Imminent Industrial Action

[Tomonthetrain]

Me and my colleagues who are union members (no matter what union) will be striking. And I honestly feel I'm doing the right thing for me.

 

[Ferret]

Me and my colleagues who are union members (no matter what union) will be striking. And I honestly feel I'm doing the right thing for me.

As a Union member myself, I am wondering whether the Pensions dispute is actually winnable. There seemed to be distinct apathy with the ballots themselves, and when it comes to joining in strike after strike or putting food on the table I'd wonder how solid the strikes will be.

 

[Chew Chew]

I fully support the workers.

The Tories need to remember that they weren't voted into power, they got in there through Clegg being an absolute weasel, and that as soon as Labour have a decent leader they'll be out on their ear again.

Got to love the way they are complaining about how much this will damage the economy, what about the extra bank holiday for the Royal Wedding?? How much did that damage the economy outside of London?

 

[Butts]

I fully support the workers.

The Tories need to remember that they weren't voted into power, they got in there through Clegg being an absolute weasel, and that as soon as Labour have a decent leader they'll be out on their ear again.

Got to love the way they are complaining about how much this will damage the economy, what about the extra bank holiday for the Royal Wedding?? How much did that damage the economy outside of London?

That's what they were saying in 1979.....eh took 17 years !!! -woops I mean 18

 

[theblackwatch]

It would be interesting to see what the government would do if the unions were to withdraw from the pension agreement and recommend members take out a private pension instead. Given that the pension contributions received from public sector workers are just put into the government's pot rather than being invested like private pension schemes, it would severely reduce the government's income.

 

[Oswyntail]

...

The Tories need to remember that they weren't voted into power, they got in there through Clegg being an absolute weasel, and that as soon as Labour have a decent leader they'll be out on their ear again.

And who would have been in power had the LibDems fallen differently?And where do you see a decent Labour leader coming from? No real political giants among the current bunch, are there? (Witness the way they stood up to Brown's insane policies)

...Got to love the way they are complaining about how much this will damage the economy, what about the extra bank holiday for the Royal Wedding?? How much did that damage the economy outside of London?

Ah, the Facebook paradox post! The extra public holiday was as damaging as any other, ie on balance not much, because most services remain active and there is not obstructive disruption. The strike is designed to disrupt and stop services. Not at all comparable.

 

[SS4]

I will be supporting the strike because I know from personal experience those at the sharp end have been silenced by having to professionally support the government of the day whereas the government are spouting all kinds of rubbish against them.

What's more don't think even for a second that any senior managers will be affected, oh no, only those who do the actual work will suffer.

 

[Schnellzug]

That's what they were saying in 1979.....eh took 17 years !!! -woops I mean 18

and that, you think, would be a good precedent? What's needed is a Strong leader? and cameron and his little friend are that Strong leader? Although there are parallels; the mad old Bat made a complete pig's worth of the job in her first couple of years (people, looking back with a rosy glow of nostalgia for the days when we had a Strong leader who Took On the Unions who were Holding the Country to Ransom forget now just what a pig's worth she did do of it; among which were enormous defence cuts including proposing to sell off Invincible), and then Leopoldo Galtieri, seeing an opportunioty presented by those defence cuts, stepped in and saved her career by giving her a War to win, and she rode to glory on the coat tails of that , and then, seeing that that was a succesful strategy, looked around for another Enemy, and picked on the Unions who were Holding the Country to Ransom.
That's the Thatcher's rise to glory in a nutshell.

 

[Oswyntail]

I will be supporting the strike because I know from personal experience those at the sharp end have been silenced by having to professionally support the government of the day whereas the government are spouting all kinds of rubbish against them.

That I do find is unforgiveable. Given the work the Civil Service do, one would hope that any government would show appreciation. Sadly, when Labour came in in 1997 (sorry!) they brought with them a paranoid suspicion that the Civil Servants would be supporters of the previous government, and this has happened again.

What's more don't think even for a second that any senior managers will be affected, oh no, only those who do the actual work will suffer.

Define "senior manager"! The FDA is calling for its members to strike, and, by definition, they are senior management.

 

[Aictos]

What I would like to understand is why did no one say anything when Brown was raiding the pensions and selling off the gold reserves when chancellor - Why did no one say enough is enough and went on strike to protect their pensions but also the gold reserves?

For what Labour is supposed to stand for, I'm 100% convinced that they too would have done exactly the same as the Conservatives-Liberal Democrats government and brought cuts to the UK and the unions still would have gone out on strike.

 

[richw]

Prior to the last general election the advise I was given by many "in the know" was to vote for who I DON'T want in power in 5 years. The reason they gave was Gordon had made such a mess of things, high unpopular cuts would be inevitable, so whoever in power would have a zero chance of winning the next general election!

Sent from my HTC Sensation Z710e using Tapatalk

 

[nedchester]

Well I think public sector workers have even more reason to be out today as Osborne has told us we are to suffer a 1% cap on pay rises for two years following a two year pay freeze, which when added to the proposed extra pension contributions will make us 30% worse off.

I suspect this is just the beginning.

 

[Butts]

One interesting aspect of the action with regard to public transport.

Northern Ireland - no services at all.

Glasgow Subway - no services at all.

Tyne & Wear Metro - no service at all.

How have these transport providers escaped privatisation that has encompassed the majority of the UK.

 

[AlexS]

I'm fed up of being dumped on. I wasn't going to strike today but the 1% pay cap has overturned it and I'm out *shrug*

Please don't just read everything in to the pensions issue. For me the issue is it's all that plus more.

We're massively understaffed (to the point where work is being outsourced to the private sector because we can't keep up with it now - I know for a fact having had to process the outputs from previous outsourcing that what they produce is, in my humble opinion, ****. Agency/very short term workers who are there for a month at a time who don't put any thought or real effort in it - a chunk of it was unreadable as it gave every appearance of being typed by a toddler and the rest of it was just a waste of time because they'd miss half of the required information out). There is next to no recruitment going on. Pay freeze, followed by pay cap, announced on the day before there's a strike because we've already had enough.

A 30% real terms pay cut is not something I can keep going on forever. It's getting to the point where I'm no longer bothered about the job because I can't really see any light at the end of the tunnel and it appears we'll all be for the high jump in a few years at most anyway.

 

[Butts]

I read an article in "The Independent" yesterday intimating that this whole day of action is just a circus convenient to both sides for differing reasons.

They are actually quite close to agreement which is expected shortly, before Christmas.

 

[jon0844]

Prior to the last general election the advise I was given by many "in the know" was to vote for who I DON'T want in power in 5 years. The reason they gave was Gordon had made such a mess of things, high unpopular cuts would be inevitable, so whoever in power would have a zero chance of winning the next general election!

Yes, it actually suited Labour to 'sit one out' as anyone trying to fix the mess is likely to be doomed.. and Labour couldn't even blame anyone else if they'd stayed in (well, they could just blame it all on America - but nobody is that dumb).

Can anyone imagine that Labour wouldn't have done the same, or would they have carried on spending money and ignoring the situation until we ended up like Greece or Italy?

 

[HST Power]

You can't blame the government for the cuts, any ruling party would've had to make spending measures. You can brand them 'Plan A' with George Osborne, you can brand them the 'Five Pointer' with Ed Balls; we have a deficit, we have to cut it, spending needs to be reduced.

The Tories need to remember that they weren't voted into power, they got in there through Clegg being an absolute weasel, and that as soon as Labour have a decent leader they'll be out on their ear again.

Rubbish! Six out of ten people voted Lib Dem or Tory at the last election and more people voted Conservative than for any other party. How can you call Clegg a weasel, Labour weren't exactly throwing themselves from the top storey window trying to avoid him, they were just as keen to saddle up with the minority parties and find a majority!

 

[Butts]

You can't blame the government for the cuts, any ruling party would've had to make spending measures. You can brand them 'Plan A' with George Osborne, you can brand them the 'Five Pointer' with Ed Balls; we have a deficit, we have to cut it, spending needs to be reduced.



Rubbish! Six out of ten people voted Lib Dem or Tory at the last election and more people voted Conservative than for any other party. How can you call Clegg a weasel, Labour weren't exactly throwing themselves from the top storey window trying to avoid him, they were just as keen to saddle up with the minority parties and find a majority!

Labour voted into power in 2005 with 36% of the vote giving a 60 seat majority - surely that is even less representative than the current incumbents.

 

[Ferret]

Labour voted into power in 2005 with 36% of the vote giving a 60 seat majority - surely that is even less representative than the current incumbents.

Ah yes, and then the ridiculous Harriet Harman (aka Labour's biggest vote loser) protests about gerrymandering when there's a boundary review to even things up! Beyond ridiculous.

 

[Old Timer]

I'm fed up of being dumped on. I wasn't going to strike today but the 1% pay cap has overturned it and I'm out *shrug*

Please don't just read everything in to the pensions issue. For me the issue is it's all that plus more.

We're massively understaffed (to the point where work is being outsourced to the private sector because we can't keep up with it now - I know for a fact having had to process the outputs from previous outsourcing that what they produce is, in my humble opinion, ****. Agency/very short term workers who are there for a month at a time who don't put any thought or real effort in it - a chunk of it was unreadable as it gave every appearance of being typed by a toddler and the rest of it was just a waste of time because they'd miss half of the required information out). There is next to no recruitment going on. Pay freeze, followed by pay cap, announced on the day before there's a strike because we've already had enough.

A 30% real terms pay cut is not something I can keep going on forever. It's getting to the point where I'm no longer bothered about the job because I can't really see any light at the end of the tunnel and it appears we'll all be for the high jump in a few years at most anyway.

Welcome to life in the REAL world.

 

[SS4]

We're massively understaffed (to the point where work is being outsourced to the private sector because we can't keep up with it now - I know for a fact having had to process the outputs from previous outsourcing that what they produce is, in my humble opinion, ****. Agency/very short term workers who are there for a month at a time who don't put any thought or real effort in it - a chunk of it was unreadable as it gave every appearance of being typed by a toddler and the rest of it was just a waste of time because they'd miss half of the required information out). There is next to no recruitment going on. Pay freeze, followed by pay cap, announced on the day before there's a strike because we've already had enough. .

A fine example of a self-fulfilling prophecy. The government (much as I loathe to admit it this goes beyond the current administration) wants to cut the public sector. Therefore they let natural wastage occur to the point where work needs to be contracted out and therefore there is not as much work so the prophecy is fulfilled.

I'm with the unions (especially PCS) when Mark Serwotka is portrayed as Lucifer himself by the media. I bet there is no cap on MPs expenses, bankers bonuses or rich people perks.

 

[Old Timer]

Well I think public sector workers have even more reason to be out today as Osborne has told us we are to suffer a 1% cap on pay rises for two years following a two year pay freeze, which when added to the proposed extra pension contributions will make us 30% worse off.

I suspect this is just the beginning.

Back in 2007 Mrs OT was invited to attend a Working Party on the future of Pensions. The WP was led by Yvette Cooper (Mrs Balls for your information).

Amazingly the very actions which the Coalition Government are now implementing were discussed at the WP, with the conclusion that these actions would be necessary, and would be implemented by Labour. This was stated by the lady herself, so these changes were already in the pipeline.

Can you please comment on this bearing in mind you believe that this is some sort of Coalition "shaft the working man" grand plan ?

A fine example of a self-fulfilling prophecy. The government (much as I loathe to admit it this goes beyond the current administration) wants to cut the public sector. Therefore they let natural wastage occur to the point where work needs to be contracted out and therefore there is not as much work so the prophecy is fulfilled.

I'm with the unions (especially PCS) when Mark Serwotka is portrayed as Lucifer himself by the media. I bet there is no cap on MPs expenses, bankers bonuses or rich people perks.

As public sector spending will be HIGHER in 2014/2015 than now, please can you explain where these "cuts" are coming from please ???

 

[theblackwatch]

Interestingly I have just been looking at the 2010-2011 accounts of one public body. Of the four Directors, three made no pension contributions at all (despite receiving salary/fees varying from £25k to £88k). One rule for some...

 

[SS4]

Back in 2007 Mrs OT was invited to attend a Working Party on the future of Pensions. The WP was led by Yvette Cooper (Mrs Balls for your information).

Amazingly the very actions which the Coalition Government are now implementing were discussed at the WP, with the conclusion that these actions would be necessary, and would be implemented by Labour. This was stated by the lady herself, so these changes were already in the pipeline.

Can you please comment on this bearing in mind you believe that this is some sort of Coalition "shaft the working man" grand plan ?



As public sector spending will be HIGHER in 2014/2015 than now, please can you explain where these "cuts" are coming from please ???

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-15907858
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-15703997
Google Search Results
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Interestingly I have just been looking at the 2010-2011 accounts of one public body. Of the four Directors, three made no pension contributions at all (despite receiving salary/fees varying from £25k to £88k). One rule for some...

I'd be interested to see what OT has to say about this


If the government were interested in the average Briton then they'd do something to stem inflation largely from food and fuel

 

[Old Timer]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-15907858
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-15703997
Google Search Results

I did not raise the issue of manpower cuts, I clearly pointed out that the amount of spending on public services will be higher than it is now, therefore where are these "cuts". As the last Labour Government was already well into cutting back on the public sector, I can only see at attempt to show that the Coalition Government, which incidentally I detest, alone is responsible for making these redundancies. These are simply an continuation of what Labour had already commenced.

That said in the year 2010/2011 public sector employment actually rose from 5.89m to 6.05m if memory serves me right.

If the government were interested in the average Briton then they'd do something to stem inflation largely from food and fuel

Clearly you do not go shopping much ?

There is currently yet another supermarket price war going on, however as much food is now imported, then prices will reflect what the World economic conditions dictate.

If you had bothered to look at the Chancelleor's Autumn statement you would have noted that he has stopped the January fuel duty rise.

I'd be interested to see what OT has to say about this

This is a perfect example of the Public Sector at work.

Anyone in a Public Sector pension has got it made. Twice the average private employers contributions, a guaranteed final salary Pension, which actually would be even higher under the proposed changes.

It has been calculated that to receive the same Pension as a Nurse, a working in the private sector would have to pay £458 per month for life into a private pension fund.

As someone who has seen my Pension fund collapse and now has to invest some 20% of my salary in pension contributions you can hardly expect me to have any sympathy for those who are whinging about a 1.5% increase in their contributions. The higher figure spouted out by the Trade Unions is disingenuaous as it would only apply to those at the very top of the salary range. It would not apply to anyone else, and anyone earning £15,000 a year or less will see no increase - indeed the new arrangements will allow for a 1/60th calculation rather than a 1/80th calculation which will mean a much higher pension than under the existing arrangements. Something keep very quiet by the Trade Unions who are fighting a Political campaign how otherwise can you defend changes that would improve pensions for the lowest earners

 

[Michael.Y]

Labour voted into power in 2005 with 36% of the vote giving a 60 seat majority - surely that is even less representative than the current incumbents.

Well it's not as if we've had a referendum in the past 12 months to invite the British public to change the voting system in favour of one that is more representative of the percentage vote....


...oh wait....

 

[Oswyntail]

... The government (much as I loathe to admit it this goes beyond the current administration) wants to cut the public sector. Therefore they let natural wastage occur to the point where work needs to be contracted out and therefore there is not as much work so the prophecy is fulfilled...

The impending crisis on pensions and longevity was really brought into focus by a report produced in 2000. This was the stimulus that prompted the private sector to rush into reform and the abandonment of final salary schemes. As OT has pointed out, the government was aware of the problem, and was preparing to take the necessary actions. However, another part of the DWP had the policy of creating jobs in the public sector to massage unemployment figures; at the same time,"investment" by the government was largely going into higher pay for vote-catchingly popular areas. The end result was a huge increase in the pensions liability when measures were needed to reduce it. This has two implications for the current situation:-

• Reductions in public sector jobs are coming from a historically high level. This does not make it any less painful for the real people who lose their jobs, of course
• The pain we are all suffering now would have been a good deal less if the government from 2000 to 2010 had had some level of fiscal co-ordination and responsibility. Instead it had Brown.

That is background, but it should not be the sole, or even prominent argument today. There needs to be more rational debate about strategy. We have the government view, but what we are not getting is a coherent description of any alternatives. "I disagree" does not constitute debate

 

[BlythPower]

If you had bothered to look at the Chancelleor's Autumn statement you would have noted that he has stopped the January fuel duty rise.

And if you read it all, the rise has merely been postponed until August 2012.

 

[Madge Wildfire]

As someone who has seen my Pension fund collapse and now has to invest some 20% of my salary in pension contributions you can hardly expect me to have any sympathy for those who are whinging about a 1.5% increase in their contributions. The higher figure spouted out by the Trade Unions is disingenuaous as it would only apply to those at the very top of the salary range. It would not apply to anyone else, and anyone earning £15,000 a year or less will see no increase - indeed the new arrangements will allow for a 1/60th calculation rather than a 1/80th calculation which will mean a much higher pension than under the existing arrangements. Something keep very quiet by the Trade Unions who are fighting a Political campaign how otherwise can you defend changes that would improve pensions for the lowest earners

Exactly.

This is something that public sector workers seem to turn a deliberate blind eye to.

When the stock market collapses, irrespective of who is/was responsible, those with private pensions see their value maybe halve in the space of a few weeks. This also halves the potential annuity from which their pension will be calculated at retirement.

Public pensions are not subject to these unpredictabilities and disasters, in fact they are indexed linked to rise in line with inflation.

But public pensions are not plucked from thin air, they have to be paid for by the authorities despite the drop in their funds shareholding value. So who pays the shortfall?

Private company taxpayers who have already seen their own pensions halve? Or the public sector workers who are going to get the payout in the future. Sadly the public sector dont want to pay for something that was not of their doing, even though everyone else has no choice.

 

[Old Timer]

And if you read it all, the rise has merely been postponed until August 2012.

And if as usual you had done your research properly, you would have known that there were two planned rises. One for January (5p) which has been cancelled and one for August which has been reduced to 3p. :roll:

I think the wrong person is wearing the hat