Is UK fare evasion enforcement and punishment the harshest in the world?

[Bletchleyite]

In one particularly notable example, a passenger was prosecuted for using a "+ via London" ticket and the Guard incorrectly believed that meant not valid via Reading. See: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/taken-to-court-facing-criminal-charges-advice-needed.156920/

Doesn't entirely help that this now prints as the factually incorrect "Only valid via London +", when almost all "route London" tickets are also valid the other way due to generally being the most expensive.

 

[jumble]

That does seem to be a London thing which might derive from culture when it wasn't their job, it was the conductor's. I find bus drivers elsewhere in the country are absolutely obsessive about revenue, even to the point of pushing it so far they get assaulted, and even to the point of arguing that things aren't valid when they are.

It also might be that the bus companies in London get no farebox revenue as they tender to TFL
Therefore it makes no difference to their employers bottom line.
( if a bus company who dont pursue revenue would win another tender is a different conversation)

 

[jumble]

In one particularly notable example, a passenger was prosecuted for using a "+ via London" ticket and the Guard incorrectly believed that meant not valid via Reading. See: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/taken-to-court-facing-criminal-charges-advice-needed.156920/

I got in touch with the passenger, I arranged for a solicitor (who is a member of this forum) who was going to win the case and then pursue XC for damages I had agreement from a company director to be an expert witness if necessary, I had BBC and other journalists on standby to report the case.. however the passenger did not trust me (as is their right) to get a good outcome, they paid a FOUR FIGURE sum to a solicitor who arranged for the case to be settled out of court (it went to an initial court hearing but no further), XC were not pursued for damages & costs, the customer was left thousands of pounds out of pocket and they wanted no media attention. All my effort was wasted and XC got away with it! The customer could afford to be a few grand out of pocket and just wanted to get on with their life. Fair enough, their choice, but it left me rather disillusioned to say the least. I even had the support of someone at XC though I can't really talk about that on here (I'll tell you next time you see me if you remind me!)

There are other cases where XC have been in a lot of trouble and had to pay compensation but I am not allowed to talk about them (at least not yet... hopefully one day)

None of the cases I am aware of are due to "malfunctioning booking engines", though any tickets bought with an itinerary are contractually valid.

In one particularly notable example, a passenger was prosecuted for using a "+ via London" ticket and the Guard incorrectly believed that meant not valid via Reading. See: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/taken-to-court-facing-criminal-charges-advice-needed.156920/

I got in touch with the passenger, I arranged for a solicitor (who is a member of this forum) who was going to win the case and then pursue XC for damages I had agreement from a company director to be an expert witness if necessary, I had BBC and other journalists on standby to report the case.. however the passenger did not trust me (as is their right) to get a good outcome, they paid a FOUR FIGURE sum to a solicitor who arranged for the case to be settled out of court (it went to an initial court hearing but no further), XC were not pursued for damages & costs, the customer was left thousands of pounds out of pocket and they wanted no media attention. All my effort was wasted and XC got away with it! The customer could afford to be a few grand out of pocket and just wanted to get on with their life. Fair enough, their choice, but it left me rather disillusioned to say the least. I even had the support of someone at XC though I can't really talk about that on here (I'll tell you next time you see me if you remind me!)

There are other cases where XC have been in a lot of trouble and had to pay compensation but I am not allowed to talk about them (at least not yet... hopefully one day)

None of the cases I am aware of are due to "malfunctioning booking engines", though any tickets bought with an itinerary are contractually valid.

Yorkie
To be fair there are many people I am close to who would pay large sums of money to avoid attention
They are not like you and me who will get involved to try and stop people who have been given tremendous power and who abuse it and who should be taken to task.
A long time ago recently a bereaved relative was having HMRC demands regarding her late husband's affairs
She paid what they demanded as she simply could not cope with fighting at the time and just wanted them to go away.

 

[yorkie]

Yes this is a fair point and is exactly why the rail industry should be stopped from behaving in this manner; innocent people can be left £hundreds or even £thousands out of pocket through doing absolutely nothing wrong.

 

[najaB]

However I disagree with heavy handed and unduly harsh treatment of people who have made honest mistakes...

What is the way to, with 100% accuracy, determine between an honest mistake and a really good liar?

 

[thedbdiboy]

So have things totally changed since privatisation in 1994 or did BR too have this same unforgiving attitude to those who were not persistent fare evaders but found themselves not to possess the correct ticket for the journey they were undertaking?

THe law regarding travelling without a ticket is desperately in need of updating, with all but the most serious offences removed from the courts but with a proper independent arbitration process. When BR was abolished the use of civil recovery was in its infancy but the real issue has been the lack of coherent action by governments, not helped by the lack of relevant experience in the DfT. The irony is that done properly, reform would be good for passengers, good for government and even good for operators who would actually benefit from clear and unequivocal rules backed by law that would let them recover money where they have provided the correct facilities to sell tickets!

 

[RJ]

What is the way to, with 100% accuracy, determine between an honest mistake and a really good liar?

The moment people discover what the criteria are for an "honest mistake", a significant proportion will take the mick with it and demand that discretion is shown with them.