Is the juice worth the squeeze?

[Worththesqueez]

Hi Everyone,

First post but long time lurker.
Thanks for all the advice and points made on here.

I've worked very hard and been lucky enough to have been offered a trainee driver job in Scotland.

The one thing that's making me hesitate is the shift pattern... I've had a look at a 3 week rotation and to be honest it looks absolutely terrible! Terrible for family life, social life, health, sleep to name a few. I was wondering if some of you working the shifts could tell me how you find juggling family life ect.

Although I do really fancy the challenge and change the shifts have me doubting that it will be worth it.

I know I'm extremely lucky and to have been offered this position, I did work hard for it and I'm extremely grateful to have the opportunity. But is the juice worth the squeeze (not money related).

 

[driver9000]

Congratulations on being offered a place but I always say it's not a job, it's a way of life.

Shift work is hard but will get used to the shifts and if it's the 3 week rolling long weekend then you'll find it comes round quicker than you expect. Operators can give advice on how to manage your lifestyle to the job (there is a whole section on it in my company's PDP). You'll also have leave to take and you can always swap shifts with another Driver if you have something important on. It does take getting used to and I'm lucky in a way that my wife is home to look after our children so child care wasn't too much of an issue. I manage going to the gym around my shifts and try to get gentle exercise on my breaks while avoiding the kebab houses and chippy's that are often found right outside the front door of stations! If you're someone who must go out every weekend with their mates or hate shift work then you're in for a huge shock but looking into the link properly you'll find times you can go out and you'll find finishing work at late morning going in the opposite direction to rush hour traffic bliss. It just takes a bit of thinking and adjustment. Talk to your family about the change to shift work and how it may affect them too, don't wait for it to start causing problems.

Is it worth it? Yes, I wouldn't want to do anything else.

 

[Papa]

Depends what your current job is how much satisfaction you get from it. Shift work is one of the worst things about the job, it's terrible for health and shift workers do die younger than people who work regular shifts. It does mess up your sleep and you wil be more tired during the day. If you work for a TOC though you know your schedule in advance and so can plan around it. Having a stable family and understanding partner are really important. Theres quite a lot of divorced people in the mess. There are some advantages like having days off in the middle of the week and having longer consecutive days off rather than just a 2 day weekend.

Very few people leave the driving grade voluntarily so I guess for most people it's worth it.

 

[CardiffDan]

Shift work isn't for everyone. I love it. I'm police at the moment. We do 6 on 4 off. 2 10hour days. 2 8 hour afternoons and 2 9 hour nights.

You get time off in the week when most people are working. Easier to make appointments etc. You do miss family events as they tend to be on weekends and weddings etc if you can't get leave. But it is a lifestyle in itself. Some people can hack the different hours, but I did 11 years 9-5 and id never go back to it.

 

[Worththesqueez]

Appreciate the replies.
Obviously only taking the jump across and working for a number of years will I know how to cope.

I do have a very understanding wife who will support me through this however I'm wondering if 20+ years of going to bed alone/waking up alone is worth it. Pay aside, the time off isn't great, shifts aren't great, poor health/sleep.

I'm very fit and healthy, I wouldn't want to give that up for any pay cheque, health is my number 1 priority in life, without it life is pointless.

 

[Throwaway12]

Hi Everyone,

First post but long time lurker.
Thanks for all the advice and points made on here.

I've worked very hard and been lucky enough to have been offered a trainee driver job in Scotland.

The one thing that's making me hesitate is the shift pattern... I've had a look at a 3 week rotation and to be honest it looks absolutely terrible! Terrible for family life, social life, health, sleep to name a few. I was wondering if some of you working the shifts could tell me how you find juggling family life ect.

Although I do really fancy the challenge and change the shifts have me doubting that it will be worth it.

I know I'm extremely lucky and to have been offered this position, I did work hard for it and I'm extremely grateful to have the opportunity. But is the juice worth the squeeze (not money related).

Hey! Can I ask when you heard when you were successful? I'm in a kind of similar position and passed assessments recently with Scotrail, just waiting to find out about the MMI and if I've got a medical or not. The wait is killing me!

 

[Worththesqueez]

I passed the medical last week.

 

[ItchyRsole]

Worth mentioning mate that once in the door swapping shifts is pretty normal.

For example, I’m not fond of lates. I’m more of a get in and get out kind of person and I haven’t done a late in about 7-8 months as plenty of colleagues who’d rather them.

Same with weekends. I go football. Another colleague does too so when his teams at home I do his early and vice versa. When you see the roster in the cold light of day it’s the worst version of it. You will swap and take leave to add on to days off etc.

Go for it. You’ll defo regret it otherwise. Very lucky to be in the position you are.

Good luck mate.

 

[Worththesqueez]

Thanks for that ItchyRsole (great name).

I do get the gut feeling I should go for it, I'm a family man at heart and my main worry is missing my kids grow up/put unnecessary pressure on my wife which I've heard can happen. It's good to hear the other side of things.

 

[Throwaway12]

I passed the medical last week.

Amazing! I'm worried because I've not heard back after the MMI and thought it would be last week! Can i ask how long it took you to find out you were successful? Congratulations. FWIW I know a couple of Scotrail drivers and swapping seems to be quite common, some prefer earlies and 'getting it over with' so the rest of the day is their own and are quite happy to swap with others who prefer later!

 

[ComUtoR]

I'm a family man at heart and my main worry is missing my kids grow up

How old are they ?

Mine grew up with me being a Train Driver so that's all they have known. I fully appreciate that a sudden change in the family dynamic would have an impact. For me, I have found it more of a blessing than a curse.

put unnecessary pressure on my wife which I've heard can happen.

Very true and the stories I've heard back that up. "Married > Join the railway > Divorce > Meet new wife > Stay together forever." is the common theme. Shift work can really break people. I like to think that any relationship that can survive shift work is one of the strongest.

What was said to me; and what I say to any new starter. "Take the rough with the smooth" Shift work is crap, I ain't gonna lie, but in the long term I have never regretted it.

I'm currently 9-5 / Mon-Friday. I absolutely hate it !

Congratulations and welcome to the Railway.

 

[Chucky]

Thanks for that ItchyRsole (great name).

I do get the gut feeling I should go for it, I'm a family man at heart and my main worry is missing my kids grow up/put unnecessary pressure on my wife which I've heard can happen. It's good to hear the other side of things.

Go with your gut feeling. The shifts aren't that bad once you get used to them and you tend to get more time with your family than in a conventional job. For instance, when you are on afternoons you've got the day with the kids. When you are on mornings you've got the afternoon with them. If you've got a random day off in the week with nothing to do, you can always volunteer to work it and top up your wages as well.

 

[AVTB]

I’ve worked shifts since leaving school (in 2010) and won’t ever work a 9-5 after trying it for a few months.

I’m now a trainee driver and the shift pattern (likely similar to yours) looks like a dream compared to what I’m used to.

For me the benefits of shift work are:

• Time off in the week whilst family and friends are working, means I can get jobs done around the house etc.
• Shops etc are quiet on my days off, things like getting my hair cut on a Tuesday morning is so much better than on a Saturday afternoon.
• When heatwaves come I get more time to enjoy it, I’ll either be off for several days of it or have the afternoon off etc.
• I can see my young relatives, picking them up from school etc.
• Using annual leave I can get 2 weeks off using like 6 days holiday, so can have several holidays away each year and have AL left over for other occasions.
• There are always people that love or hate nights, mornings or afternoons. Endless swap opportunities, especially if you find a friend to permanently relieve them of their early starts in return they do your late finishes etc.
• Now I’m used to shifts I can sleep effortlessly whether I’m on nights or days. I get a solid 8-9 hours whatever shift I’m working.
• It’s great for appointments that can only happen during office hours, booking hospital appointments without having to leave work.
• The roads and trains are rarely busy when I start or finish work as it’s less common to start work during the rush hour.

Then the one thing I had when moving into train driving - the reassurance I could go back to my old job without an issue. If you have the same then train driving may be a no brainer.

 

[Frothy_B]

I'd imagine alot of it boils down to where you are coming from before. I don't work on the railway *yet* but I have worked shifts in the past and yeah, they aren't fun, but compared to my working pattern now shiftwork is a dream. For context I do double manned HGV work across Europe. I'm away for weeks at a time leaving my toddler with my wife who also works. 15 hour days are commonplace, 18-20 hour days have become more regular recently. The railway offers a comparative wage, and I'd see my family every day, so for me the jump will definitely be worth it. Only you can really know if it will be worth it for you.

As for missing things in your children's lives, that's kind of inevitable, but I will say as the son of a train driver, you'll miss less than you think. My Dad was able to maintain a season ticket to his football team for years, used to coach Rugby on Wednesday nights and made 90% of the Sunday games, would make a point of always attending Parents evenings. A fair few of his colleagues that I knew managed similar. You'll figure out what you want to not miss, and a good rapport with your colleagues and the roster clerk should make things doable. You may to be prepared to go without some sleep to make it happen though. Like I say though, I'm not a driver, I just grew up with one, the guys currently in the job will be able to give you better information.

 

[scotraildriver]

Appreciate the replies.
Obviously only taking the jump across and working for a number of years will I know how to cope.

I do have a very understanding wife who will support me through this however I'm wondering if 20+ years of going to bed alone/waking up alone is worth it. Pay aside, the time off isn't great, shifts aren't great, poor health/sleep.

I'm very fit and healthy, I wouldn't want to give that up for any pay cheque, health is my number 1 priority in life, without it life is pointless.

I don't know what you do just now bit I've never had as much time off as I do as a driver. Late week I can take the kids to school. Early week I can pick them up. My childcare costs are minimal compared to most people. A 5 day long weekend every 3 weeks means loads of weekends away as a family. I've attended all their sports days, parents nights etc. Yes the shifts can be tiring but earlies you are generally home for lunch and lates you've got all day to yourself. The thing with this job is you've got to really want it. If you've got doubts there are thousands more people who would take it at the drop of a hat . You can easily swap shifts/days off/holiday blocks etc to suit yourself. And the biggest thing for me is the job doesn't come home with you. Your time off is all yours.

 

[Sly Sloth]

If you’ve been reading posts on here for some time then you should already have plenty of answers to your questions? Many thousands apply for trainee positions who are fully committed to the job from application. My relationship blew up due to shift work and I’ve missed and continue to miss out on watching my kids grow up! This job is a life choice as has already been mentioned and if you don’t commit to it then it’ll get you down after a while. There’s nothing worse than doing a running turn when the rest of the family are at a get together or similar! Incidents are known to occur when the mind is distracted! Only you can decide what to do……..!

 

[Worththesqueez]

Many thanks for all the replies, views and opinions left on here. I really appreciate everyone's honesty.

For anyone interested, I have turned down the job offer this morning. For me personally, I decided the constantly changing shift pattern, potential damage to health, marriage and social life is not for me.

Thanks again for all the replies.

 

[Jon1930]

Many thanks for all the replies, views and opinions left on here. I really appreciate everyone's honesty.

For anyone interested, I have turned down the job offer this morning. For me personally, I decided the constantly changing shift pattern, potential damage to health, marriage and social life is not for me.

Thanks again for all the replies.

Don't know if this post is genuine or a wind up, surely a person would know before applying about the shift work involved. Don't know many people that go through all them assessments and then say no.

 

[CardiffDan]

Don't know if this post is genuine or a wind up, surely a person would know before applying about the shift work involved. Don't know many people that go through all them assessments and then say no.

I thought the same

 

[scotraildriver]

What a waste of everyone's time and money, not to mention anyone who missed out in favour of this person.

 

[43066]

What a waste of everyone's time and money, not to mention anyone who missed out in favour of this person.

Completely disagree. Anyone is free to apply for any job they wish. Just as you’re not owed a job offer, you’re also not under any obligation to to take one up!

Have to say I commend the OP for researching this and being brave enough to make a decision that is right for them, and goes against the grain of what we usually read on here. People often have no real understanding of the job and the shift work *really* isn’t for everyone. Perhaps, if only more people took the OP’s approach, certain messrooms would be more cheerful places!

 

[Worththesqueez]

Don't know if this post is genuine or a wind up, surely a person would know before applying about the shift work involved. Don't know many people that go through all them assessments and then say no.

No this isn't a wind up.

What a waste of everyone's time and money, not to mention anyone who missed out in favour of this person.

Why is it a waste?
Surely the tests and interviews are designed so both the employee and employer knows what's expected of them in this role?

I carried out approximately 35-40 hours of studying for the tests and interviews, it's something I was genuinely interested in.
You yourself said on post #15 of this thread - The thing with this job is you've got to really want it.

I'm not a rail enthusiast, it would only ever be a job to me, I have hobbies and interests which will always be more important to me than any job. I work to live not the other way round. Yes I thought I could make the shifts work but looking into it sometimes the grass isn't greener on the other side.

I currently work shifts however they are 0800-1800 X2
1800 - 0800 X2
96 hours off.
Do this 7 times and then get 18 days off.

Pay would have been £15k more (pre tax). And I decided that my current lifestyle v pay was better than what the railway offered as a driver.

This was a very hard conclusion to come to and yes I hope I've not taken away this position from anyone else.

As previously said, thanks again for all the replies, advice, opinions and comments. Absolutely no disrespect to anyone embarking on this as a career or already in this job.

 

[New York Giant]

Completely disagree. Anyone is free to apply for any job they wish. Just as you’re not owed a job offer, you’re also not under any obligation to to take one up!

Have to say I commend the OP for researching this and being brave enough to make a decision that is right for them, and goes against the grain of what we usually read on here. People often have no real understanding of the job and the shift work *really* isn’t for everyone. Perhaps, if only more people took the OP’s approach, certain messrooms would be more cheerful places!

Fully agree with this. At this stage of the process the expense probably pales in comparison to what it could have been had the OP had spent 100 hours shadowing his DI's shift pattern only to come to the same conclusion.

not to mention anyone who missed out in favour of this person.

Surely the OP dropping out works to another candidates advantage...

 

[FNG]

No this isn't a wind up.

Why is it a waste?
Surely the tests and interviews are designed so both the employee and employer knows what's expected of them in this role?

I carried out approximately 35-40 hours of studying for the tests and interviews, it's something I was genuinely interested in.
You yourself said on post #15 of this thread - The thing with this job is you've got to really want it.

I'm not a rail enthusiast, it would only ever be a job to me, I have hobbies and interests which will always be more important to me than any job. I work to live not the other way round. Yes I thought I could make the shifts work but looking into it sometimes the grass isn't greener on the other side.

I currently work shifts however they are 0800-1800 X2
1800 - 0800 X2
96 hours off.
Do this 7 times and then get 18 days off.

Pay would have been £15k more (pre tax). And I decided that my current lifestyle v pay was better than what the railway offered as a driver.

This was a very hard conclusion to come to and yes I hope I've not taken away this position from anyone else.

As previously said, thanks again for all the replies, advice, opinions and comments. Absolutely no disrespect to anyone embarking on this as a career or already in this job.

Fair play to you mate, health and family should always come first.

Not many turn it down and it’s highly likely you’ve done the next person on the list a massive turn so everyone wins.

 

[ComUtoR]

Best of luck in the future.

Your assessments are still valid so if you change your mind in the future, never be afraid to re-apply.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

What a waste of everyone's time and money, not to mention anyone who missed out in favour of this person.

You do know they’ll just offer the job to somebody else don’t you? If anything OP’s doubts have saved people time and money because they’ve turned down the offer now as opposed to dropping out mid course . Shift work isn’t for everyone, that’s just a fact.

 

[Luckyflames]

Shift work isn't for everyone. I love it. I'm police at the moment. We do 6 on 4 off. 2 10hour days. 2 8 hour afternoons and 2 9 hour nights.

You get time off in the week when most people are working. Easier to make appointments etc. You do miss family events as they tend to be on weekends and weddings etc if you can't get leave. But it is a lifestyle in itself. Some people can hack the different hours, but I did 11 years 9-5 and id never go back to it.

They sound terrible. 4 on 4off here.

 

[TravelDream]

Shift work isn't for everyone. I love it. I'm police at the moment. We do 6 on 4 off. 2 10hour days. 2 8 hour afternoons and 2 9 hour nights.

That sounds absolutely horrific.

The worst part about shift work for me is changing from one shift to another. Your sleep pattern is never able to catch up so you are constantly exhausted.

Shift work really isn't for everyone, but it depends on how much flexibility there is with choosing and swapping shifts.

 

[CardiffDan]

You do get use to it. The worst part is if you afternoons fall on a Friday or Saturday. You do a supernoon. Which is 4pm to 3am. By the time rest days come you are knackered. Plus you never leave on time. Most day shifts you are stuck doing files for cps advice.

I like being able to plan ahead. My days off never change. They do get cancelled. Like for the fuel protests in July. They have cancelled our rest days. Then they give them back at a later date. So you could end up working 8 or 9 days in a row.

Not selling the police very well here am I.

 

[Muse29]

No you're not! I mean, doing 5 days starting at 5am on the trains is horrible but the fact I'm back tucked up in bed before midday makes them easier to deal with.