Has Tesla taken ideas from rail industry and applied it to their cars?

[pethadine82]

Railways were the first to adopt electric way before EVs. I was impressed with bi-modal diesel and electric GWT trains, and the amount of torque is insane. I don't own a Tesla but people mention the torque and acceleration being very good.
Would love to hear the thoughts on this and if Elon did ever "borrow" train technology?

 

[JohnMcL7]

Electric motors are nothing new and certainly not specific to trains or Tesla but instead it's the batteries that have been the major hurdle to electric cars and is still one of the main issues. I'd say it's the other way round since we're now seeing battery systems being used on trains long after their use on cars.

 

[D365]

I'd say it's the other way round since we're now seeing battery systems being used on trains long after their use on cars.

If you’ll excuse the pun, Tesla’s work is driving the charge for more effective battery technology which can then be transferred to the railways and other industries. (Other automotive manufacturers are available)

 

[EssexGonzo]

And, whilst not the actual battery tech itself, Tesla have pre-emptied the biggest issue with electric cars - “charging anxiety” - by creating their own charging infrastructure. As opposed to range anxiety.

I’ve long maintained that the barrier for me and many others is not the range or the cars (they’re fantastic) but the effctiveness of the infrastructure. One can undertake a cross-country or cross continent in a Tesla with confidence. In a non-Tesla, one is at the mercy of the fragmented and unreliable charging infrastructure.

They also sweat the small stuff. Tesla charging points are not right at the back of the car park because they couldn’t afford the prime spots - it’s a deliberate tactic to prevent other drivers blocking them because they’re right by the front door and arrogant SUV drivers couldn’t possibly walk 50 yards. How many times have you seen a diesel SUV in a charging space? Many, for me.

 

[pdeaves]

And, whilst not the actual battery tech itself, Tesla have pre-emptied the biggest issue with electric cars - “charging anxiety” - by creating their own charging infrastructure. As opposed to range anxiety.

Many folk still have milk delivered to the door (this is relevant...!). It gets delivered in bottles; after the milk is used the bottles are returned for reuse and new ones supplied. With electric vehicles I have often pondered whether a similar system for batteries would be friendlier on the electricity system. Rather than applying a heavy load in short spurts (i.e. 'you' want your car charged fully in the shortest time possible), how about charging a load of batteries at a more sensible rate and swap them with the depleted one. So, the electric vehicle user goes to the filling station, removes the old one and leaves it, fits the new one and drives off. Meanwhile, the old battery sits there charging ready for the next user.

Obviously, I only have a high level thought, not a fully designed and costed scheme! Just a thought that might be beneficial to individual users who don't have to wait charging time and beneficial to the energy network that can even out supply better.

 

[SargeNpton]

Many folk still have milk delivered to the door (this is relevant...!). It gets delivered in bottles; after the milk is used the bottles are returned for reuse and new ones supplied. With electric vehicles I have often pondered whether a similar system for batteries would be friendlier on the electricity system. Rather than applying a heavy load in short spurts (i.e. 'you' want your car charged fully in the shortest time possible), how about charging a load of batteries at a more sensible rate and swap them with the depleted one. So, the electric vehicle user goes to the filling station, removes the old one and leaves it, fits the new one and drives off. Meanwhile, the old battery sits there charging ready for the next user.

Obviously, I only have a high level thought, not a fully designed and costed scheme! Just a thought that might be beneficial to individual users who don't have to wait charging time and beneficial to the energy network that can even out supply better.

You've obviously not seen how big the batteries are and how they are fitted into the cars. Swapping them over is a major task.

 

[pethadine82]

I think we are going to see an explosion in green technology with Biden at the helm after inauguration. Think the railways will have a very exiting future. Covid will hopefully be behind us. I am trying to see the optimism in all of this at this very difficult and challenging time.

 

[ta-toget]

Many folk still have milk delivered to the door (this is relevant...!). It gets delivered in bottles; after the milk is used the bottles are returned for reuse and new ones supplied. With electric vehicles I have often pondered whether a similar system for batteries would be friendlier on the electricity system. Rather than applying a heavy load in short spurts (i.e. 'you' want your car charged fully in the shortest time possible), how about charging a load of batteries at a more sensible rate and swap them with the depleted one. So, the electric vehicle user goes to the filling station, removes the old one and leaves it, fits the new one and drives off. Meanwhile, the old battery sits there charging ready for the next user.

Obviously, I only have a high level thought, not a fully designed and costed scheme! Just a thought that might be beneficial to individual users who don't have to wait charging time and beneficial to the energy network that can even out supply better.

This has been done for electric scooters (as in the ones like a motorcycle, not as in the ones which were, and mostly still are, illegal in the UK). There is an article (June 2015) on the BBC about it.

An electric scooter with swappable batteries is to go on sale in Taiwan priced $4,140 (£2,600).
The Smartscooter, made by Gogoro, would be available for pre-order in Taipei from 27 June, the company announced.
Riders will be able to change batteries at a number of Gogoro charging stations around the city.
But this will be the only way they can recharge the scooters, leaving owners tied to the manufacturer's network and pricing plans.
As part of the initial offer, Smartscooter owners will receive one year's theft insurance, two years of free maintenance, and two years' unlimited access to the battery charging stations.

 

[PeterC]

Many folk still have milk delivered to the door (this is relevant...!). It gets delivered in bottles; after the milk is used the bottles are returned for reuse and new ones supplied. With electric vehicles I have often pondered whether a similar system for batteries would be friendlier on the electricity system. Rather than applying a heavy load in short spurts (i.e. 'you' want your car charged fully in the shortest time possible), how about charging a load of batteries at a more sensible rate and swap them with the depleted one. So, the electric vehicle user goes to the filling station, removes the old one and leaves it, fits the new one and drives off. Meanwhile, the old battery sits there charging ready for the next user.

Obviously, I only have a high level thought, not a fully designed and costed scheme! Just a thought that might be beneficial to individual users who don't have to wait charging time and beneficial to the energy network that can even out supply better.

I don't think that we will ever see battery technology produce lift out batteries suitable for a family car. Even if it did prove possible most cars would still need them in multiple in just the same way as you put multiple batteries in a torch.

Battery exchange comes up against the issue that you might be swapping a new battery that holds a lot of charge for an old one that only has a fraction of the range.

Only a dream I am afraid although it would have been a boon for the millions of people who don't have private drives to recharge their cars in.

 

[edwin_m]

Aren't the batteries often weird shapes to fit into the body? There has been talk of structural batteries too.

 

[EssexGonzo]

I don't think that we will ever see battery technology produce lift out batteries suitable for a family car. Even if it did prove possible most cars would still need them in multiple in just the same way as you put multiple batteries in a torch.

Battery exchange comes up against the issue that you might be swapping a new battery that holds a lot of charge for an old one that only has a fraction of the range.

Only a dream I am afraid although it would have been a boon for the millions of people who don't have private drives to recharge their cars in.

It’s been tried and prototyped - not sure if this pilot has been extended.

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/big-reads/power-shift-battery-swapping-our-way-across-china

Sorry - I can’t seem to copy the text.

 

[Domh245]

Aren't the batteries often weird shapes to fit into the body? There has been talk of structural batteries too.

Yup, in "ground up" BEVs they've tended to essentially turn the entire battery into the floor of the car, and in 'conversion' type BEVs, they're all sorts of odd shapes and in awkward places to try and maximise the range in a car not really designed for it. Battery packs also tend to be plumbed in to the vehicle's radiator system for cooling purposes, carrying out a coolant change is neither quick, nor particularly desirable every 300 miles!