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GWR season ticket renwal discount query

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darkgs

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Hi - I have tried searching extensively but have been unable to find an answer.

I renewed my season ticket from Reading to London Zones 1 - 6 this week.
Renewals on this line have discounts offered for renewals when GWR fall below targets show here: https://www.gwr.com/help-and-support/refunds-and-compensation/season-ticket-compensation.

My question is, is Reading to Paddington counted as High Speed or Thames Valley?

When I renewed I was not issued a discount after requesting the discount on Thames Valley.
Speaking to an advisor at Abellio Corporate travel, they said my journey is not valid for the discount as it counts as High Speed.

Anyone know whether it is High Speed or Thames Valley?

Thanks
Kevin
 
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CyrusWuff

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Whilst both Service Groups could apply (ditto for London - Didcot Parkway), in reality the vast majority of people will use High Speed services given the time penalty incurred by using the LTV ones, so Abellio are technically correct.

You might be able to get them to relent if you can get something in writing from GWR saying what they'd do in such circumstances.
 

IainH

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I had this debate a while back when renewing a season. Thames Valley was then defined where "Former First Great Western Link" was the fare setter. GWR advised at the time that this was all services London to Oxford and Bedwyn. London to Reading was therefore set by FGWL, and I checked this in a fares manual at the time. However, when it came to applying the charter discount, GWR changed their mind and decided they had made a mistake and Reading was High Speed.

The claim that Thames Valley is former FGWL is still hidden away at the bottom of this page, https://www.gwr.com/help-and-support/refunds-and-compensation/season-ticket-compensation , if you click the banner that says "The Small Print".

At the time, and checking again now, there is nothing on the GWR website that advises which group a route is in. Which feels incorrect. In Kevins case, if Reading is High Speed, would Tilehurst or Twyford be Thames Valley? It would appear an unfair contract term to not be able to have a clear definition of which service group a ticket comes under. All GWR/ex FGWL fares are now showing as set by GWR, so it is not possible to tell if they were previously FGWL or not unless you have an old fares manual with the relevant fare in it. So maybe go back and say as London to Reading was priced by FGWL, it should be in Thames Valley? If anyone does have an old fares manual....
 

bb21

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Reading to Paddington would be High Speed.

Generally speaking, under BR rules at privatisation, intercity service groups trump other ones where services of multiple service groups can be used, for the reason CyrusWuff explained, and charter renewal schemes are all essentially extensions to legacy BR schemes.

Where a Travelcard is involved, there may be opportunities to declare a different service group by nominating the regular journey, but this needs to be done at the time of purchase, however Reading to Zones 1-6 is unlikely to realistically fall in that category as only one Zone 1 station exists on the GWML. You cannot declare a different outboundary station to the one printed (if applicable), only the inboundary station.

If the Travelcard were Reading to Zones 3-6, or Tilehurst to Zones 1-6, I suspect either would fall under Thames Valley.

Charter renewal discount has nothing to do with fare-setters. It is dependent on the service group of the journey undertaken.
 

nickswift99

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Reading to Paddington would be High Speed.

Generally speaking, under BR rules at privatisation, intercity service groups trump other ones where services of multiple service groups can be used, for the reason CyrusWuff explained, and charter renewal schemes are all essentially extensions to legacy BR schemes.

Where a Travelcard is involved, there may be opportunities to declare a different service group by nominating the regular journey, but this needs to be done at the time of purchase, however Reading to Zones 1-6 is unlikely to realistically fall in that category as only one Zone 1 station exists on the GWML. You cannot declare a different outboundary station to the one printed (if applicable), only the inboundary station.

If the Travelcard were Reading to Zones 3-6, or Tilehurst to Zones 1-6, I suspect either would fall under Thames Valley.

Charter renewal discount has nothing to do with fare-setters. It is dependent on the service group of the journey undertaken.

So how does that work for a "Reading Stations" ticket where the starting station is Reading West?
 

bb21

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So how does that work for a "Reading Stations" ticket where the starting station is Reading West?
I don't know as I have not come across a similar scenario in my line of work, but I suspect you will either need to have pre-declared a journey or have some other form of evidence to show your link to the station for a claim from Reading West station, eg. a close by residential address, a purchase history from the station, etc.
 

IainH

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in my case, which I didn't explain fully, the journey was Basingstoke to Paddington and that was advised as being part of the high speed service group, after initially being told Thames Valley. If correct, that implies Reading West also High Speed.

How do you 'pre-declare' a journey on a season with multiple routes or origin/destination points, as Reading to London tickets season tickets all permit a variety? Fairness would say if this was an issue affecting renewal discounts, this should be pro-actively sought by the train company at the point of issue?

This all becomes moot if it was possible to look up a station pair on a list that is publicly available and see which charter discount applies. If both groups could apply, surely the group most financially advantageous to the customer should be applied each year? And this should be explained in the passenger charter?
 

CyrusWuff

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The default position for Basingstoke - London would be that it falls under South Western Railway's charter scheme (and thus Delay Repay), given they provide the bulk of the service (and all of the direct trains).

Logically, there should have been a list of what service group a given flow belonged to at privatisation, but I've not been able to track one down.
 

IainH

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Not sure I agree, the via Woking ticket is priced by SWT and therefore is under their scheme, but the any permitted ticket is priced by GWR and therefore would come under the GWR scheme? But agree there should have been a list at that time, possibly an FOI would be the only way to get it now. Although looking at the original post, Abellio must have looked at something to come to the conclusion they did.
 
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