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I'm confused as to where all the trains fit at night...

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steamybrian

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Think London Overground use Crystal Palace, not sure about West Croydon.
Of course, there are other places that can be used but aren't. Purley Platform 6, Epsom Downs, I think Sutton Platform 4
There's also Oxted Bay for diesels that's used sometimes. East Grinstead, Uckfield are also used to berth stock
As far as I am aware Purley platform 6, Sutton platform 4, Uckfield and Epsom Downs are not used as berthing points.
Oxted down bay is mainly used during engineering works.
At East Grinstead two 8 car sets can be berthed- one in the siding and one in platform 2.
 
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ANDREW_D_WEBB

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You can at Hull if you arrive when the station opens at 04:45, all 6 platforms are stacked up with units, and the rest are in the sidings by Platform 2, roughly around 20 units overnight
The recent Channel 5 series following Trans Pennine had a segment about the nightly stabling of units at Hull station. In true Channel 5 style it was hyped to make it seem like a nightly battle of titanic proportions
 

hobbm013

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Thinking of Transport for Wales now, anyone know where units are kept. To mind I’ve got the following

Canton
Chester
Machynlleth
Holyhead
Crewe

Any others I’ve forgotten?
 

Peter0124

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Larkhall is another one for Scotrail, 6 car set stables there to form the 06:00 to Dalmuir
 

Anonymous10

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Dear moderators, we don't have a depot subforum so I put it here... please feel free to move if there is a better place

Where do trains go at night?

It sounds obvious - the depot, but I read that Longsight can take a maximum of fifteen 390s overnight. Now I know that there is a depot in Wembley and Glasgow, etc. But fifteen? It is the main depot for the Pendolinos and there are fifty six? So... where do all the other ones go?

If a depot as large as Longsight can only take fifteen Pendolinos, where are all the Eurostars kept overnight? Can Temple Mills take all seventeen 374s and the 373s at the same time? And Great Western Railway has over a hundred IETs split between North Pole, Maliphant, Stoke Gifford and I think some stay at Laira. If they can only take fifteen too, that accounts for only sixty or seventy IETs? LNER has all of the Azumas and the 225s as well over Bounds Green, Doncaster, Neville Hill and Craigentinny?

Unless of course, it means fifteen IN the actual shed, and more can sit on the sidings outside the depot? But if not... where do they all go?? Unless Longsight is just... small? Although Craigentinny can handle 176 vehicles... and that's only what, nineteen Azumas?

I'm confused. How many trains actually sit at the depot (inside and outside of it), and how many trains can stay overnight at places like North Pole and Bounds Green?

Please can someone clarify, because I'm surprised at how much less depots can take compared to what I thought. I don't mean how many can they do maintenance on, just... how many can stay there overnight? There doesn't seem to be enough room for them all if they can only take 15-20 trains...

Thanks
gwr station some iets at swansea or Carmarthen for stabling swansea has advantage of their being a Hitachi depot and landore tmd so basic maintenance can be done

Thinking of Transport for Wales now, anyone know where units are kept. To mind I’ve got the following

Canton
Chester
Machynlleth
Holyhead
Crewe

Any others I’ve forgotten?
Carmarthen 2-3 units if i remember right from a sunday visit Swansea not sure probably 3-4 rhymney 1 for early service to name a few think of a major reversing station or one with sidings like rhymney and likely one there i know in first lockdown landore also used
 

waverley47

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An interesting point that hasn't been made is the comparison between stacking MUs up and the old fashioned stock.

Fifty years ago, we had locos and coaching stock on any journey longer than about two hours. In those days, locos went to depots, but locos are short and interchangeable. That meant depots could be small, tucked into whatever corner there was lying empty, and tended to do light maintenance on whatever came through the door. Obviously locos had designated home depots, but they frequently turned up all over, and so anything pressing was dealt with before sending it home for proper work.

Coaching stock on the other hand didn't need much maintenance. It needed cleaning and watering, but that could be done at any station it ended up at. Carriage sidings existed for proper work, but carriages just tended to turn up whenever they needed maintenance; you don't need to take a whole rake out of service if the second coach has a wheel flat for example.

This collectively meant that not as much space was needed to stable whole rakes of stock, just the locos. Whole rakes ended up in whatever siding was free when they weren't being used, but most stuff just moved around the network until it broke.

Over time, the locos stopped being used and replaced with MUs. The loco depots were turned into MU depots, but you get fewer MUs in the same space. MUs are much more intensive, if one bit breaks you have to stable the whole thing until it's fixed. But most of those depots are still the same small size as when they were designed for locos, and so you need more places to stuff the trains until they are needed, or to wait for maintenance.

This, combined with there just being more train nowadays than there was fifty years ago, means that MUs just tend to be stabled wherever there is space to park them overnight. This could be sidings or platforms, and over time this has become the norm.

We haven't kept pace with more and more MUs that take up a lot of space, and it's cheaper to let it sit in a platform somewhere than send it back to the depot, so it stays there until morning. MUs don't need fueling every day, and watering is easy, and they don't need as much tlc as locos did, so it works well enough.
 

bramling

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Clansman

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Would be interesting to see the numbers Perth can take at a maximum. Perth is probably the most disproportiatley sized station when it comes to how the size of the place compares to it's importance due to railway geography.

On an average night I pass through there must surely be a mix of around 20 x 170s and 158s stabled there. Such as it's importance there's a number of empties that run through from Dundee and Glasgow each night IIRC.
 

RichardKing

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As far as I am aware Purley platform 6, Sutton platform 4, Uckfield and Epsom Downs are not used as berthing points.
Oxted down bay is mainly used during engineering works.
At East Grinstead two 8 car sets can be berthed- one in the siding and one in platform 2.
I remember there being a 171 berthed overnight at Uckfield - IIRC due to engineering works - a few years ago. GTR had to employ a security guard to protect the unit as a result of the station's 24/7 openness.
 

markymark2000

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Adding to Waverley47s post, I think if we compared MUs back in 2010 to MUs now, new MUs are longer. Think TPE used to run loads of 3 car, 185s. Even if these ran coupled, they could be split in the depot so everything fit. Now, TPE has 5 car 802s and 5 car 397s (I'll ignore the 68/MK5 sets as they aren't in use). A depot previously could have had trains stabled with 3 x 3 car units on a line. This line would now only take 1 unit (2x 802 is longer than 3 x 185).

This is just 1 example but there are plenty more examples out there. Similar to what was said, when lots of little MUs run coupled up for capacity, it's much easier to store them. If you create a longer train, you suddenly lose a lot of capacity in existing depots and the space needed for these units to be stored, increases drastically.


You could also use Northern as an example since a 142 was much shorter than the train replacing them, a 150 meaning again, less trains fit in the line which was created specifically to be the length of the 'modern' trains at the time.
 

Surreytraveller

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As far as I am aware Purley platform 6, Sutton platform 4, Uckfield and Epsom Downs are not used as berthing points.
Oxted down bay is mainly used during engineering works.
At East Grinstead two 8 car sets can be berthed- one in the siding and one in platform 2.
Uckfield gets used if there's a block north of Oxted.
The others are places where units can be berthed, but not usually planned
 

PHILIPE

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Thinking of Transport for Wales now, anyone know where units are kept. To mind I’ve got the following

Canton
Chester
Machynlleth
Holyhead
Crewe

Any others I’ve forgotten?
Carmarthen
Rhymney
Treherbert
Shrewsbury
Pwllheli
Llandudno Junction (Weekends)
 

greaterwest

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Alot of trains are berthed also overnight at Station termini where the train ends its day. Like Leeds/Weymouth/penzance/Some London Stations possibly. Portsmouth Harbour/Southsea/Man picc/Carlisle and many more for there next days journeys as prob not enough paths for trains to enter and leave the depot

Also plenty of sidings around the network too. For example Basingstoke Barton Mill/Poole/Southampton etc etc. Example below.
SWR have a fleet of around 400 so...
Weymouth station
Poole sidings
Bournemouth Depot
Bournemouth sidings.
Southampton sidings.
Eastleigh area(possibly)
Basingstoke Barton mill
Woking plat 6
Wimbledon Depot
Clapham yard
Possibly Waterloo.
Strawberry hill
Portsmouth stations/Fratton depot
Possibly Guildford
Reading Bay platform.
Salisbury depot
Exeter sidings/Station
Other sidings anyone know of on SWR?

To add and expand on this:

Basingstoke Down Yard
Basingstoke East End
Basingstoke Barton Mill
Eastleigh Down CS
Fareham bay platform (usually only during engineering work)
Farnham depot
Guildford station
Guildford North Box
Guildford Up CS
Haslemere platform 3 (usually only during engineering work)
Kingston bay platform (usually only during engineering work)
Northam Depot (Southampton)
Southampton Central platform 5
Staines CS
Weybridge bay platform (usually only during engineering work)
Windsor & Eton Riverside station
Woking platform 3
Woking Up CS
Woking East End CS
Yeovil (Junction) Down Siding
 

MotCO

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Everything so far has been about where the trains are stabled, but how to staff get to all these far-flung places to pick up their trains? Do they report to their usual base and there is a taxi standing by, or do they have to make their own way to wherever the trains are?
 

Tomnick

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Everything so far has been about where the trains are stabled, but how to staff get to all these far-flung places to pick up their trains? Do they report to their usual base and there is a taxi standing by, or do they have to make their own way to wherever the trains are?
Taxi, walk, travel 'pass' on another service (or ECS move), via London Underground - but, whatever it is, it's in the company's time!
 

bramling

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Everything so far has been about where the trains are stabled, but how to staff get to all these far-flung places to pick up their trains? Do they report to their usual base and there is a taxi standing by, or do they have to make their own way to wherever the trains are?

In general train crew depots *tend* to be located where there are stabling points. If not then the duty will include allowance for getting to or from the train, which can happen in a variety of ways - walking route, staff train, normal passenger train, taxi, drop off at staff platform.

Stewarts Lane Berthing Sidings and Battersea Pier are interesting ones!
 

Tomnick

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i believe for ones in rhymney ect they would drive / walk there
Passenger traincrew tend not to drive road vehicles anywhere in the course of their duties. I don't think it'd really be practical anyway, certainly not in that sort of situation. It's a bit different for freight drivers, who do regularly drive a company vehicle to go and relieve a train, with the driver that they've relieved then using the van to get back to wherever they need to be.
 

Anonymous10

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Passenger traincrew tend not to drive road vehicles anywhere in the course of their duties. I don't think it'd really be practical anyway, certainly not in that sort of situation. It's a bit different for freight drivers, who do regularly drive a company vehicle to go and relieve a train, with the driver that they've relieved then using the van to get back to wherever they need to be.
i was presuming with rhymney they might drive in as not exactly a hard station to get back to at end of day but drive also covered taxi
 

4-SUB 4732

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As @swt_passenger has stated, there is a big reliance on out stabling in platforms. Causes headaches at those locations during maintenance or disruptive access and you have to find somewhere else to put the units!
Bromley North amazingly had to stable an 8/465 very recently; as did Sidcup Siding overnight. Believe Charing Cross was shut.
 

Flange Squeal

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To add and expand on this:

Basingstoke Down Yard
Basingstoke East End
Basingstoke Barton Mill
Eastleigh Down CS
Fareham bay platform (usually only during engineering work)
Farnham depot
Guildford station
Guildford North Box
Guildford Up CS
Haslemere platform 3 (usually only during engineering work)
Kingston bay platform (usually only during engineering work)
Northam Depot (Southampton)
Southampton Central platform 5
Staines CS
Weybridge bay platform (usually only during engineering work)
Windsor & Eton Riverside station
Woking platform 3
Woking Up CS
Woking East End CS
Yeovil (Junction) Down Siding
Further to @4REP 's original post and the above by @greaterwest , Aldershot platform 3 can also be added. This is generally one for the 'during engineering work' category though, usually when more stock than usual is needed to be kept that side of a closure and there's no spare capacity in Farnham depot. Recently it housed a couple of 444s when space at Guildford was reduced/unavailable due to some overnight engineering works.
 
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bramling

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Ashford East Berthing Sidings
Ashford Depot
Ashford Up Sidings
Bellingham Down Sidings
Cannon Street
Charing Cross
Dartford
Dartford Down Siding
Dartford Up Sidings
Dover Priory Sidings
Faversham
Faversham Back Road
Faversham Up Sidings
Folkestone East Train Roads
Gillingham Depot
Gillingham Up Siding
Grove Park Down Sidings
Grove Park Shed
Grove Park Up Sidings
Hastings
Hastings Park Sidings
Orpington
Orpington Down Sidings
Plumstead Sidings
Ramsgate
Ramsgate Depot
Ramsgate New Sidings
St Leonards West Marina Depot
Slade Green Depot
Slade Green Up Sidings
Tonbridge
Tonbridge Down Main Siding
Tonbridge Jubilee Sidings
Victoria
Victoria Grosvenor Shed

LTS
East Ham Depot
Shoeburyness Carriage Sidings

AGA
Bishops Stortford Carriage Sidings
Cambridge Carriage Sidings
Clacton
Clacton Carriage Sidings
Colchester Bridge Road (presume this is Up Clacton Siding)
Colchester Carriage Sidings
Colchester Sudbury Dock
Harwich International
Hertford East
Ipswich
Ipswich Carriage Sidings
Kings Lynn Carriage Sidings
Liverpool Street
Norwich Crown Point Depot
Norwich Royal Dock
Norwich Jubilee Sidings
Norwich Victoria Sidings
Orient Way Carriage Sidings
Parkeston Carriage Sidings
Southend Victoria Down Carriage Sidings
Southend Victoria Up Carriage Sidings
Stansted Airport

LNER
Aberdeen Clayhills Depot
Bounds Green Depot
Craigentinny Depot
Doncaster Carr Depot
Ferme Park Sidings
Heaton Depot
King’s Cross
Inverness
Neville Hill Depot
Polmadie Depot
York

(I will do a few more of these over the next few days).
 
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4-SUB 4732

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Also stabling at London Bridge, on the GN there used to be stabling at out stations such as Hertford North using Platform 3, the headshunt and the yard there.
GN I recall nothing stabled overnight (2017) at Kings Cross or Moorgate.

They also didn’t stable in platforms at Peterborough, Welwyn, Cambridge or Hertford.

I think the only platform stabling was Kings Lynn!
 
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