Confidence comes with experience and knowledge (you'll already have lots of that), the training is great which gives a solid foundation and you can build on that with instructors etc...

I came into the conductor role as an external candidate and the emphasis seemed to be all about customer service and being safe/following rules etc...
As for trouble, you can always find it if you go looking... I don't waste too much time on those who refuse to pay for a ticket, I'll always engage with them to try and understand why and will try to reason with them when appropriate, but I won't force them off a train (on what authority anyway?) that just moves the problem to a colleagues train and causes unnecessary delays. Plus they're not worthy of my customer service since they've not paid for it. I will report them to the relevant teams however.
Confidence comes with experience and knowledge (you'll already have lots of that), the training is great which gives a solid foundation and you can build on that with instructors etc...

Would the confidence experience and knowledge help me because I’ve worked on a heritage railway and I’m also a Instructor Mentor Trainer as well whatever you want to call it

 

[craigybagel]

I wanted a guards job right from when I started on the railway in catering - but I too had the same worries about my own self confidence and dealing with conflict and so on, so I took a secondment to a busy WCML interchange station and worked on the platforms there.

15 months of that gave me all the experience I needed! I got more abuse on platforms in a week then I ever got in a year onboard as a guard. It was a great education in people skills, and made my subsequent time as a guard so much easier.

 

[Rover77]

Hi. I'm interested in a conductor role with Northern. Is the advertised wage after training it bar overtime or is there shift allowance and extra for Sundays? Thanks in advance

 

[Intermodal]

Hi. I'm interested in a conductor role with Northern. Is the advertised wage after training it bar overtime or is there shift allowance and extra for Sundays? Thanks in advance

No shift allowance. Sundays paid as overtime - paid at 1.25x (average once a month rostered with option to get more). Usually easy enough to get a few days overtime a month at most depots (but less so since coronavirus). Extra days work is paid at 1.15x. Overtime during a shift paid at flat rate. 3% commission on ticket sales and 2p per ticket scan.

 

[Rover77]

No shift allowance. Sundays paid as overtime - paid at 1.25x (average once a month rostered with option to get more). Usually easy enough to get a few days overtime a month at most depots (but less so since coronavirus). Extra days work is paid at 1.15x. Overtime during a shift paid at flat rate. 3% commission on ticket sales and 2p per ticket scan.

Thanks for the swift response and the detailed answer.

 

[Horizon22]

Thanks again for the excellent feedback. Control must be pretty stressful whenever there is significant disruption.

I know you asked about guard more than Control, but having done both its different types of stress; the former is more stressful for the conflict scenarios, the latter is due to significant step ups in workload and balancing priorities.