Hot Spares

Discussion in 'Traction & Rolling Stock' started by 61653 HTAFC, 8 Apr 2015.

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  1. 61653 HTAFC

    61653 HTAFC Established Member

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    Arriva Cross-country often have a Voyager in one of the centre roads at Birmingham New Street, and presumably have a crew ready to work it if needed. This strikes me as a sensible idea, but I can't think of any other examples bar the Clapham Junction yard HST during the recent Great Western diversions. How much does it cost to actually provide such a unit, presumably the crew will be rostered along with the other diagrams, having a spare unit to keep as a hot spare is a luxury many TOCs don't have though.
    Surely such things could be specified in franchise agreements, certainly in the long-term a spare TPE unit would be useful at Leeds, or failing that at York Leeman Road?

    Thoughts?
     
  2. MCR247

    MCR247 Established Member

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    I'm sure other TOCs have spares in exactly the same way, they're just less visible. If its the location of the spare that you're referring to, I'm not sure all TOCs will have such an obvious place as New St is for XC
     
  3. phil281

    phil281 Member

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    Certainly most driver depots have spare train crew, which is usually the problem rather than the train itself. Often units can be stepped up (i.e. turnaround times tightened) at major terminals but if the train crew are stuck further up the line, it is more difficult to step up train crew due to PNB's etc.
     
  4. 455driver

    455driver Veteran Member

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    That Voyager at Birmingham isn't crewed by 'spare' crews, if it is needed to cover for a late running train the crew that would have taken the late running train forward, when the late running train arrives in Birmingham it will be put in the middle road and become spare.

    The same crew work their same service forward, on time, using the spare Voyager, the only difference will be that it will run as a Z headcode instead of its normal one which will be being used by the late running train. For example suppose 1V42 is 45 minutes late at Derby, the crew that would relieve 1V42 at Birmingham would take the spare Voyager and they would become 1Z42 forward from Birmingham which would run in the path of the now cancelled from Birmingham 1V42.
     
    Last edited: 12 Apr 2015
  5. Cherry_Picker

    Cherry_Picker Established Member

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    XC will almost always have spare crew (driver and guard) in situ at New Street though.
     
  6. Tottenham Flyer

    Tottenham Flyer Member

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    AGA have spares at Livepool St off peak only- 4 car 317 on platform 8 and an 8 car 321 on platform 18. There's usually a similar set up on Saturdays too.

    The 317 arrives at 09:48 from Ely, and goes back as the 16:28 Cambridge. The 321's arrive at 10:01 from Braintree and go back as the 16:24 Southend Vic (both weekday arrangements). Weekends work differently, but there's usually a spare 317, 321 & 379 at Liverpool St on Saturdays.
     
  7. LowLevel

    LowLevel Established Member

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    EMT have a theoretical spare HST and 222 at Etches Park during the day, and a 153 at Nottingham. In practice the 153 in particular is often out and about.
     
  8. Peter Mugridge

    Peter Mugridge Established Member

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    Does Southern have a hot spare 442?







    What?:lol:
     
  9. Blindtraveler

    Blindtraveler Established Member

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    Nowhere near enough to a Pacer :(
    They may well have a spare 442, but the hotter it is, the less likely it is to be any use to anyone accept the London Fire Service!
     
  10. themiller

    themiller Member

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    Freightliner used to have a hot 70 at times!
     
  11. Topgun333

    Topgun333 Member

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    I'm struggling with the idea of a hot Northern 142 but it may exist!
     
  12. 455driver

    455driver Veteran Member

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    So you are saying that they will (almost) always have spare crew available with enough time to take the spare Voyager to Bristol or Sheffield are you?
    Or do you simply mean they will have spare crews who may or may not have any worthwhile time left to the end if their shift!

    I will remember that next time my XC train is cancelled due to lack of traincrew!
     
    Last edited: 12 Apr 2015
  13. Minilad

    Minilad Established Member

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    There certainly isn't always a spare crew at New St. It's not unusual to have no one spare. Either because there are no spare people rostered or the ones that have been are already being used.
    And it's not true to say the same crew will work the train forward by using the spare Voyager. It takes at least 20-30 mins to get the Voyager ready and out of the siding. Sometimes longer if, as is usual, it has to run round the houses to get to a platform. Time that the forward crew wouldn't always have. I have known occasions when the standby unit hasn't been used because of lack of available crew to put it into service
     
  14. talltim

    talltim Established Member

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    Only in the middle of summer, when the heating starts working and can't be turned off by the crew...
     
  15. 61653 HTAFC

    61653 HTAFC Established Member

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    Sadly, the slightly less-terrible pacers (143/144) seem to be more prone to self-immolation!

    I suppose it's one thing to have a spare unit and crew, quite another to have a convenient place to store it until you need it. Even getting the spare 220 from the centre roads at Birmingham isn't as straightforward as it would appear, apparently. Now if Northern had a spare unit and crew for (for example) a hot spare for Huddersfield or Calder Valley routes, one possible place to keep it would be the stabling sidings at Huddersfield. On Saturdays I've seen units brought out of there to cover a heavily delayed Bradford service but during the week there are no spare sets and very little opportunity to get a unit out of the sidings, halfway along the viaduct, and back into platform 4/6 without delaying other services. Bradford Interchange would be a possibility, but there are probably times when all 4 platforms are occupied, and I'm not sure if multiple occupancy of platforms is permitted. The Halifax turnback maybe as it currently isn't in regular use?
    There is also the fact that a spare unit at Halifax or Bradford Interchange is neither use nor ornament if there's a failure at Wakefield!
     
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