GWR's recent declining performance?

[The Ham]

with their superior acceleration and top speed.

The latter isn't currently available for use in passenger service.

 

[JN114]

The latter isn't currently available for use in passenger service.

Their current 125 top speed is greater than 90 for a Turbo. Partial quoting kills context.

 

[43096]

In practice, the xx:50 turbo departure to Oxford (calling at Slough) is almost always caught by the xy:00 departure to Bristol. When the Bristol was normally an HST you would often catch it around Maidenhead, now it’s normally an IET you usually catch it whilst it is still stopped at Slough. Hopefully at some point soon all the xx:50 departures will be IETs also, and so will be able to clear the line more quickly with their superior acceleration and top speed.

As I understand it, some of the Class 802 order is for Oxford fast services.

 

[4141]

As a casual forum reader, can I just say thank you to those who are obviously "at the front end" for their posts - makes some things much easier to understand...

 

[Kite159]

And it might also help when the Bedwyn services go over to IETs (as IIRC they are normally followed by a Heathrow Express from Paddington to give space before the following High Speed catches up). Removes another Turbo from the mains

 

[lewesroad]

Article in the Guardian showing why the focus on GWR in this thread is justified: https://www.theguardian.com/busines...e-called-the-entire-rail-system-into-question

 

[TPO]

Indeed, and I am surprised it has taken this long to get into the press.

Interesting some comments further up-thread about passenger numbers out to Slough vs the long-distance trains. Just confirms my suspicions that to GWR, anything west of Bristol doesn't matter. So lets open up the long-distance routes to Open Access operators.....

TPo

 

[FGW_DID]

Wow, that article makes it sound like every project on the GWML has been completed and running for a couple of years. It seems to ignore that the vast majority are still ongoing and will be for some time!

• Electrification work still ongoing (some parts 'on hold')
• Engineering projects such as Oxford Re-signalling have only just been completed
• Hitachi have yet to deliver all the units to GWR
• Only a few of the 802 series as ordered by First are still to be delivered
• Cascade of rolling stock is still ongoing.
• Training is still ongoing, hampered by late delivery of stock and late running electrification
• etc etc!

 

[Mintona]

And it might also help when the Bedwyn services go over to IETs (as IIRC they are normally followed by a Heathrow Express from Paddington to give space before the following High Speed catches up). Removes another Turbo from the mains

The Bedwyn turbo goes at xx:18, and runs fast to Reading. The Oxford and beyond, normally HST or IET, then leaves at xx:22 (but stops at Slough). But because of the superior acceleration and top speed it catches the Bedwyn somewhere around Airport Junction and arrives at Slough a minute or two late. The xx:25 then goes to Heathrow, and shouldn’t be held up. But then the xx:30 Bristol goes, and will often see some yellow signals around Hanwell and Southall whilst the Heathrow train slows down for the junction to the airport. If not it catches up with the (by now 2 minutes late) Oxford and beyond train around Slough. It then follows it all the way to Didcot East, and invariably gets held at Moreton Cutting whilst the down Oxford waits to cross the up main.

Oh for a flying junction at Didcot East and no more Turbos on the mains!

 

[nickswift99]

The Bedwyn turbo goes at xx:18, and runs fast to Reading. The Oxford and beyond, normally HST or IET, then leaves at xx:22 (but stops at Slough). But because of the superior acceleration and top speed it catches the Bedwyn somewhere around Airport Junction and arrives at Slough a minute or two late. The xx:25 then goes to Heathrow, and shouldn’t be held up. But then the xx:30 Bristol goes, and will often see some yellow signals around Hanwell and Southall whilst the Heathrow train slows down for the junction to the airport. If not it catches up with the (by now 2 minutes late) Oxford and beyond train around Slough. It then follows it all the way to Didcot East, and invariably gets held at Moreton Cutting whilst the down Oxford waits to cross the up main.

Oh for a flying junction at Didcot East and no more Turbos on the mains!

Is the extension to the turnback siding at Bedwyn complete yet? Presumably this and any platform modifications are the only thing that prevents Bedwyn services using IET's now (subject to availability of stock)? While getting the wires going to Newbury is jolly nice, surely it's not essential? Or have I missed something obvious?

 

[JN114]

Is the extension to the turnback siding at Bedwyn complete yet? Presumably this and any platform modifications are the only thing that prevents Bedwyn services using IET's now (subject to availability of stock)? While getting the wires going to Newbury is jolly nice, surely it's not essential? Or have I missed something obvious?

Lengthened Bedwyn Turnback has been commissioned. Still a few ends to tie up with station working etc.

 

[43096]

Wow, that article makes it sound like every project on the GWML has been completed and running for a couple of years. It seems to ignore that the vast majority are still ongoing and will be for some time!

• Electrification work still ongoing (some parts 'on hold')
• Engineering projects such as Oxford Re-signalling have only just been completed
• Hitachi have yet to deliver all the units to GWR
• Only a few of the 802 series as ordered by First are still to be delivered
• Cascade of rolling stock is still ongoing.
• Training is still ongoing, hampered by late delivery of stock and late running electrification
• etc etc!

The point is that much of it should have been completed, and management of the transition has been totally lacking.

Anyone seen “Hapless Hopwood”?

 

[jimm]

Is the extension to the turnback siding at Bedwyn complete yet? Presumably this and any platform modifications are the only thing that prevents Bedwyn services using IET's now (subject to availability of stock)? While getting the wires going to Newbury is jolly nice, surely it's not essential? Or have I missed something obvious?

You have already stated the answer - rolling stock availability.

Until something like the full IET fleet of 800s and 802s is available to GWR, there won't be any five-car Class 800s available to operate the Bedwyn services. Replacing HSTs on long-distance services and remaining Turbos on Paddington-Oxford fasts are ahead of Bedwyn services in the pecking order as the IET fleet grows.

 

[TractiveEffort]

I notice no one commented yesterday when there were no shortformed IET’s and today there are only two and that was caused by the points run through at Cardiff and a 10 car being dumped in Stoke Gifford whilst the chaos was sorted out, leaving Swansea 2 5 cars short.

 

[1e10]

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/C42294/2018/09/07/advanced

2C83 was held at Bristol TM for fitters attention this afternoon. Is anyone able to find out why?

 

[CMRail]

The point is that much of it should have been completed, and management of the transition has been totally lacking.

Anyone seen “Hapless Hopwood”?

In a land far far away....

 

[jimm]

I notice no one commented yesterday when there were no shortformed IET’s and today there are only two and that was caused by the points run through at Cardiff and a 10 car being dumped in Stoke Gifford whilst the chaos was sorted out, leaving Swansea 2 5 cars short.

No surprise there then...

I was waiting for someone to get outraged by the 'alterations' on the Cotswold Line. Some booked five-car duties were noted as being five instead of 10-car on GWR Journeycheck for some reason.

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

The Bedwyn turbo goes at xx:18, and runs fast to Reading. The Oxford and beyond, normally HST or IET, then leaves at xx:22 (but stops at Slough). But because of the superior acceleration and top speed it catches the Bedwyn somewhere around Airport Junction and arrives at Slough a minute or two late. The xx:25 then goes to Heathrow, and shouldn’t be held up. But then the xx:30 Bristol goes, and will often see some yellow signals around Hanwell and Southall whilst the Heathrow train slows down for the junction to the airport. If not it catches up with the (by now 2 minutes late) Oxford and beyond train around Slough. It then follows it all the way to Didcot East, and invariably gets held at Moreton Cutting whilst the down Oxford waits to cross the up main.

Oh for a flying junction at Didcot East and no more Turbos on the mains!

Not correct, the Bedwyn has been departing Paddington at xx.07 since January, which is why the Plymouth fasts moved to xx.03.

I think the Bristols will notice a performance improvement in the next few weeks as 800s take over the DOO Xx.50 Oxford services. The current Turbo coverage is a temporary lash-up which was not originally planned but circumstances forced GWRs hand, which has consequently compromised the timetable, although some of the impact is mitigated by running Oxfords at xx20 or 21 where possible (generally constrained by the Paddington platforming sequence as to depart at xx.20 it must be from a lower platform than the xx21 arrival from Plymouth, which isn’t always possible.

Incidentally the generally poor Plymouth-Padd paths are due to the rigid HEX timetable which basically writes the GWR service. HEX have a legally cast iron agreement that predates franchising guaranteeing them first-dibs on the ML paths, at perfect 15-min intervals, and a max journey time which allows for less than 1-min of pathing between the Airport and London. Not an ideal way to plan the timetable, but one we are stuck with until the early 2020s.

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

There did seem to be some issues with the Bristol peak this evening, the low point being 1F27 1630 Cardiff-Portsmouth being formed by 150202 on its own, rather than the booked 5-car formation (unless by some magic it was strengthened at Bristol TM after I left the office.)

 

[Parallel]

There did seem to be some issues with the Bristol peak this evening, the low point being 1F27 1630 Cardiff-Portsmouth being formed by 150202 on its own, rather than the booked 5-car formation (unless by some magic it was strengthened at Bristol TM after I left the office.)

Christ, that train is usually busy as a 5 (though regularly only 3 turn up) - reminds me when a train broke down at Stapleton Road a couple of years ago and blocked everything, and a 150 started from Bristol to run the service. It was completely overloaded at Bath and someone actually fell and got trampled by others trying to cram on. GWR ended up sending people to stations, even as far as Salisbury and Southampton in taxis. Obviously there had been no trains for an hour and a half at this point and they were advertising the local bus to Salisbury for rail passengers, which was already packed.

To be fair to GWR, they’ve done a good job with getting their stock PRM compliant. They only have a few 165s, 158s and HST GTis left to convert - compared to EMT and ATW that are really really struggling at the moment. Peak time service out of Manchester was a single 158 when I used it last week and needless to say, not everybody could board.

I used 150265 for the first time today since it’s refurb. It was working the Looe Valley line and had a non-multi sticker on the end of the train. I wonder what’s caused that? It’s just been refurbished!

 

[Parallel]

A fair few angry commuters on Twitter this morning, pointing out that due to the limited/no trains to Bristol Parkway, the Bristol Temple Meads DMUs are extremely busy this morning. Unfortunately the 07:30 Cardiff to Portsmouth is formed of 3 coaches vice 5 with many passengers being unable to board. GWR replying with due to more trains than usual requiring maintenance at the same time.

Shame it wasn’t possible to run a 5 car 80x between Cardiff and Bristol with a 158 taking over duties after.

I’m on the 06:00 Portsmouth to Cardiff train that’s running about 25-30 mins late due to a points failure north of Trowbridge and is 3 coaches vice 5, though no mention on Journey Check.

 

[PHILIPE]

A fair few angry commuters on Twitter this morning, pointing out that due to the limited/no trains to Bristol Parkway, the Bristol Temple Meads DMUs are extremely busy this morning. Unfortunately the 07:30 Cardiff to Portsmouth is formed of 3 coaches vice 5 with many passengers being unable to board. GWR replying with due to more trains than usual requiring maintenance at the same time.

Shame it wasn’t possible to run a 5 car 80x between Cardiff and Bristol with a 158 taking over duties after.

I’m on the 06:00 Portsmouth to Cardiff train that’s running about 25-30 mins late due to a points failure north of Trowbridge and is 3 coaches vice 5, though no mention on Journey Check.

Usually an HSS calls at Severn Tunnel Jn to allow passengers to travel to Bristol Parkway and change there for Temple Meads but at the moment there is no alternative.

 

[SwindonBert]

I'll put a counter point of view, where GWR had planned well. On Friday night Gloucester were at home to Bristol and for the last train to Swindon, which is the only train one can catch, not only did they get a 3 coach train, often 2, they lay on coaches to Stroud & Stonehouse departing earlier than the train to alleviate the expected crush on the train. It was a pleasant treat to get a seat the whole way home

 

[CMRail]

I'll put a counter point of view, where GWR had planned well. On Friday night Gloucester were at home to Bristol and for the last train to Swindon, which is the only train one can catch, not only did they get a 3 coach train, often 2, they lay on coaches to Stroud & Stonehouse departing earlier than the train to alleviate the expected crush on the train. It was a pleasant treat to get a seat the whole way home

Agreed these should be London 9 coach trains.

 

[SwindonBert]

Agreed these should be London 9 coach trains.

On the proposed plan that GWR put out a few years ago I think the late night trains are still to Swindon & change there for Paddington. Suspect if it's a London train it would be a 5 coach train

 

[WelshBluebird]

I'll put a counter point of view, where GWR had planned well. On Friday night Gloucester were at home to Bristol and for the last train to Swindon, which is the only train one can catch, not only did they get a 3 coach train, often 2, they lay on coaches to Stroud & Stonehouse departing earlier than the train to alleviate the expected crush on the train. It was a pleasant treat to get a seat the whole way home

At least in my experience, GWR are pretty good when it comes to organising things for sporting / leisure events when they know there will be a large demand to and from a particular place. The extras for Glastonbury etc are a good example too. Totally different beast to the everyday failings we have seen for over a year now.

Of course the explanation for that is that when it is a single event, it is a lot easier to get extra staff and trains than it is to sort out longer term issues to do with maintenance, staffing levels, training, route infrastructure reliability etc.

 

[bantamjim]

Usually an HSS calls at Severn Tunnel Jn to allow passengers to travel to Bristol Parkway and change there for Temple Meads but at the moment there is no alternative.

And this looked like it was exacerbated by a decent number of passengers from Cheltenham travelling via Severn Tunnel Junction owing to the direct route being closed... I wonder if they'll be there again tomorrow morning having not been able to board the connecting train today.

It also wasn't great this evening; the 18:00 from Temple Meads missed the connection at Severn Tunnel Junction and there was no information made available to anyone who didn't check themselves that they had an hour and a half wait for the next service there, and would've been much quicker going via Newport (or had a much more pleasant and comfortable wait if they needed Lydney)

 

[Butts]

I feel honour bound to report that the service in 1st Class was excellent on my recent trip from Newport to London and back. If only the same could be said of the ironing boards that have replaced the armchairs.

Plenty of runs from well stocked trolleys - if only they did free alcohol it would be perfect.

Paddington Lounge top notch as well.