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GWR Shortage of Traincrew Weekend and During Week

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PHILIPE

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Very bad day for HSS services today with Cheltenham and Swansea/Carmarthen routes suffering badly. There are some buses running on the Golden Valley connecting at Swindon and from Swansea to Cardiff to connect with Cardiff to Portsmouth (although Westbury only today due to Engineering Work) to Bristol TM, just putting overcrowding onto these.
 
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PHILIPE

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It would have been easier for GWR to list on Journey Check today what was actually running Between Bristol TM, Newport (Vice Swansea due Engrs work) and Cheltenham than list all the cancellations.
 

Mag_seven

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More cancellations to High Speed services today. In addition all this week up to Thursday the 17.36 Padd-Cheltenham is only running as far as Swindon with a connection into a DMU at Swindon (as announced on an up service from Cheltenham this morning).
 

PHILIPE

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More cancellations to High Speed services today. In addition all this week up to Thursday the 17.36 Padd-Cheltenham is only running as far as Swindon with a connection into a DMU at Swindon (as announced on an up service from Cheltenham this morning).

There was no connection at Swindon after all today, cancelled "due to problem under investigation"
 

father_jack

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More cancellations to High Speed services today. In addition all this week up to Thursday the 17.36 Padd-Cheltenham is only running as far as Swindon with a connection into a DMU at Swindon (as announced on an up service from Cheltenham this morning).
That's to do with an IET diagram issue, if it's an IET the set can't get back on to North Pole at night due to engineering works. It's actually a good rearrangement using a unit up the Stroud valley.
 

tgrb

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IMG_1359.PNG IMG_1358.PNG Some moaning on twitter about a lot of cancellations due to crew shortages

Gwr journey check also has a big warning on it!

Looks like all Extra rugby trains cancelled too - Cardiff will be chaos later as is I expect Paddington as I type
 

Mag_seven

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Looks like all Extra rugby trains cancelled too - Cardiff will be chaos later as is I expect Paddington as I type

Given the issues they are now facing every Sunday in trying to run even a normal timetable, I don't think planning to run additional services was a particularly good idea.
 

PHILIPE

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Disastrous today with many HSS services cancelled between Paddington and South Wales (Anthony Joshua fight in Cardiff tonight) and several between Paddington and Bath together with many on the Cotswolds route.
 

Parallel

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I suffered the lack of train crew yesterday - Having completed an Explore Wales pass I ended up in Swansea and my train to Swindon was cancelled and I had to wait an hour for the next one. Not a single cancellation on ATW’s side (and I used a lot of their trains)- and two from GWR - both TOC related (lack of train crew and train fault)
 

PHILIPE

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Mass cancellations today between Paddington and South Wales and Bath Spa. Strangely, against recent form, the Cotswolds have escaped
 

Kite159

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Mass cancellations today between Paddington and South Wales and Bath Spa. Strangely, against recent form, the Cotswolds have escaped

How much longer can it continue before any potential passengers decide that the hassle of taking the train isn't worth it due to cancellations and decide to use their cars to drive to stations on alternative routes (i.e. how many passengers for Hanborough now drive to Oxford Parkway for the more reliable [and frequent] Chiltern services).
 

Mag_seven

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How much longer can it continue before any potential passengers decide that the hassle of taking the train isn't worth it due to cancellations and decide to use their cars to drive to stations on alternative routes (i.e. how many passengers for Hanborough now drive to Oxford Parkway for the more reliable [and frequent] Chiltern services).

Its clear that the GWML is becoming a bit of a no go area on Sundays especially as this situation continues. Key questions are:

1.What are GwR doing about it?
2. Is the DfT on GwR's back to get it sorted?
 

Dai Corner

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Its clear that the GWML is becoming a bit of a no go area on Sundays especially as this situation continues. Key questions are:

1.What are GwR doing about it?
2. Is the DfT on GwR's back to get it sorted?

I have read about the DfT looking into contracts where a supplier would provide train and crew. Apparently this is quite common in the aviation industry and, of course, normal in the bus/coach world. Whether anything will happen or whether it's intended to address situations like this I don't know.
 

jimm

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Its clear that the GWML is becoming a bit of a no go area on Sundays especially as this situation continues. Key questions are:

1.What are GwR doing about it?
2. Is the DfT on GwR's back to get it sorted?

I don't think anything is clear - as PHILIPE notes, today the Cotswold Line seems to have escaped cancellations - thus far at least - whereas yesterday there were so many cancellations as to render the service almost unusable.

Whether better incentives were on offer to staff to turn out today rather than yesterday, others may know, but clarity and certainty about what trains might be running on which days have been utterly lacking over the past four months or so. All it needs is for a couple of people to call in sick, or not enough volunteers to work a rest day, and that blows a hole in the timetable.

In the case of Oxford/Cotswold services, there seems to have been some issue over IET training for Oxford drivers and subsequent terms and conditions for staff based there, which has left other depots to try to cover all the services via Oxford worked by IETs. Some days that works out, other days it doesn't.

MPs have certainly been on the DfT's case but after the Southern debacle, I get the feeling there isn't a great deal of enthusiasm among DfT ministers for another trench war with the unions. Try to start a fight over making Sunday working part of contracts and there would be no trains anywhere in the country on a Sunday.

It looks as though GWR's policy is just to grit their teeth and get though to the end of the IET training programme (which in the case of the recently-created Worcester depot is compounded by the need for traction training on other types as well, depending on where staff have transferred from, plus route learning) - it should not be forgotten that GWR's IET training did not start until last September, rather than May, due to issues over use of the Didcot-Reading section for that purpose.
 
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Envoy

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Can someone clarify - that train drivers in all companies are not compelled to work Sundays and that ‘volunteers’ are needed to run the Sunday services? Does this also apply to guards/train managers? Is it true that those who do volunteer earn double money?
 

father_jack

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Can someone clarify - that train drivers in all companies are not compelled to work Sundays and that ‘volunteers’ are needed to run the Sunday services? Does this also apply to guards/train managers? Is it true that those who do volunteer earn double money?
Depends on the personal/grade contract. Some have been renegotiated putting Sunday in the working week. A lot of maintenance staff have Sunday in the normal week. Most traincrew and station staff though are "expected" to work their booked/rostered Sundays for usually 120 or 125% of regular pay. However you can't be disciplined for reasonably making yourself unavailable in good time. Stories do go around of staff getting incentives to come in when there are say, no "yes-men" crew managers etc left in the pot to run the service. 12 hours pay say and a day off extra fro a 6 hour job say......
 
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Envoy

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Depends on the personal contract. Some have been renegotiated putting Sunday in the working week. A lot of maintenance staff have Sunday in the normal week. Most traincrew and station staff though are "expected" to work their booked/rostered Sundays for usually 120 or 125% of regular pay. However you can't be disciplined for reasonably making yourself unavailable in good time. Stories do go around of staff getting incentives to come in when there are say, no "yes-men" crew managers etc left in the pot to run the service. 12 hours pay say and a day off extra fro a 6 hour job say......

Many thanks for that.
 
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Tim456

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Four trains in a row between Paddington-Bath Spa and return all cancelled this evening. Big deal you may say but when the service is reduced to hourly owing to the work at Bristol it’s left a huge 4 hour gap in service both ways.
 

father_jack

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Four trains in a row between Paddington-Bath Spa and return all cancelled this evening. Big deal you may say but when the service is reduced to hourly owing to the work at Bristol it’s left a huge 4 hour gap in service both ways.
1814,1914 and 2114 arrivals at Bath are indeed cancelled
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/sea...AD/2018/04/01/2038?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt
But saying "traincrew shortage" is a little incorrect because it could be-
no crew,
no traction trained crew (driver or guard),
usual Sunday volunteers booking on early tomorrow for training
protecting later services
 

philthetube

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1814,1914 and 2114 arrivals at Bath are indeed cancelled
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/sea...AD/2018/04/01/2038?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt
But saying "traincrew shortage" is a little incorrect because it could be-
no crew,
no traction trained crew (driver or guard),
usual Sunday volunteers booking on early tomorrow for training
protecting later services
All of these are train crew shortage, be it not enough crew to cover all the staff we needed to send for training or not enough crew to cover the ones training tomorrow or not enough crew to run the late trains so we are cancelling the earlier ones.
 

Mag_seven

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All of these are train crew shortage, be it not enough crew to cover all the staff we needed to send for training or not enough crew to cover the ones training tomorrow or not enough crew to run the late trains so we are cancelling the earlier ones.

Why do GWR plan to run a full TT every Sunday when they know they have next to zero chance of running it?
 

Parallel

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I'm due to travel between Swindon and London Paddington next Sunday, on a Class 800 originating from Cheltenham Spa. I'm going to try and defy all odds. :D
 

father_jack

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All of these are train crew shortage, be it not enough crew to cover all the staff we needed to send for training or not enough crew to cover the ones training tomorrow or not enough crew to run the late trains so we are cancelling the earlier ones.
Thank you for repeating what I said !!! But seriously the bottom line is nobody could come to work on one Sunday soon, managers and all !!!!
 

railfan100

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It is only a matter of time until the driver grade is finished as is the writing on the wall for the guard grade. I do not agree to this but it is the way that things are moving. Having spent much time in the Gulf recently and observing the Dubai Metro operating over many miles in a totally automatic way and every service running totally on time it is where the UK rail network is trying to get to in terms of technology. The driver grade in less than 20 years will be finished and a thing of the past. Most of the world considers driving trains as a role that is not highly skilled, look at the salary figures in other countries it is a poorly paid role and one ripe for automation.
 

Dai Corner

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It is only a matter of time until the driver grade is finished as is the writing on the wall for the guard grade. I do not agree to this but it is the way that things are moving. Having spent much time in the Gulf recently and observing the Dubai Metro operating over many miles in a totally automatic way and every service running totally on time it is where the UK rail network is trying to get to in terms of technology. The driver grade in less than 20 years will be finished and a thing of the past. Most of the world considers driving trains as a role that is not highly skilled, look at the salary figures in other countries it is a poorly paid role and one ripe for automation.

Doesn't the GWML have a system to advise drivers what speed they should be doing to keep on schedule while minimising fuel consumption? It doesn't appear to be a huge step to link that directly to the controls and cut out the potential for human error. Drivers have had a good couple of decades since privatisation with TOCs competing for their services and pushing salaries up but in the longer terms this helps make the case for investing in automatic operations.
 

LAX54

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It is only a matter of time until the driver grade is finished as is the writing on the wall for the guard grade. I do not agree to this but it is the way that things are moving. Having spent much time in the Gulf recently and observing the Dubai Metro operating over many miles in a totally automatic way and every service running totally on time it is where the UK rail network is trying to get to in terms of technology. The driver grade in less than 20 years will be finished and a thing of the past. Most of the world considers driving trains as a role that is not highly skilled, look at the salary figures in other countries it is a poorly paid role and one ripe for automation.

And most of the World have far more 'accidents' than we do ! The UK does not have the reputation for the safest Railway in the World for nothing :)
 

Parallel

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That’s appalling. No trains to Bath from Pad for 4 and a half hours? Maybe they should’ve just advertised the route as being closed and advised for passengers not to travel.

Was the advice for passengers to travel to Westbury and change there to an ex-Cornwall train?
 
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