gazthomas
Established Member
This does make me think though, if an operator had flexibility to go where they liked what where would they go? I remember FGW had plans for a London service once upon a time and there are countless others.
I remember FGW had plans for a London service once upon a time and there are countless others.
Wouldn't it make so much more sense for the proposal to be a XC service from Brighton towards London, then to Reading, Birmingham, Nottingham before carrying on to Glasgow via the S&C?![]()
He was indeed making the point that it would be very long, impracticable and pointless, yes.Um. Wouldn't that be an excessively long way to get to Glasgow?
He was indeed making the point that it would be very long, impracticable and pointless, yes.
Um. Wouldn't that be an excessively long way to get to Glasgow?
I think he was having a little dig at the many threads that have cropped up on the Forum from time to time all more or less titled "My idea for Cross Country......" which came up with suggestions with some calling at the most absurd stations, taking the most circuitous routes, take outrageous extended journey times and an insistence that Brighton should have it's XC service restored.
As for Paddington - Birmingham, maybe it was an idea in the dark days of the 1980s when the Chiltern route was run down with Marylebone being suggested to close in exchange for a coach station, but these days with a roughly half hourly service from Marylebone to Moor Street/Snow Hill, a Paddington -> Reading - Oxford -> Birmingham service would seem to be complete and utter pointless.
Oh I see! Thank you for the clarification!![]()
Used to be Glasgow/Edinburgh to Brightons .
I know your young as you use ' oh' a lot![]()
The rail networks within PFMv4.3 include a representation of a timetable and its
associated capacity. The ‘Do Minimum’ provides a reference against which the ‘Do
Something’ HS2 option is compared.
5.1.2 With a few exceptions, the ‘Do Minimum’ timetable assumptions are based on
committed schemes only. The ‘Do Minimum’ makes use of information provided by
the DfT for Network Rail services and Transport for London (TfL) for London
Underground Limited (LUL) services. The rail and LUL ‘Do Minimum’ networks are
assumed to be identical in the 2026 and 2036 (cap year models).
5.1.3 These assumptions are designed only for the purpose of providing an indicative
reference case for the appraisal of HS2. It should be noted that no decisions have
yet been taken about train service requirements – or which stock will operate
them – in any of the relevant franchises, and therefore these service patterns
should be considered to be indicative.
5.1.4 In the PLD model these assumptions relate to the average service pattern on
weekdays. Information used within the Regional Planet models relates to services
during the Morning Period. Within these assumptions, no work has been under...
The key points of the specification assumed for PFMv4.3 are:
The introduction of an hourly service operating between Birmingham New
Street and London Paddington;
Coincidentally, I've only just found out about this document, in which the proposal is made for a Kidderminster to Paddington service (among other things). This would be the closest that GWR gets to Birmingham, IF it were to go ahead.
www.worcestershire.gov.uk/download/downloads/id/8264/worcestershire_rail_investment_strategy.pdf
Interesting, so basically the Worcester terminators would just continue to Kidderminster. Pretty sure BR used to run that exact service up until around 1993? Would be nice to see a 80x at Kidderminster though, even if it does take the long way round to London.
Coincidentally, I've only just found out about this document, in which the proposal is made for a Kidderminster to Paddington service (among other things). This would be the closest that GWR gets to Birmingham, IF it were to go ahead.
www.worcestershire.gov.uk/download/downloads/id/8264/worcestershire_rail_investment_strategy.pdf
Interesting, so basically the Worcester terminators would just continue to Kidderminster. Pretty sure BR used to run that exact service up until around 1993? Would be nice to see a 80x at Kidderminster though, even if it does take the long way round to London.
Yeah there was a service from Stourbridge to Paddington, which the Stourbridge line user group have mentioned on their website. Personally, I'd like to see a New Street/Kidderminster/Stourbridge to Paddington service for the same reason as you.
I could see that a semi fast service from Paddington to Birmingham could attract enough passengers to make it worth doing, but only because it wouldn't be trying to capture any London to Birmingham flows.
For instance have it call at Slough, (Maidenhead?) Reading, Didcot, Oxford, Banbury and then a few more stations depending on the route into Birmingham and it could work.
It would be quicker from Slough than changing trains at Reading. It would allow people to travel from the West and change at Didcot, potentially makong it faster. It would provide more capacity between Oxford and Banbury.
If it replaces an existing semi fast Oxford terminator than it wouldn't need an extra path out of London and wouldn't require a lot more rolling stock.
As such I can see that there could be a reasonable case to provide such a service, but only if it isn't trying to compete for London Birmingham passengers.
It would be like a lot of XC services, fairly busy but vitally no one uses it for end to end travel.
I'm surprised that this would crop up in a government document. Does Birmingham need 4 TOCs on three routes providing services to London (not including HS2).
Always worth quoting sources, OP, so that people don't dismiss what you're saying, if it's correct.
Or you could just increase capacity where it is actually needed - between Birmingham and Reading - by putting longer trains on XC services between Birmingham, Reading and the South Coast and make every other one call at Didcot on its way between Oxford and Reading.
The pathetic carrying capacity of its existing trains would appear to be the only reason XC has not already asked for permission to make some experimental calls at Didcot to test potential demand there.
It is a very different place from the town Virgin pulled services from in 2002, with the population up from 23,000 in 2001 to 31,000+ now and set reach 60,000 by 2031 as a result of the Garden Town development - making it bigger than Banbury.
Or you could just increase capacity where it is actually needed - between Birmingham and Reading - by putting longer trains on XC services between Birmingham, Reading and the South Coast and make every other one call at Didcot on its way between Oxford and Reading.
The pathetic carrying capacity of its existing trains would appear to be the only reason XC has not already asked for permission to make some experimental calls at Didcot to test potential demand there.
It is a very different place from the town Virgin pulled services from in 2002, with the population up from 23,000 in 2001 to 31,000+ now and set reach 60,000 by 2031 as a result of the Garden Town development - making it bigger than Banbury.
Yes Wikipedia, accurate to the last
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That's a loony eclipse no a lunar one. They tend to occur during Labour party leadership elections.
With the growth in rail passengers since privatisation even with a increase in capacity in the XC trains there could still be a good case for a third train an hour as that would further attract people.
However, it is likely that GWR would be able to provide their service faster than XC could introduce longer trains.
Which way are GWR expecting to go with this mythical service? They aren't going via Coventry for a start and you are going to have big problems getting much more in north of Dorridge without a nice trundle behind something else.
Does a path through Dorridge become free if CrossCountry manage to meet their aspiration to get all their services routed via Coventry? (Not that it is obvious how CrossCountry do that as Arriva Trains Wales have their service to Birmingham International on the opposite side of the hour.)
Best answer for GWR to get to Birmingham is to get the line through Stratford-upon-Avon reopened but clearly there is absolutely no chance of that.