History of Chiltern serving Kidderminster

[Gathursty]

A question I've not found a convincing answer on the Internet for is the following:

Why is Kidderminster the terminus of Chiltern Railways services? (I know many, but not all, terminate at Moor Street.)

Kidderminster just doesn't strike me as a terminal town unlike Manchester, Thurso and Weymouth.

How long has Kidderminster served as a terminus for Chiltern and what happened before this time?

 

[bussnapperwm]

A question I've not found a convincing answer on the Internet for is the following:

Why is Kidderminster the terminus of Chiltern Railways services? (I know many, but not all, terminate at Moor Street.)

Kidderminster just doesn't strike me as a terminal town unlike Manchester, Thurso and Weymouth.

How long has Kidderminster served as a terminus for Chiltern and what happened before this time?

It's because they have a depot at Stourbridge Junction (the bit between the OWW - Oxford Worcester and Wolverhampton line/Stourbridge to Snow Hill line - and the town branch) and it just makes operational sense to send a train ECS (empty coaching stock) to Kidderminster instead of turning around in platform 2 at Stourbridge and fouling the line for a period (as IIRC using P3 to turn would result in one of the carriages plus DVT/68 to be off the platform as the signal is half a DVT/68 from the Birmingham end of the platform/at the end of the Kidderminster platform.).

Plus it adds a third evening train between Birmingham and Stourbridge every two hours!

 

[yorkie]

A question I've not found a convincing answer on the Internet for is the following:

Why is Kidderminster the terminus of Chiltern Railways services?

Because it makes operational sense to do so (see above) and there is less demand beyond Kidderminster towards Worcester.

(I know many, but not all, terminate at Moor Street.)

Most go beyond Moor Street to at least Snow Hill. A quick glance at tomorrow's timetable shows only 12 trains terminating at Moor Street.

Kidderminster just doesn't strike me as a terminal town unlike Manchester, Thurso and Weymouth.

I don't understand what this means and I don't see how those stations have anything in common with each other.

One might more reasonably view it as being similar to LNER extending some of their trains beyond Leeds, which also adds the bonus of increased capacity in the 'Up' direction in AM peak periods, except for Chiltern it makes even more sense as they are not only adding journey opportunities and catering for extra demand but - in contrast to LNER - avoiding ECS movements.

How long has Kidderminster served as a terminus for Chiltern and what happened before this time?

Since at least 2004, a quick glance of a 2004-05 timetable shows.

Go back twenty years before that and you'd have got no further than Banbury on a through train out of Marylebone; the service has been extended not just to cope with increased demand, but to also generate increased demand.

The Chiltern line has had an incredible turnaround in recent decades.

 

[3141]

Since at least 2004, a quick glance of a 2004-05 timetable shows.

Go back twenty years before that and you'd have got no further than Banbury on a through train out of Marylebone; the service has been extended not just to cope with increased demand, but to also generate increased demand.

The Chiltern line has had an incredible turnaround in recent decades.

My recollection is that they began running trains to Kidderminster in the late 1990s, but I don't think I still have any of the timetables from that time.

As you say, the line has had an amazing turnaround. When I moved to live near Princes Risborough in 1987, there was basically an hourly off-peak service. Banbury was as far as the service went. After "total route modernisation" (which wasn't quite total)in the late 80s/early 90s, there was an improved and regular service, subsequently extended to Birmingham. After privatisation, and the redoubling of the track from Princes Risborough to Bicester, and later to Aynho Junction, plus additional rolling stock, the service intensified, and the Bicester chord and services to Oxford are the latest development.

 

[Old Hill Bank]

Kidderminster service started September 2002 see link:-
http://www.kidderminstershuttle.co.uk/news/7682652.MP_at_launch_of_London_train/

IT was full steam ahead for commuters in Kidderminster this morning as they boarded the first direct train to London from the town in 100 years.

Chiltern Railways have launched the regular service, which will run every day except Sundays.

Four trains will leave from Kidderminster to London, at 5.39am, 6.21am, 7.28am and 8.28am. And four direct return services will depart from London Marylebone between 4.57pm and 7.50pm.

On Saturdays there will be five services taking people to London and four return journeys.

The new service means the town's commuters will no longer have to change trains or drive to Worcester or Birmingham to catch a direct train to London.

 

[Gathursty]

Many thanks for your responses.

My incorrect info on the Moor Street/ Kidderminster services came from a Wikipedia page on the subject.
My comparison with Thurso, Weymouth and Manchester is that they clearly are at end points, unlike K'minster, if you also include the many bays at Manchester's two stations.

 

[yorkie]

My comparison with Thurso, Weymouth and Manchester is that they clearly are at end points, unlike K'minster

Ah you meant Kidderminster only has through platforms. There are plenty of other stations with terminating services that don't have any platforms with buffer stops; it's very common.

if you also include the many bays at Manchester's two stations.

and the one bay at the other

 

[Gathursty]

Oxford Road is featherweight compared to Victoria and Piccadilly in my opinion. CLC users and commuters may disagree with me.

 

[yorkie]

I still don't get the comparisons; Thurso is featherweight compared to Oxford Road but I am not sure what any of them have to do with terminating trains at Kidderminster, so I am a bit confused to be honest.

 

[Old Hill Bank]

Back on thread. The Kidderminster/Stourbridge service was enhanced December 2017 when we finally got a token Sunday service instead of the frustrating ECS movements between Stourbridge LMD and Birmingham.
From the SLUG Website:-

It has been confirmed that Chiltern Railways will operate additional through services to and from London Marylebone from 10 December 2017. There will be two through services from London Marylebone to Kidderminster on a Saturday evening - the first through services from London on a Saturday for a decade. In addition, Chiltern will operate two through services from Kidderminster to London Marylebone on a Sunday morning, with three return journeys on Sunday evenings - the first Sunday through services ever.


Stourbridge Line User Group has campaigned for the provision of through services on Saturday evenings and on Sundays for many years and is thrilled that Chiltern have listened to our arguments and are now providing these services. We hope that Stourbridge line passengers will support this initiative and make regular use of the new services.


A complete schedule of all through services between the Stourbridge line and London Marylebone is detailed below, with the additional services highlighted in gold.

http://www.stourbridgelineusergroup.info/chiltern direct.html

 

[Gathursty]

1) I mentioned two Manchester stations as I overlook Oxford Road because I rarely get off there, hence is featherweight to me compared to Vic and Picc.
2) Kidderminster is a through station. Weymouth and Thurso are termini. Manchester Picc and Vic are also termini for many services, but not all. I can see your confusion but I associate Pic and Vic as termini because I normally begin or end a journey there rather than pass through. I should have said Lime St to avoid ambiguity.

 

[Old Hill Bank]

Kidderminster has two turnback options for trains from the Birmingham direction, the former up loop was reconnected as a turnback siding for the Chiltern service then with the resignalling a few years ago turnback can also be done via the down loop. Trains from the Worcester direction can turnback from the down platform. Both platforms are passenger signalled on to the SVR.

 

[pdeaves]

Both platforms are passenger signalled on to the SVR.

Before the resignalling they weren't (as I expect you know!). You then had the (apparently) strange situation of railtours from Bewdley that only returned to Kidderminster, where passengers had to change trains (and, technically, stations) to get home. It's all much simpler now.

 

[scrapy]

Is Thurso even really a terminus? It's mainly a stop with a reversal on the Wick to Inverness service

 

[yorkie]

Is Thurso even really a terminus? It's mainly a stop with a reversal on the Wick to Inverness service

True and there is no connection, relation or similarity to Chiltern services between Kidderminster and Marylebone. It's by the by really.

 

[satisnek]

Why is Kidderminster the terminus of Chiltern Railways services?

It's a very good question, actually. I guess that it's because it's a town of 50,000 people which had a single daily service to Paddington via Evesham back around 1993 and was the starting point of half of the Cathedrals Express many years before that.

I understand that Chiltern Railways originally had designs on a depot at Foley Park on the SVR; when they said "No", the site of the carriage sidings (now partially lifted) just to the south of Kidderminster station was considered but rejected for security reasons because it was out of view of the signalbox (now demolished). Hence Stourbridge Junction.

Are the Kidderminster services Chiltern's own decision or a franchise commitment? The Saturday evening trains were withdrawn after just a year or two and for many years it looked like the services beyond Snow Hill were nothing more that a token gesture, because the sets had to go to and from the depot anyway. Only in the last year or so have they bounced back with a 7-day service.

Kidderminster service started September 2002 see link:-
http://www.kidderminstershuttle.co.uk/news/7682652.MP_at_launch_of_London_train/

Have you noticed how the hacks at the Kidderminster Shuttle always use the phrase "full steam ahead" or similar words at the beginning of railway-related articles? It's probably the same in all other local papers. And they got it wrong, as I have mentioned above.

 

[swt_passenger]

Ah you meant Kidderminster only has through platforms. There are plenty of other stations with terminating services that don't have any platforms with buffer stops; it's very common...

Imagine the extra infrastructure that would need to be built if all services had to run all the way through to somewhere with buffers!

 

[ChrisHogan]

Are the Kidderminster services Chiltern's own decision or a franchise commitment? The Saturday evening trains were withdrawn after just a year or two and for many years it looked like the services beyond Snow Hill were nothing more that a token gesture, because the sets had to go to and from the depot anyway. Only in the last year or so have they bounced back with a 7-day service.

Chiltern originally wanted to run a hourly daytime weekday service through to Kidderminster but Centro raised objections and the 6 tph Central Trains service came instead. I believe Chiltern funded the turnback facility at Kidderminster.

 

[WYSH]

Kidderminster acts as a terminus for many WMT services each day, and thinking about it so does Stourbridge junction, Worcester forgate/shrub Hill and Malvern for the snow hill services heading west and then all don’t “look like terminus” stations so why should it be odd that Chiltern terminate at Kidderminster really

 

[Doctor Fegg]

Kidderminster service started September 2002 see link:-
http://www.kidderminstershuttle.co.uk/news/7682652.MP_at_launch_of_London_train/

And Stourbridge was the year before - May 2001.

NEW SUMMER TIMETABLE IMPROVEMENTS
Our new summer timetable will be introduced from Sunday 20 May.
New features included in the timetable are:
- Minor changes to some of our commuting services to improve punctuality and
help match available capacity to demand where we can.
- New all day Sunday service to and from London Marylebone for Aylesbury, Stoke
Mandeville, Wendover, Great Missenden and Amersham
- New direct services between Stourbridge Junction and London Marylebone,
providing three morning business trains and 1 morning off-peak train on Mondays
to Fridays, with 4 return evening trains. These services will also call at
Cradley Heath, Rowley Regis, Smethwick Galton Bridge, The Hawthorns and
Jewellery Quarter stations, providing new direct travel opportunities between
all these stations and London.
- New Monday to Friday morning off-peak direct service to London Marylebone
from Acocks Green and Olton, and an additional Monday to Friday morning
off-peak train from Birmingham, Solihull, Widney Manor and Dorridge.

(from an old uk.railway posting)

 

[CyrusWuff]

The current franchise requirement is to provide three services arriving into Marylebone between 0700 and 0959, and three services departing Marylebone between 1615 and 1915, Mondays to Fridays (excluding public holidays).

Interestingly, up until the May 2003 timetable change, Chiltern received an incentive payment for operating said Kidderminster services, and it was down to Chiltern to provide road signage to The Hawthorns, Rowley Regis, Cradley Heath, Stourbridge Junction and Kidderminster stations, rather than Central Trains or the PTE!

 

[Old Hill Bank]

For those of you are interested work on replacing Kidderminster NR station start today with highway alterations. Station building and forecourt jobs to follow with completion planned for next May.

 

[satisnek]

For those of you are interested work on replacing Kidderminster NR station start today with highway alterations. Station building and forecourt jobs to follow with completion planned for next May.

I saw the pretty coloured markings on the pavement by the bridge this evening, and wondered what they were for! So is this going to be as per the artists' impression released a while back: an essentially 'same but bigger' building with a vestigial canopy, no attempt to match with the footbridge and still nothing more than a bus shelter on Platform 2? Wonderful...

 

[Old Hill Bank]

I saw the pretty coloured markings on the pavement by the bridge this evening, and wondered what they were for! So is this going to be as per the artists' impression released a while back: an essentially 'same but bigger' building with a vestigial canopy, no attempt to match with the footbridge and still nothing more than a bus shelter on Platform 2? Wonderful...

The failure to improve the passenger environment on the Worcester bound platform is in my opinion one thing the project fails to address and I have commented as such to those who will deliver the scheme.

 

[Starmill]

Oxford Road is featherweight compared to Victoria and Piccadilly in my opinion. CLC users and commuters may disagree with me.

More passengers annually use Manchester Oxford Road than Manchester Victoria.

 

[adrock1976]

More passengers annually use Manchester Oxford Road than Manchester Victoria.

Is that for starting and ending journeys there, or is it for those passengers who interchange there?

 

[Bamford]

Chiltern originally wanted to run a hourly daytime weekday service through to Kidderminster but Centro raised objections and the 6 tph Central Trains service came instead. I believe Chiltern funded the turnback facility at Kidderminster.

Really, what would this plan have entailed?

 

[ChrisHogan]

Really, what would this plan have entailed?

Extending the Snow Hill terminator each hour through to Kidderminster and starting back the Snow Hill starter from Kidderminster. It would have 'cost' one crewed train. Centro wasn't keen on the idea because of revenue abstraction as it took the CT revenue within the West Midland "county".

 

[kje7812]

Shame, an hourly service to/from London would have probably helped Kiddy a fair bit.

 

[satisnek]

Shame, an hourly service to/from London would have probably helped Kiddy a fair bit.

To be honest I don't think there would be much demand. From my admittedly limited observations the majority of passengers travelling from Kidderminster/Stourbridge on weekdays are Birmingham commuters and ironically it's the 'optional' weekend services which see more through traffic, particularly if there is an event at Wembley Stadium.