GWR Shortage of Traincrew Weekend and During Week

Discussion in 'Allocations, Diagrams & Timetables' started by PHILIPE, 25 Jun 2017.

  1. PHILIPE

    PHILIPE Established Member

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    Swansea drivers would have been working to Bridgend and return. To continue, the cancellation to Cheltenham services has spread to this evening.
     
  2. Weekender

    Weekender Member

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    GWR always give me the impression that the Cheltenham service is a nuisance to them, if they need to cancel any train it’s always the first to go.
    I think even when Bristol goes to four trains per hour they will still sacrifice Cheltenham services if there is any disruption or staff shortages.
     
  3. JN114

    JN114 Established Member

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    Not quite - in short it’s easier. For example with Paddington crew, the Cheltenhams are almost always same crew out and back; whereas Bristols will work train down, have a break and then work a different train back.

    A driver not being available to cover a job to Bristol would likely result in 4 trains cancelled (the separate down and up workings plus their corresponding other direction workings); whereas you can take a driver off a Cheltenham and have them work those Bristols - 2 cancellations not 4.

    Minimising the number of cancellations is ultimately the number 1 objective; if one line has to unfortunately bare the brunt for the greater majority then so be it. Believe me given the costs involved we’d rather not cancel anything.
     
  4. FGW_DID

    FGW_DID Established Member

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    1G70 and it’s return working were cancelled this evening due to a short notice driver sickness.
     
  5. ForTheLoveOf

    ForTheLoveOf Established Member

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    In almost any other industry it'd not be a case of "would you like to?", but rather "we are changing your contract to require you to work on Sundays, and are paying you just the same". Those who didn't agree would have to leave.

    But this is the rail industry, where two main factors mean that it's never going to happen that way. Firstly, the fact that it's so unusually heavily unionised - so companies would be very wary of strikes, and secondly the fact that it takes so long to train drivers. But if companies were happy to take on a degree of risk - perhaps with the support of the DfT (ha, ha, ha) - then it might be possible to overcome these issues.
     
  6. Llanigraham

    Llanigraham On Moderation

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    That suggests you have a very simplistic understanding of employment legislation, labour relations and negotiations between companies, unions and workers.
    And it most certainly does NOT just apply to the rail industry.
     
  7. Mag_seven

    Mag_seven Established Member

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    What other industries does it apply to then?
     
  8. JN114

    JN114 Established Member

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    No in fairness I think they acknowledge the unions wouldn’t have any of it in their second paragraph.

    Whether that is right or not is a whole different question. Personally I think it’s a model all industries should work to - consulting staff (or their representatives) on changes to the business that move the goalposts of what we as staff originally signed up to. High employment turnover isn’t good for anyone as it lowers productivity - especially in professions like train drivers where there is a long lead in time for new recruits. To the comments of it’s only in the railway industry - it’s similar in the medical industry; in aviation - generally jobs which are very high skill, or require significant investment of time and money through the recruitment process.
     
  9. Llanigraham

    Llanigraham On Moderation

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    Try nearly every industry that accepts that good relations with the workers, black, grey or white collared, is important.

    And has been said numerous times on this Forum, it is the TOC's themselves who aren't pushing for adding Sunday to the working week.
     
  10. tiptoptaff

    tiptoptaff Established Member

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    Sundays inside is an ASLEF charter aim. It'll be on GWR soon enough.
     
  11. EE Andy b1

    EE Andy b1 Member

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    That is correct, but plenty of drivers don't want Sundays as part of there working week, just to have another Tuesday or Wednesday off, then struggling to cover there Sunday when having something else on.
     
  12. Cardiff123

    Cardiff123 Member

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    Train drivers should say that to people who work in the many other public services that run 7 days a week in this country, that have no choice in whether they work Sundays, and see what kind of response they get.
     
  13. JN114

    JN114 Established Member

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    Let’s not open that can of worms.
     
  14. Martin1504

    Martin1504 Member

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    If train drivers don't want to work Sundays then they are clearly in the wrong job. This is 2019, get with the times or let others do the job who are prepared to work Sundays.
     
  15. tiptoptaff

    tiptoptaff Established Member

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    A lot of the time, newer crew who come in to train crew roles, who have had to work Sundays elsewhere, are the ones who chuck in their Sundays now
     
  16. Llanigraham

    Llanigraham On Moderation

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    Why?
    Do many Civil Servants or Council workers work Sundays? Or garage mechanics? I could go on.
    At the moment very few ToCs have included Sunday's in their working week, and neither has Network Rail for its staff and I see very little movement by them to do this.
     
  17. Martin1504

    Martin1504 Member

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    Strange t & C's when a driver can opt out of a Sunday even when the company can't cover the work with a spare or rest day driver. GWR need to get Sundays into the working week ASAP, even if that means paying the price for them.
     
  18. tiptoptaff

    tiptoptaff Established Member

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    Technically, they can't. But as it's committed overtime, there are times when there's not enough committed people to cover the service - leave, sickness, extra trains for events, etc
     
  19. Martin1504

    Martin1504 Member

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    So why don't gwr say every time a driver opts out ' sorry you can't, we can't cover your job on sunday' ? ASLEF and gwr need their heads banging together.
     
  20. tiptoptaff

    tiptoptaff Established Member

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    They do on occasion. Lots of N/A Declined on the Sunday sheets this week
     
  21. Mintona

    Mintona Established Member

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    Train drivers at GWR are employed on two separate contracts too. ‘GWR drivers’ are the new standard (any new starter will be a GWR driver) and are committed to work their Sundays if cover can’t be found. ‘HSS drivers’ have no such commitment and are perfectly entitled to not come in for any Sunday if they so wish. GWR drivers do pretty much the ex-LTV and Wessex services, whilst HSS drivers do the long distance high speed work.
     
  22. dk1

    dk1 Established Member

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    I'm not one to throw my toys out of the pram & if declined always expect to come in but normally the duty traoncrew managers bust a gut & offer all sorts to get me & others off if they can bless them. There are however others who do not have so much of a conscience and will not come in no matter what. They may get spoken to at some point but there isn't much the company can do realistically so get away with it every time.
     
  23. Mitchell Hurd

    Mitchell Hurd Member

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    Looks like the London - Cheltenham services once again suffer from staff shortages today.

    Not just that, there are 2 or a few Penzance to London diagrams that are 10 coaches instead of 5 between Penzance and Plymouth.

    Gonna be a fun day then!
     
  24. tiptoptaff

    tiptoptaff Established Member

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    Yes, 10v5 is an outrage.....
     
  25. Mitchell Hurd

    Mitchell Hurd Member

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    I know this is a bit irrelevant but I wouldn't be surprised if several of the IET services to and from London and Penzance run without catering too. There was a good few complaints on GWR's Twitter feed yesterday about poor catering on some routes.

    I'm not one for ranting like people do when replying to a pinned tweet (a tweet where GWR advertise fares, deals and offers etc). If I do, then it's more of an honest opinion / concern.

    To be honest, I'm very nearly wanting to join the list of people that want the buffet car back. More people wanted an at-seat service. However, I bet those people regret saying that now.
     
  26. Tim456

    Tim456 Member

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    Extra capacity where there have been issues on IET services between Plymouth and Penzance, that’s a good thing isn’t it?
     
  27. CC 72100

    CC 72100 Established Member

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    There was no catering on my East Mids teain between St Pancras and Nottingham either yesterday... on a Saturday. #outrage
     
  28. Weekender

    Weekender Member

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    Only 16 cancellations and 6 partially cancelled when I looked this morning. Better but still not good enough.
     
  29. SN1 19-5

    SN1 19-5 Member

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    In my job, I can be out all day, then out all night as well. This isn't a problem as, I've been doing it for years. They do pay overtime where I am at the mo. This did cause problems at timesheet time. The high ups don't like to see 27 hours nonstop on a timesheet.

    I was working 300 miles away from where I live last year, I offered to work six days on the trot (Tues-Sun start) then rolling on, just so that work would have cover on certain weekends and I could have a jolly or two when I eventually got home.. 300 miles away!

    I only did Tues-Fri on normal work rota stuff at the time.

    Work declined my offer. I am a one off. My situation isn't normal. I do what has to be done.

    Driving trains on Sundays has to be done. Maybe I should apply for a job?

    Nahh.
     
  30. CharlesR

    CharlesR Member

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    62k a year is quite appealing
     

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