half of tube barriers left unmanned -london travelwatch

[richardderby]

according to a report by london travelwatch, nearly half of tube ticket barriers are left with no staff pressence despite assurances that the station staff presence would be kept following boris johnsons decission to cut around a thousand ticket office jobs last year (with more job cuts to follow..). The tube should not be decreasing staff numbers so rapidly, at a time when ridership is at a historical high, and fares are so expensive. The least people should expect are for the stations to have a staff presence...:cry: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16670589

 

[Clip]

They do have a staff presence though. Just because you cant see anyone manning the barriers does not mean they dont have a member of staff at the station.

Like at West Ruislip - no ticket office after 1000/1030 but yet there is still at least 2 people plus cleaners at the station all day.

 

[Daniel]

They do have a staff presence though. Just because you cant see anyone manning the barriers does not mean they dont have a member of staff at the station.

Depends where you are. Most of the time if the barriers are open then theres no-one there.

 

[Clip]

Depends where you are. Most of the time if the barriers are open then theres no-one there.

Surely they have to have someone there? What about fire alarms and all that sort of stuff - who then deals with a station evac?

 

[causton]

Surely they have to have someone there? What about fire alarms and all that sort of stuff - who then deals with a station evac?

Who does on an unmanned National Rail station?

Stations will have a Risk Assessment carried out meaning that they have to have a certain number of staff there at any one time otherwise the station *cannot* open - and TfL can get fined if something happens and the station is open with too few people.

However, there's nothing to say that all these people couldn't be doing duties other than where they could oversee the ticket barrier and then it could be left open - and I'm sure some stations would be allowed to stay open with no staff such as Chesham (unless the member of staff was hiding *very* well when I last went, I mean, there's not many places they could!)

 

[Clip]

Who does on an unmanned National Rail station?

Stations will have a Risk Assessment carried out meaning that they have to have a certain number of staff there at any one time otherwise the station *cannot* open - and TfL can get fined if something happens and the station is open with too few people.

However, there's nothing to say that all these people couldn't be doing duties other than where they could oversee the ticket barrier and then it could be left open - and I'm sure some stations would be allowed to stay open with no staff such as Chesham (unless the member of staff was hiding *very* well when I last went, I mean, there's not many places they could!)

How many NR stations are underground - and not manned when open ?

Im aware of the RA's needing to be carried out and I was basing my assumption of lul stations all being underground which was a bit daft of me but im sure I was told once that they all have to have at least one person on the station. Though again, where the underground is concerned im happy to be proven wrong.

 

[richardderby]

report from london travelwatch who are totally unbiased politically,

http://www.londontravelwatch.org.uk/news/2012/01/ticket_office_mystery_shop_survey

open the link at the bottom of the page.....(mystery shopper report)

 

[Daniel]

How many NR stations are underground - and not manned when open ?

Im aware of the RA's needing to be carried out and I was basing my assumption of lul stations all being underground which was a bit daft of me but im sure I was told once that they all have to have at least one person on the station. Though again, where the underground is concerned im happy to be proven wrong.

A rough explanation is that if the station is underground, it'll have a minimum staffing number. If the station is above ground, a majority will be able to open with no staff.

 

[causton]

How many NR stations are underground - and not manned when open ?

I'm not talking about those stations - I'm talking about the ones north of Harrow, ones far east on the District etc. Rest assured that Zone 1 stations will always have staff in them!

 

[Clip]

I'm not talking about those stations - I'm talking about the ones north of Harrow, ones far east on the District etc. Rest assured that Zone 1 stations will always have staff in them!

But this was kind of my point about West Ruislip. End of the line station in an area where there isnt much there yet still has someone there from start till finish. Though is that because its the terminal station? ~though Im sure ive seen someone at South Ruislip at very extreme times of day and oddly enough in total contrast to West its ticket office being open for most of the day.

 

[tom1649]

It's only stations which are underground (tube/sub-surface) that have to be staffed due to fire regulations.

This is not to say that I think it is right that surface stations shouldn't be staffed. Certainly stations such as Roding Valley with low usage figures have been almost completely unstaffed before now. Indeed Roding Valley ticket office has now closed completely (it previously opened one morning a week only for a few hours), but I'm led to believe there should now be a member of staff on duty from the first to last train to provide assistance etc.

Fire alarm systems are (I think) linked to the local fire station, therefore should any station be unstaffed then the LFB will respond.

 

[ji459]

report from london travelwatch who are totally unbiased politically,

That doesn't mean they don't have their own agenda, which they are seeking to further. For example, on page 5 of the report it says: "At just under half of the stations surveyed, staff were not present at the gateline (see Figure 2 below), despite the Mayor of London’s Transport Advisor’s assurances to passengers that 'all stations will be staffed at all times when trains are running, and stations will feel safer by moving some staff out of the office and amongst the public.'" Now a debate can be had as to whether gatelines should be staffed at all times, but the Mayor's advisor did not claim that they would be. That particular passage of the report is also flawed for not specifying the period of observation on which the claim is based. There's a big difference between a gateline being unstaffed for 5 mins and one being unstaffed for 5 hours.

 

[Clip]

It's only stations which are underground (tube/sub-surface) that have to be staffed due to fire regulations.

This is not to say that I think it is right that surface stations shouldn't be staffed. Certainly stations such as Roding Valley with low usage figures have been almost completely unstaffed before now. Indeed Roding Valley ticket office has now closed completely (it previously opened one morning a week only for a few hours), but I'm led to believe there should now be a member of staff on duty from the first to last train to provide assistance etc.

Fire alarm systems are (I think) linked to the local fire station, therefore should any station be unstaffed then the LFB will respond.

Many thanks for the info Tom - appreciated

That doesn't mean they don't have their own agenda, which they are seeking to further. For example, on page 5 of the report it says: "At just under half of the stations surveyed, staff were not present at the gateline (see Figure 2 below), despite the Mayor of London’s Transport Advisor’s assurances to passengers that 'all stations will be staffed at all times when trains are running, and stations will feel safer by moving some staff out of the office and amongst the public.'" Now a debate can be had as to whether gatelines should be staffed at all times, but the Mayor's advisor did not claim that they would be. That particular passage of the report is also flawed for not specifying the period of observation on which the claim is based. There's a big difference between a gateline being unstaffed for 5 mins and one being unstaffed for 5 hours.

Exactly - thats what I thought when I read it, say the Mayor has said something when he hasnt. Very dubious.

And really do gatelines need to be manned all the time? Alarm goes off if someone is stuck so what is the issue?

 

[1018509]

Depends where you are. Most of the time if the barriers are open then theres no-one there.

If I travel from one LUL station with the barriers open to another with the barriers open how do I pay the Priv Fare if there is no staff at either station?

 

[Daniel]

If I travel from one LUL station with the barriers open to another with the barriers open how do I pay the Priv Fare if there is no staff at either station?

Your PRIV card acts as your authority to travel as there is no way to purchase your fare at your origin - (the buy a single and excess doesn't apply for whatever reason). So you won't get into trouble if checked by revenue whilst travelling. Upon exiting the station I suppose as long as you've checked that theres no-one in the ticket office you've made a reasonable attempt to pay and you could leave.

I would imagine the rule book thing to do was pay next time you travel, although obviously that's rather impractical, seeing as LU offices can't backdate single LU tickets / travelcards.


EDIT: Failing that you could load your PRIV discount onto an Oyster card and use that!