Incident at Loughborough Junction (18/06)

[Wivenswold]

Some welcome and understanding comments above. Thoughts go to all the railway staff involved and the families of the victims.

Yes, it's illegal and to be condemed but it's a nasty end to what are basically teenage kicks.

 

[Deepgreen]

Some welcome and understanding comments above. Thoughts go to all the railway staff involved and the families of the victims.

Yes, it's illegal and to be condoned but it's a nasty end to what are basically teenage kicks.

I hope you mean 'condemned' rather than "condoned"? "Teenage kicks" by men reported to be in their twenties and part of a national scourge of vandalism and destruction. No doubt they'll be hailed as heroes by their moronic mates and messages will proliferate along the railway in their memories. They were old enough to know very well what they were doing was wrong and very dangerous, so I have no sympathy.

 

[SPADTrap]

Tough lesson learned then.

 

[CharlieSpotted]

In that location from looking at the video of where they were gathered, if it was on the Up Catford Loop, there is a downhill gradient with a slight left curve. They would've been obscured until last moment potentially. If it was on the Down Catford Loop, there would've possibly been the morning rising sun right in the drivers face. Without wishing to be insensitive, I think it's pretty obvious the driver didn't notice considering it's not known which train was involved.

Question was meant genuinely, I assure you. (Perhaps would have been better without the emoticon...)

Clearly this driver didn't notice, I wondered how unusual that was.

Thanks for the reply which adds useful context. Even if visibility was not so good, I was wondering if one might notice an unusual noise or vibration which might give a clue. That said, I expect driving a train is a day full of odd noises and vibrations!

 

[tsr]

I have no doubt the BTP will be investigating what state the individuals were in when hit by a train. Other posters have touched on the fact that there is probably more to this story than initially reported.

If they were alive and well, motivation will obviously be interesting, but if they were not in good shape, that will also open up a multitude of questions. Various scenarios spring to mind, though I am not privy to whether or not any of them are linked or plausible.

Eg. were they influenced by others, or by substances taken? Were they chased or even deposited on the track? As many will know, graffiti and other crimes aren’t generally completely isolated from each other...

Time will tell.

 

[ComUtoR]

Even if visibility was not so good, I was wondering if one might notice an unusual noise or vibration which might give a clue. That said, I expect driving a train is a day full of odd noises and vibrations!

I can generally notice a noise or notice something up against the side of my unit about half a coach or a coach length back but my units are very different to, potentially, a freight train. If the cab passed the person or persons before anything happened then I doubt I would notice, let alone hear.

 

[rebelrouser]

I can generally notice a noise or notice something up against the side of my unit about half a coach or a coach length back but my units are very different to, potentially, a freight train. If the cab passed the person or persons before anything happened then I doubt I would notice, let alone hear.

They may have been wearing headphones,thinking no trains will be running at that time of night,whatever still shocking.

 

[TheEdge]

It's not unknown for fatalities to happen at night and go unnoticed. In fact I know of one fatality on the GEML when the unit involved was only discovered when an AWS/TPWS fault was investigated at Ilford and found to be aerial damage caused by the body plus human remains on the bottom.

 

[broadgage]

Without wishing to be insensitive, what are the chances of a train hitting three people and the driver not noticing?

Significant if the victims were struck by the side of the train, rather than by the driving cab.

 

[mpthomson]

Declared by whom?

Emergency services normally. It activates responses within the NHS, particularly for ED/Trauma staffing.

 

[38Cto15E]

What sort of speed would a freight train be doing at the scene of the incident?

 

[GW43125]

What sort of speed would a freight train be doing at the scene of the incident?

I believe it's 20 round that spur.

 

[dctraindriver]

I hope you mean 'condemned' rather than "condoned"? "Teenage kicks" by men reported to be in their twenties and part of a national scourge of vandalism and destruction. No doubt they'll be hailed as heroes by their moronic mates and messages will proliferate along the railway in their memories. They were old enough to know very well what they were doing was wrong and very dangerous, so I have no sympathy.

Have a day off, seriously. They shouldn’t have done it, yes there is a problem with damaging property however how anyone can have no sense of sympathy that this has happened is something I cannot get my head around.

 

[Wivenswold]

I hope you mean 'condemned' rather than "condoned"? "Teenage kicks" by men reported to be in their twenties and part of a national scourge of vandalism and destruction. No doubt they'll be hailed as heroes by their moronic mates and messages will proliferate along the railway in their memories. They were old enough to know very well what they were doing was wrong and very dangerous, so I have no sympathy.

Yes, "condemned", duly edited thanks.

I don't think they'll be hailed as heroes by their mates, it will be a nasty shock to the system for them and their families, it will be crushing news.

Making generalisations about people doesn't help us understand them, it just makes the divide even greater. The answer to any problem is far away from the cliches that are spouted.

 

[Skoodle]

I believe it's 20 round that spur.

10 for freight, 20 for passenger.

 

[thenorthern]

Thoughts are with those involved it's not nice for anyone to lose a family member. Also thoughts are with the railway staff who have to deal with tragic incidents.

If it's confirmed that it was graffiti sprayers that have been killed I hope there isn't any blaming of Network Rail or the railway companies for not putting adequate safety measures in place as unfortunately in times like this there is often people trying to blame Network Rail.

 

[87015]

Hoped everyone has upped security at stabling points tonight...

 

[Bromley boy]

Indeed. And of course not forgetting the poor sods who had to clear up three corpses this morning.

I’m afraid my sympathy in this case is entirely limited to the staff involved. I can’t feel any pity for those who deliberately put themselves in harm’s way to perform criminal acts, and then come a cropper.

 

[BRX]

Have a day off, seriously. They shouldn’t have done it, yes there is a problem with damaging property however how anyone can have no sense of sympathy that this has happened is something I cannot get my head around.

Same here, some of the comments on here are disgusting.

 

[BRX]

I believe it's 20 round that spur.

I didn't happen on the spur, though. It was on the main lines. Canterbury/Brixton spur is to the north, parallel at that point and a bit lower down.

 

[E_Reeves]

Would it really be necessary to be telling the driver involved that it was their train? Surely it'd be best to avoid the bad feelings?

 

[Ladder23]

Utterly appalled by some comments I have read

 

[Domh245]

Would it really be necessary to be telling the driver involved that it was their train? Surely it'd be best to avoid the bad feelings?

I think it would have to be part and parcel of the investigation - did you see anything, did you notice anything amiss, etc...

 

[E_Reeves]

I assume the in-cab recording will be collected from the service involved, maybe that could shed some light on what really happened.

 

[farleigh]

As far as I know it has not been established that they were graffiti operatives.
And if they were, then it is wrong to say that they deserved to die IMHO

 

[E_Reeves]

As far as I know it has not been established that they were graffiti operatives.
And if they were, then it is wrong to say that they deserved to die IMHO

I don't think anybody genuinely believes that they DESERVED to die...

 

[GB]

Utterly appalled by some comments I have read

Unless some have been deleted I do not see any comments that I'd consider appalling.

 

[Bromley boy]

As far as I know it has not been established that they were graffiti operatives.
And if they were, then it is wrong to say that they deserved to die IMHO

Nobody has said that.

People have said that they were criminals who shouldn’t have been on the tracks in the first place.

Putting alleged graffiti “artistry” aside, trespass on the railway is a criminal offence in and of itself.

 

[martin2345uk]

Do all trains have forward facing CCTV these days...?

 

[E_Reeves]

I'm pretty sure most (if not all) do