Heathrow Express fares and T&C changes from May 20th

[mattdickinson]

There is one more gate to the right beside what I presume is space for the service vehicle gate.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It’s supposed to be by popular demand though. Or at least that’s probably what their survey or consultation will have been designed to prove...

It's going to die anyway - Crossrail will kill it by virtue of going where people want to go rather than some outpost on the very western edge of London where none of the big business is. Might as well have the revenue in the meantime.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

It's going to die anyway - Crossrail will kill it by virtue of going where people want to go rather than some outpost on the very western edge of London where none of the big business is. Might as well have the revenue in the meantime.

I don't think it will die entirely; there will always be some who still use it (especially unknowing tourists). But those who know what the better option is will undoubtedly use Crossrail, if and when (!) that opens with a usable timetable (the splitting of the routes at Paddington etc. is very annoying from a passenger's point of view IMO!).

 

[JonathanH]

5 gates? That'll take a while to empty a 9 car train through. HEx is about to lose some of its journey time trump card...

If the throughput of people on wide gates is quick enough there tends not to be time for them to close.

Contactless / Oyster and single fare pricing is what everyone seems to be demanding in the outer London area.

I saw someone turn up at High Wycombe with a contactless debit card today. My guess is that some people will favour convenience no matter what the price.

 

[BluePenguin]

I saw someone turn up at High Wycombe with a contactless debit card today. My guess is that some people will favour convenience no matter what the price.

I'm sure those people will be having regrets when they get their bank statements at the end of the month. That is the trouble with paying by card - it doesn't feel like you're spending any money!

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'm sure those people will be having regrets when they get their bank statements at the end of the month. That is the trouble with paying by card - it doesn't feel like you're spending any money!

With the modern online banks like Monzo notifying you of spending, this isn't necessarily the case any more.

 

[Hadders]

I saw someone turn up at High Wycombe with a contactless debit card today. My guess is that some people will favour convenience no matter what the price.

It's certainly a problem at Stevenage. There is even a poster at the gate line saying that Oyster and Contactless isn't valid.

 

[Ianno87]

If the throughput of people on wide gates is quick enough there tends not to be time for them to close.

Really doubt it'll be anywhere quick enough with lots of unfamiliar tourists flapping about with tickets. Look at the current LU gateline at T123 - only works because there are quite a number of gates and the Picc Line stock is relatively low capacity.

I don't think it will die entirely; there will always be some who still use it (especially unknowing tourists). But those who know what the better option is will undoubtedly use Crossrail, if and when (!) that opens with a usable timetable (the splitting of the routes at Paddington etc. is very annoying from a passenger's point of view IMO!).

I agree - there will be some who use it based on how it is sold to people arriving at Heathrow. But I think HEx will be shooting themselves in the foot with this barrier line with 'regulars' - it'll seriously dent the premium 'experience'. Might as well just switch allegiance to the slightly better Crossrail frequency instead...

 

[Bletchleyite]

I agree - there will be some who use it based on how it is sold to people arriving at Heathrow. But I think HEx will be shooting themselves in the foot with this barrier line with 'regulars' - it'll seriously dent the premium 'experience'. Might as well just switch allegiance to the slightly better Crossrail frequency instead...

Plus that Crossrail will (eventually) go to where people want to go, without the kind of time penalty that might put people off using the Piccadilly Line (which of course doesn't go to the City etc). The District is of course a cross platform change, but is even slower.

 

[Kite159]

Ah yes, Bert & Ada will arrive into Paddington from Swindon all ready for their annual holiday and instead of being able to take up a seat on a Heathrow Express service they will go to Paddington low level, wait round for the correct 345 on a crowded platform for a minimal dwell time service already busy with folk heading to Ealing or Southall, on a metro interior unit with no luggage space meaning they will probably be standing for the first 10 minutes...

... Don't worry Bert says to Ada, next year we will avoid this hassle and book an airport taxi, at least there is no worry about Dodgy Bob stealing your suitcase when he gets of at Hanwell.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Bert and Ada aren't using Heathrow Express at the outrageous prices charged. They're changing at Reading onto the bus or a taxi, or driving to the airport. Or if they live in London they're using the Tube. Or not flying from Ee'throw in the first place, more likely Luton or Stansted!

Use HEx and look at the passengers. They aren't families and older couples, they are lone, mostly business travellers.

 

[Kite159]

Bert and Ada aren't using Heathrow Express at the outrageous prices charged. They're changing at Reading onto the bus or a taxi, or driving to the airport. Or if they live in London they're using the Tube. Or not flying from Ee'throw in the first place, more likely Luton or Stansted!

Use HEx and look at the passengers. They aren't families and older couples, they are lone, mostly business travellers.

And if you are spending a couple thousand on a holiday, paying for an 90 day advance for HEX won't break the bank.

But still all those business travellers being forced to change at a busy Paddington low level, unable to do any work using the metro spec 345s and unable to relax due to having to stand...
... Taxi!

 

[Bletchleyite]

You can't do any significant amount of work in 15 minutes. I doubt many people work on the HEx at all.

 

[Kite159]

You can't do any significant amount of work in 15 minutes. I doubt many people work on the HEx at all.

Checking emails, using a laptop etc, including the time they can spend sitting on the train at Paddington for the departure time.

Which is more than can be said when waiting around Paddington low level for the correct metro spec 345 to roll in from the East, full of folk heading to Ealing so you end up standing for the first 10 minutes until you get lucky with one of the limited seats.

 

[Mag_seven]

You can't do any significant amount of work in 15 minutes. I doubt many people work on the HEx at all.

I suspect on average most people are on HEX for longer that 15 mins as a lot will join the train several minutes before it departs and of course if you are going to Terminal 5, the journey time from Padd to Terminal 5 is 20 mins not 15!

 

[BluePenguin]

Bert and Ada aren't using Heathrow Express at the outrageous prices charged. They're changing at Reading onto the bus or a taxi, or driving to the airport. Or if they live in London they're using the Tube. Or not flying from Ee'throw in the first place, more likely Luton or Stansted!

Use HEx and look at the passengers. They aren't families and older couples, they are lone, mostly business travellers.

....or they are changing at Hayes & Harlington (from Reading) and waiting a few minutes for the TFL Rail train that takes them straight to the airport

 

[BluePenguin]

With the modern online banks like Monzo notifying you of spending, this isn't necessarily the case any more.

That is very true, although Monzo is still emerging and I don't know how many who know about it let alone trust it. I only knew myself because I got an ad for them on Facebook a while ago. Apple Pay and the like also notify you too but the same as Monzo, only after you have already paid and by that time the damage is already done.

 

[Bletchleyite]

That is very true, although Monzo is still emerging and I don't know how many who know about it let alone trust it. I only knew myself because I got an ad for them on Facebook a while ago. Apple Pay and the like also notify you too but the same as Monzo, only after you have already paid and by that time the damage is already done.

It’s excellent, and if it goes belly up the FSCS kicks in so the risk is low.

 

[matt_world2004]

Ah yes, Bert & Ada will arrive into Paddington from Swindon all ready for their annual holiday and instead of being able to take up a seat on a Heathrow Express service they will go to Paddington low level, wait round for the correct 345 on a crowded platform for a minimal dwell time service already busy with folk heading to Ealing or Southall, on a metro interior unit with no luggage space meaning they will probably be standing for the first 10 minutes...

... Don't worry Bert says to Ada, next year we will avoid this hassle and book an airport taxi, at least there is no worry about Dodgy Bob stealing your suitcase when he gets of at Hanwell.

Wouldnt bert and ada be quicker changing at Hayes & Harlington for the tfl rail than going into paddington Even a fast intercity would not make up the time difference of changing at slough for a slower train and then changing for the elizabeth line at Hayes also your comment about someone stealing their luggage on the elizabeth line smacks of snobbery.

 

[Kite159]

Wouldnt bert and ada be quicker changing at Hayes & Harlington for the tfl rail than going into paddington Even a fast intercity would not make up the time difference of changing at slough for a slower train and then changing for the elizabeth line at Hayes also your comment about someone stealing their luggage on the elizabeth line smacks of snobbery.

So change at Reading for the half hourly service which calls at Slough, and then a Metro Spec 345 stopper to Hayes or a Metro-Spec 345 stopper all the way to Hayes, and then wait around at Hayes for the correct Metro-Spec 345 to roll in with minimal dwell times to be able to board. (Working on the basis that the 345s will eventually enter service replacing the 387s on GWML stopping services)

After-all the Metro Spec 345s have no luggage racks, not even overhead luggage racks as they were designed to hold as many people as possible within the Crossrail core.

The airport taxi service sounds even more appealing

 

[Bantamzen]

And if you are spending a couple thousand on a holiday, paying for an 90 day advance for HEX won't break the bank.

But still all those business travellers being forced to change at a busy Paddington low level, unable to do any work using the metro spec 345s and unable to relax due to having to stand...
... Taxi!

If booked well in advance maybe, but in all honesty the HEX isn't widely known about out there so as @Bletchleyite says Bert & Ada probably wouldn't think to book it several months in advance, or at all. When I've flown from T5 from t'grim North, I've looked at the walk up-prices and thought after a two hour plus trip to Kings Cross, a scrum (with luggage) across to Paddington via LU then the cost of this & thought stuff it I'll fly down, once even flying down the day before & staying at The Thistle hotel for a morning flight (which gave me an excuse to use the T5 Pod).

Now if Heathrow had better rail connectivity rather than having to enjoy the scrum in central London then maybe HEX could find itself a wider market in the Home Counties, maybe running all the way from places like Swindon. But as it stands HEX will remain very much the preserve of business people, the unwary tourist, and occasional enthusiast.

 

[Cdd89]

I don't know about others, but even when I'm in a rush, HEX has already lost out on about 50% of my business. I take the HEX from T-5 to T-123, and then if a TfL Rail train leaves shortly afterwards, I can now "hop out" and connect, ending with a cheaper fare.

(I actually think the SWT service to Feltham is highly underrated though. I live near Waterloo, and even factoring in the bus journey that service is somewhere between HEX and Tube for speed).

By the way, will the Paddington "gates" actually have gates on them? I don't see how they can, unless HEX wish to give up the "Buy a ticket on board" option. The lack of gates will hopefully make things faster (I suspect that only a minority will actually opt to use the Oyster/Contactless methods, for the vast majority of the population HEX Advance Tickets are cheapest way to use the service).

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

I don't know about others, but even when I'm in a rush, HEX has already lost out on about 50% of my business. I take the HEX from T-5 to T-123, and then if a TfL Rail train leaves shortly afterwards, I can now "hop out" and connect, ending with a cheaper fare.

(I actually think the SWT service to Feltham is highly underrated though. I live near Waterloo, and even factoring in the bus journey that service is somewhere between HEX and Tube for speed).

By the way, will the Paddington "gates" actually have gates on them? I don't see how they can, unless HEX wish to give up the "Buy a ticket on board" option. The lack of gates will hopefully make things faster (I suspect that only a minority will actually opt to use the Oyster/Contactless methods, for the vast majority of the population HEX Advance Tickets are cheapest way to use the service).

HEX could go for the GX approach and drop "Buy on board" due to the introduction of gates.

 

[swt_passenger]

By the way, will the Paddington "gates" actually have gates on them? I don't see how they can, unless HEX wish to give up the "Buy a ticket on board" option. The lack of gates will hopefully make things faster (I suspect that only a minority will actually opt to use the Oyster/Contactless methods, for the vast majority of the population HEX Advance Tickets are cheapest way to use the service).

They have gates at the Heathrow end, don’t they? Didn’t they have to introduce free gate passes at the Heathrow stations for inter terminal transfer?

 

[cactustwirly]

Bert and Ada aren't using Heathrow Express at the outrageous prices charged. They're changing at Reading onto the bus or a taxi, or driving to the airport. Or if they live in London they're using the Tube. Or not flying from Ee'throw in the first place, more likely Luton or Stansted!

Use HEx and look at the passengers. They aren't families and older couples, they are lone, mostly business travellers.

Luton & Stansted are quite far away from places like Reading etc, and don't have the the same choice of flights & destinations as Heathrow.

Although Stansted is cheaper, I've never used it because it's hours away, and by the time you factor in travel costs etc Heathrow is just as cheap.

 

[Kite159]

Considering the only "buy on board" option appears to be for the full price fare (£27 single), which is more than the "buy at the station" option, I doubt many folk currently buy on board.

Especially since the barriers went in at Heathrow for oyster for the TfL rail services, bit harder to dodge the fare if you are lucky enough not to get checked.

 

[cactustwirly]

So change at Reading for the half hourly service which calls at Slough, and then a Metro Spec 345 stopper to Hayes or a Metro-Spec 345 stopper all the way to Hayes, and then wait around at Hayes for the correct Metro-Spec 345 to roll in with minimal dwell times to be able to board. (Working on the basis that the 345s will eventually enter service replacing the 387s on GWML stopping services)

After-all the Metro Spec 345s have no luggage racks, not even overhead luggage racks as they were designed to hold as many people as possible within the Crossrail core.

The airport taxi service sounds even more appealing

Exactly, I think HEx is the most convenient option, of you've forked out £1000s on a holiday, £25 on HEx isn't that much in the grand scheme of things.
Actually the RailAir coach isn't that much cheaper tbh

 

[Bletchleyite]

HEX could go for the GX approach and drop "Buy on board" due to the introduction of gates.

That's exactly what is being done. I'd expect it to be DOO too.

 

[cactustwirly]

That's exactly what is being done. I'd expect it to be DOO too.

HEx is DOO already isn't it?

 

[TFN]

HEx is DOO already isn't it?

It is already DOO