How do you think ordinary fare paying passengers think of their service?

Discussion in 'UK Railway Discussion' started by Samuel88, 22 Jun 2019.

  1. Samuel88

    Samuel88 On Moderation

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    I feel many posters on here have a rose tinted view of the railways, so taking those glasses off and looking at services as a commuter, or just someone who travels for leisure, how do you think they think of their service?
     
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  3. deltic

    deltic Established Member

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    I am quite happy with the service - but then I mainly travel for business on intercity trains and I am not paying
     
  4. Clip

    Clip On Moderation

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    I cant really complain - When it goes wrong i understand why and claim where necessary.

    National passenger surveys would give a better indicator than here i would say https://www.transportfocus.org.uk/r...earch/national-passenger-survey-introduction/

     
  5. AM9

    AM9 Established Member

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    I pay for all my rail travel and generally find the services OK. The main issues I have is from certain self-entitled passengers who feel that their wishes trump those of all others. About as irritating as similarly attituded drivers - but slightly less-dangerous.
     
  6. yorkie

    yorkie Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    I don't know how you could start to answer that question.

    A commuter who uses any of the routes operated by the lines of Northern, Hull Trains, etc which are affected by frequent cancellations and delays would probably be deeply dissatisfied.

    On the other hand a commuter who uses one of the more reliable routes would likely be very satisfied with the service.
     
  7. matt_world2004

    matt_world2004 Established Member

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    Off peak passengers are generally highly satisifed whereas peak passengers are generslly highly disastisfied. This is because small delays are a bigger deal for people who need to be there for a fixed time. A two minute delay to a passenger with an appointment can be a big deal, particulsrly with missed connections. A leisure passenger on the other hand see a two minute delay as evidence of high reliability.
     
  8. 3141

    3141 Established Member

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    Adding to that: I'm mostly a leisure passenger. Like Clip in post #3 I generally understand if things go wrong, which they rarely do, so I'm probably not "ordinary". If I was a peak time commuter I'd probably feel less happy, because I'd be more likely to experience delays, I might have to stand, and I'd be paying more. As yorkie has said, what passengers think is likely to be influenced by the recent history of the TOC they normally use. Mine is SWR and I'm as satisfied as I was with SWT. It would be difficult to find an ordinary passenger who hadn't been influenced by what he's heard in the media and who can ignore all that and form a judgement based solely on his own experience. Back in the days of BR there was a similar problem: BR was often the butt of jokes and passengers would inevitably have been influenced by that perception. Clip's suggestion about the National Passenger Surveys may be the best way to get at what ordinary passengers think, but there's still a problem, because if you were a regular passenger and you'd recently had two bad days your answers would probably be influenced by that experience, even if today's journey was perfect.
     
  9. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    Does membership of this board mean I stop being an ordinary fare paying passenger?
     
  10. Samuel88

    Samuel88 On Moderation

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    No, but just by being on this forum means you have an interest in the railways, and sometimes I feel that having an interest in any hobby clouds one's judgement in that interest.
     
  11. kristiang85

    kristiang85 Member

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    I pay £5k+ a year to get to London on South Western Railway and the service provided versus what I pay feels very sub-standard. Atrocious at times, to be honest.

    However, in the grand scheme of things, it is rather decent compared to other routes I've done in the UK and abroad, but obviously the price paid puts a very different spin on your thoughts on the service received.
     
  12. sheff1

    sheff1 Established Member

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    I have "an interest" in railways because I use them to travel around. Trains are certainly not a hobby for me. They are a means of transport - as are planes, ferries, trams, buses etc. I consider myself to be an "ordinary fare paying passenger" (albeit one who probably does more travel than average).

    I commuted by rail for about 5/6 months many years ago and don't recall any issues, but just decided it was not something I wanted to do. I prefer to live within walking distance (or at most, a 10 min bus/tram ride) of work.
     
    Last edited: 24 Jun 2019
  13. Shrewbly

    Shrewbly Member

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    It was interesting to hear the views of a friend who had never previously used a train before when, sadly, I had to introduce him to rail travel because he needed cancer treatment in London. Considering how intolerant of bad service he was in general, I was surprised that he was pretty happy with the train service and the station staff (Chiltern) - he much preferred the locomotive hauled stock though (so it's not just enthusiasts!). Delays annoyed him, inconsiderate passengers annoyed him even more, but his biggest gripe was the price he had to pay when he had to travel at peak times.

    Weirdly, considering that he worked with some very scary timber processing machinery, he was also terrified by trains passing platforms even at moderate speed - no problems keeping him behind the yellow lines!
     
  14. AM9

    AM9 Established Member

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    So that £5k per year equates to a bit over £10 each for over 400 journeys. Probably a lot better deal than passengers like Shrewbly's friend (post #11) who would be paying about half as much again for the same journey.
     
  15. Johngill100

    Johngill100 Established Member

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    I often hear this one when season ticket holders mention their pricing. Whilst they are pay x less for the journey than some the occasional user is only investing a small amount of meoney per annum and a tiny tiny percentage of their income.

    Season ticket holders on the other hand are spending large sums of money that can be significant percentages of their take home wages. The are also exposed to more of the failures of the service.
     
  16. BigCj34

    BigCj34 Member

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    In the North - probably unreliable and rolling stock is completely dated. In the South - expensive. Overcrowded applicable to both, though in the North there is presumably more track capacity available to have longer trains.

    Also cheaper to fly or drive, it is cheaper and better in Europe (backed up by dubious maths and comparisons) and that nationalizing will fix all.
     
  17. ComUtoR

    ComUtoR Established Member

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    Expensive and unreliable
     
  18. 3141

    3141 Established Member

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    I doubt that the ordinary passenger knows enough about rolling stock to be able to judge that it is "dated". I remember that in a Which report, about ten years ago, they quoted Merseyrail passengers who were complimentary about the "new" trains. Actually they had been refurbished. Four years ago I travelled from Darlington to Shildon on a very recently refurbished Northern class 156, and the friend I was with commented on the "new" train.
     
  19. Clip

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    This sort of thinking doesn't help as its neither true nor false.

    You want to plan - you're journey can be as cheap as chips - and 'expensive' is only relative if you cant afford it and not everyone is like that.

    And unreliable, again, depends on where and when you travel and any incident on the day but isnt reflective as a whole.
     
  20. BigCj34

    BigCj34 Member

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    Fair. To be honest I would say, from the outside, a class 158 looks newer than it is. However certain trains still look dated due to poor renovation work and just a lack of upkeep; the current Northern renovation work looks tatty already. An HST looks good as new on the inside however. Perception of age, rather than actual age, is what makes the difference i guess.
     
  21. GrimShady

    GrimShady Established Member

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    My only gripe is the constant downward spiral in interior spec and the cluttering on stations with endless amount of ticket barriers.

    I despise Northern Rail with a passion.
     
  22. Clip

    Clip On Moderation

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    We do need ticket barriers though - mainly due to the lack of investment in RPI's.
     
  23. yorksrob

    yorksrob Veteran Member

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    I am a commuter, leisure traveller and general rail passenger due to not driving. Generally I find the service to be quite good in terms of reliability (my line has led a quiet existence, largely unaffected by the recent timetable meltdowns).

    In terms of 'normal' non-enthusiast passengers, I expect they're concerned by the same things that I am: price, overcrowding, comfort of trains (seating and toilet availability) etc.
     
  24. anti-pacer

    anti-pacer Established Member

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    I travel between Huddersfield and Liverpool every week with TPE, prior to me moving to Liverpool next month.

    The service is better than it was with far less delays and now hardly any cancellations. In fact none of my trains have been cancelled, although I see the odd one that is. What lets TPE down is the short formed stock, however I believe that will change. Maybe somebody could tell me what stock is due to operate the Liverpool services.

    I often travel First Class. If I book in advance it's only about £5 per journey more expensive, and I get most of that back in complimentary refreshments. The main reason though is to not have to endure the busyness further down the train. I think the First Class layout could be better though on the 185's, given it's a thoroughfare to the toilet for Standard Class passengers in the rest of the coach.

    Given it is now only just over an hour between the two stations, the service is quick and on the whole fine.

    Northern on the other hand... well in the words of the D:Ream track, "Things Can Only Get Better".
     
  25. Iskra

    Iskra Established Member

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    The easiest way to answer this question is:

    Go on twitter: type in a TOC name or a railway line ie 'Bentham Line' and then read the comments...
     
  26. Iskra

    Iskra Established Member

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    I think 'ability to get a seat' is usually what comes out as the top priority for rail passengers when they do the surveys/consultations.
     
  27. GrimShady

    GrimShady Established Member

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    I also hate ultra hip and excessively familiar TOCs running down the service then telling me how awesome their "improvements" are.
     
  28. yorksrob

    yorksrob Veteran Member

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    Indeed. Or "overcrowding", to put it another way.

    I would be surprised if price wasn't up there as well.
     
  29. Clip

    Clip On Moderation

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    Which TOCs are these?
     
  30. ivanhoe

    ivanhoe Member

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    Very rarely had any issues and most of my journeys are for leisure. The only issue I would add is short formations on trains. XC are shocking for that on Stansted to Brum .
     
  31. GrimShady

    GrimShady Established Member

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    Gone now thankfully but still exist on the WCML.
     
  32. Clip

    Clip On Moderation

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    So Virgin then? wouldve been easier to say that but i think they still run services on it as i get them weekly
     

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