Incident at Waterloo this morning -

Status
Not open for further replies.

KentonCanary

Member
Joined
2 Aug 2010
Messages
16
Location
Between Norwich and London
Quick bit of help if that's ok with everyone.

A work pal travels each day from Fareham to Waterloo. He’s held an annual season ticket gold card for years. At Waterloo this morning there was a queue at the barriers so he followed a lady though with a case and didn’t put his ticket through the machine.

He was challenged by an inspector who told him it was a bye law he had to put his ticket though the machine. He then had to supply his details including gold card number and date of birth and will be reported.

He made no attempt to avoid paying or defraud the railway, just wanted to save some time. And produced a valid ticket when asked.

Can anyone clarify the position here?

Thanks,
Tim
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

OwlMan

Established Member
Joined
25 Jun 2008
Messages
3,207
Location
Bedworth, Warwickshire
ByLaw 9 (2) see below

9. Stations and railway premises
(2) Where the entrance to or exit from any platform or station is via a manned or an automatic ticket barrier no person shall enter or leave the station, except with permission from an authorised person, without passing through the barrier in the correct manner.

Peter
 

trc666

Member
Joined
6 Jul 2005
Messages
232
Location
Islington
If your valid Gold Card (or any ticket for that matter) doesn't work, then show the ticket to gateline or Revenue Protection staff who will then open a barrier for you. You can still be reported under the byelaws for improper use of the automatic barriers (forcing the paddles to get through, climbing over / crawling under, tailgating etc) whether you hold a valid ticket or not.
 

Urban Gateline

Established Member
Joined
8 Mar 2011
Messages
1,526
Thanks for the reply. I understand that my work pal (who is also called Tim but not me, honest!) walked through behind a lady wheeling a suitcase, didn't jump or force the barrier etc.
Unfortunately this still breaks the aforementioned byelaw. Regardless of the reason for doing it, saving time is not an excuse as there will be many other commuters having to queue to exit the barriers, thus it is a selfish act.

In the view of someone who works at the barriers, actions like your friends' are deemed suspicious by staff as we have no way of knowing whether a valid ticket was held. Therefore I wouldn't recommend he do this again as there will be people not afraid of stopping him just for the sake of seeing his ticket and it's certainly not worth the risk of a fine if the byelaw prosecution is sucessful!

I do hope you don't see this as too harsh, I'm just trying to put the staff's perspective forward. :)
 

jopsuk

Veteran Member
Joined
13 May 2008
Messages
12,426
Surely once the gate line staff are shown a valid ticket though the person should just be given a warning not to do it again- surely there's no need for details to be taken? After all, the passenger has proven that whilst your suspicion was justifiable, they weren't attempting to evade paying? No actual harm done, just don't do it again.
 

aleph_0

Member
Joined
15 Sep 2010
Messages
160
Unfortunately this still breaks the aforementioned byelaw. Regardless of the reason for doing it, saving time is not an excuse as there will be many other commuters having to queue to exit the barriers, thus it is a selfish act.
How is it a selfish act with respect to other passengers? It doesn't actually slow down the journey of any other passenger (in fact, if you get through the barrier quicker, it saves time for the passengers behind you, so helps everyone).

It could possibly be described as selfish because it diverts RPI time from people who are evading the fare, which helps fare evasion (which takes money from the system). Obviously the fact that it is against the bylaws is a dominating factor here, and saving time isn't an excuse. Although prosecution would seem a bit ott, when the person now being aware should prevent it happening again.
 

Urban Gateline

Established Member
Joined
8 Mar 2011
Messages
1,526
How is it a selfish act with respect to other passengers? It doesn't actually slow down the journey of any other passenger (in fact, if you get through the barrier quicker, it saves time for the passengers behind you, so helps everyone).
It is a selfish act because the 100 or so other passengers are removing their ticket from ticket wallet and putting it through the barrier correctly in order to pass through, so why should one person do any different, they should just be patient and wait like everyone else.

Although it is harsh to punish someone for doing what the OP's friend did, the Byelaw exists to warn passengers that it is not acceptable to do such a thing, there needs to be some way of preventing people from doing it and this is it!
 

island

Veteran Member
Joined
30 Dec 2010
Messages
11,175
Location
0036
Thanks for the reply. I understand that my work pal (who is also called Tim but not me, honest!) walked through behind a lady wheeling a suitcase, didn't jump or force the barrier etc.
That is still a violation, unfortunately. If your friend's season ticket doesn't work in the barriers, he should get it replaced. Any booking office operated by the same TOC which sold the ticket can do this (although if it is a Gold Card it would need to be a station within the Network area as I don't think other stations would have the stock on hand). There is no charge.
 

Peter Mugridge

Veteran Member
Joined
8 Apr 2010
Messages
11,221
Location
Epsom
Interesting; when travelling with the family - that's four of us on four tickets - the barrier staff ( yes including at Waterloo main! ) more often than not just tell us to put one ticket in the wide barrier and for all four of us to go through as one...
 

GadgetMan

Member
Joined
9 Jan 2012
Messages
892
Interesting; when travelling with the family - that's four of us on four tickets - the barrier staff ( yes including at Waterloo main! ) more often than not just tell us to put one ticket in the wide barrier and for all four of us to go through as one...
9. Stations and railway premises
(2) Where the entrance to or exit from any platform or station is via a manned or an automatic ticket barrier no person shall enter or leave the station, except with permission from an authorised person, without passing through the barrier in the correct manner.
The bold part clears that up.
 

Peter Mugridge

Veteran Member
Joined
8 Apr 2010
Messages
11,221
Location
Epsom
Ah I see, so because it's obvious we are all together they don't want us to take time at the barrier feeding four tickets through...?
 

trc666

Member
Joined
6 Jul 2005
Messages
232
Location
Islington
I tend to only open the gate if there is a large group (school party, large family etc) coming through, but more often than not the season ticket holders see it as a 'Priority Lane' and all start storming through said gate once it has been opened.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top