Jobcentre JCP railcard when is it valid?

[Luke McDonnell]

Hi,

Just letting you know that I have a Jobseekers Railcard which I obtained when I was unemployed and is valid until 4th July - I also have a Disabled Railcard but the Disabled Railcard gives a 1/3 discount but the JCP card gives 1/2 discount so I have been using that until it expires next week. Normally I have had no problem using the JCP card and from what I have read online it is valid at all times regardless of the journey being for work related purposes or not - the only restriction that I could see is that you can't use the JCP card to get a discount on advanced purchase tickets - it is for walk up fares only.

However as explained above when I have purchased tickets on this card it has been OK but about 2 weeks ago a lady at Liverpool South Parkway ticket office (I was travelling to Chester on TfW to see my friend) asked me the purpose of my journey and asked me is it work related. She said that it was only valid for work related journeys and I said AFAIK it is not and the Jobcentre did not tell me that it was only valid for work related journeys and nothing written on the card did. She then said that the ticket issuing system was not giving her an option to issue the ticket on the card so I used my Disabled Railcard again. I then mentioned this to another staff member after my return journey and he said it is not problem just ask for JCP next time you travel for the discount. However, today I made another trip to Chester to see my friend, and I ended up meeting the same lady at the ticket office when purchasing my ticket. She again asked the purpose of my journey, I said I was going to see my friend and she was stubbornly insistent that the JCP card is valid for work related journeys only and refused to issue me a ticket on the JCP card so I again had to use my Disabled card. She also said that I could be risking a penalty fare or prosecution if it was found I was travelling on the wrong ticket. I tried to explain again that from what I know it is valid on any journey regardless of purpose but she was stubbornly insistent. Also as far as penalty fares go even if their was a restriction about using the card for work related journeys only I would not have received a penalty fare as I was not aware of that face (honest mistake). Does anyone know if the ticket office lady was right or wrong or does anyone know if the Jobcentre card is restricted to work related journeys such as interviews, to and from work or training courses or can it be used on any journey regardless of purpose?

Regards,

Luke

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

Also as far as penalty fares go even if their was a restriction about using the card for work related journeys only I would not have received a penalty fare as I was not aware of that face (honest mistake)

I'm afraid I don't know about the validity of the JobCentre Railcard for non-work related purposes, but the part of your post that I have highlighted is not the case. Penalty Fares are specifically designed for when people make mistakes. If there is intent to avoid the correct fare then this is not designed to be disposed of by way of a Penalty Fare.

As far as a Penalty Fare goes, whether or not you understand the restrictions applying to your tickets or Railcards bears no relevance on whether or not you can be issued with a Penalty Fare. It's whether or not you actually comply with the restrictions that matters.

 

[Saperstein]

I’ve heard of the job centre rail card but never seen one, nor know anyone who holds one.

I take it it is issued direct through the benefits agency much like the HM Forces rail card has to be obtained from ones unit, not the railway.

In that case your best bet would be to ask at your local JC but be careful, are you still supposed to using it now you have a job?

As it expires on Thursday, it’s academic anyway.

Personally I would just stick with the DSB and at least you know then you shouldn’t be getting PF’ed or worse if you are challenged.

 

[causton]

Nothing in the internal Knowledgebase mentions a restriction on purpose of journey.

 

[Mathew S]

Hi,

Just letting you know that I have a Jobseekers Railcard which I obtained when I was unemployed and is valid until 4th July - I also have a Disabled Railcard but the Disabled Railcard gives a 1/3 discount but the JCP card gives 1/2 discount so I have been using that until it expires next week. Normally I have had no problem using the JCP card and from what I have read online it is valid at all times regardless of the journey being for work related purposes or not - the only restriction that I could see is that you can't use the JCP card to get a discount on advanced purchase tickets - it is for walk up fares only.

However as explained above when I have purchased tickets on this card it has been OK but about 2 weeks ago a lady at Liverpool South Parkway ticket office (I was travelling to Chester on TfW to see my friend) asked me the purpose of my journey and asked me is it work related. She said that it was only valid for work related journeys and I said AFAIK it is not and the Jobcentre did not tell me that it was only valid for work related journeys and nothing written on the card did. She then said that the ticket issuing system was not giving her an option to issue the ticket on the card so I used my Disabled Railcard again. I then mentioned this to another staff member after my return journey and he said it is not problem just ask for JCP next time you travel for the discount. However, today I made another trip to Chester to see my friend, and I ended up meeting the same lady at the ticket office when purchasing my ticket. She again asked the purpose of my journey, I said I was going to see my friend and she was stubbornly insistent that the JCP card is valid for work related journeys only and refused to issue me a ticket on the JCP card so I again had to use my Disabled card. She also said that I could be risking a penalty fare or prosecution if it was found I was travelling on the wrong ticket. I tried to explain again that from what I know it is valid on any journey regardless of purpose but she was stubbornly insistent. Also as far as penalty fares go even if their was a restriction about using the card for work related journeys only I would not have received a penalty fare as I was not aware of that face (honest mistake). Does anyone know if the ticket office lady was right or wrong or does anyone know if the Jobcentre card is restricted to work related journeys such as interviews, to and from work or training courses or can it be used on any journey regardless of purpose?

Regards,

Luke

A few years ago when I had one, I had no issue using the JCP Railcard for all kinds of journeys - business and pleasure. And many of them were so obviously non-work that nobody could ever have thought otherwise.
I would strongly suggest that the railway staff who told you otherwise don't know what they're talking about and encourage you to complain to the relevant TOCs so that they can be informed of their error.

 

[Luke McDonnell]

Yes, the lady who sold me my ticket said she was not aware that the card gave a 1/2 off discount she assumed it was the same as the DSB card 1/3 off it was only her I ever had an issue with I actually used the JCP card the previous day to go LSP-MIA (Manchester Airport) without issue it only seems when served by this member of staff I have had this problem. No train guard/conductor has ever questioned it either they just check the ticket and that's it never ask about what I am travelling for so I would suspect it would be highly unlikely I would get into trouble actually on the train and me being honest will always offer to pay the difference anyway.

 

[JB_B]

Hi,

Just letting you know that I have a Jobseekers Railcard which I obtained when I was unemployed and is valid until 4th July - I also have a Disabled Railcard but the Disabled Railcard gives a 1/3 discount but the JCP card gives 1/2 discount so I have been using that until it expires next week. Normally I have had no problem using the JCP card and from what I have read online it is valid at all times regardless of the journey being for work related purposes or not - the only restriction that I could see is that you can't use the JCP card to get a discount on advanced purchase tickets - it is for walk up fares only.

However as explained above when I have purchased tickets on this card it has been OK but about 2 weeks ago a lady at Liverpool South Parkway ticket office (I was travelling to Chester on TfW to see my friend) asked me the purpose of my journey and asked me is it work related. She said that it was only valid for work related journeys and I said AFAIK it is not and the Jobcentre did not tell me that it was only valid for work related journeys and nothing written on the card did. She then said that the ticket issuing system was not giving her an option to issue the ticket on the card so I used my Disabled Railcard again. I then mentioned this to another staff member after my return journey and he said it is not problem just ask for JCP next time you travel for the discount. However, today I made another trip to Chester to see my friend, and I ended up meeting the same lady at the ticket office when purchasing my ticket. She again asked the purpose of my journey, I said I was going to see my friend and she was stubbornly insistent that the JCP card is valid for work related journeys only and refused to issue me a ticket on the JCP card so I again had to use my Disabled card. She also said that I could be risking a penalty fare or prosecution if it was found I was travelling on the wrong ticket. I tried to explain again that from what I know it is valid on any journey regardless of purpose but she was stubbornly insistent. Also as far as penalty fares go even if their was a restriction about using the card for work related journeys only I would not have received a penalty fare as I was not aware of that face (honest mistake). Does anyone know if the ticket office lady was right or wrong or does anyone know if the Jobcentre card is restricted to work related journeys such as interviews, to and from work or training courses or can it be used on any journey regardless of purpose?

Regards,

Luke

DWP and RDG don't make it easy to find detailed information on the terms and conditions for the Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card but I've not seen anything to suggest it's use is restricted to travel to/from work and/or travel to/from job interviews.


The current gov.uk page on it simply says:-

"Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card

This is provided to those unemployed claiming Jobseekers Allowance or Universal Credit for 3-9 months (18-24 year olds) or 3-12 months (over 25s). Other benefit recipients may receive a Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card from 3 months of their claim and if they are actively engaged with a Jobcentre Plus adviser. Cardholders are entitled to a 50% discount on selected rail tickets."

This ancient FOI (from 2011) is probably more useful.

It is now rather out of date on the DWP side but I'd guess it would still be accurate for Rail.

I've copied the relevant section below...

"Appendix 5 - Terms and Conditions

1 You must sign your Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card before use to show acceptance of the Terms and Conditions listed below.

2 Your Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card is not transferable to anyone else.

3 The Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card is not your property and if requested must be given up to a representative of any Train Company, Transport for London, or other transport operators or Jobcentre Plus Offices.

4 The Train Companies, Transport for London, other transport operators and Jobcentre Plus Offices do not undertake to replace lost, stolen or damaged cards. Your card will not be valid if it is defaced, illegible, dated beyond three months validity or damaged.

5 When asked by transport operators staff or the Police, you must show a valid ticket or validated Oyster card and your Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card, otherwise the full fare may be payable (or the appropriate Penalty Fare if applicable) as if no Discount Card, ticket or validated Oyster Card with pay as you go credit were held.

6 Proof of identity may be requested.

7 Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Cards are subject to the National Rail Conditions of Carriage, Transport for London Conditions of Carriage, other transport operators’ conditions and those conditions listed in this publication. In the event of conflict, the Conditions listed here shall prevail.

8 The Conditions of Issue and use shown in this publication are for the period of validity as shown.

Conditions of issue and use of tickets bought with a Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card

1 You must show your valid Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card when you purchase your discounted ticket or to get an Oyster card (where needed) with your Jobcentre Plus travel discount.

2 If during your journey you are unable to produce a valid ticket or validated Oyster card and Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card on request, you may be required to pay the full standard/cash single fare (or the appropriate Penalty Fare where applicable) as if no ticket was purchased or Oyster card held before the journey commenced. This does not apply if no ticket purchase facilities were available at your originating station.

3 Reduced rate tickets are not valid for travel in First Class accommodation.

4 The right is reserved to revise the Conditions and availability of tickets mentioned in this publication. Train Companies and Transport for London will endeavour to give 3 months notice of any changes before they are due to come into effect. Before travelling you should enquire about current Conditions at a staffed station or appointed agent.

5 Tickets are issued subject to the National Rail Conditions of Carriage, the Transport for London Conditions of Carriage, other transport operators Conditions and those Conditions listed in this publication. In the event of conflict, the Conditions listed here shall prevail.

6 Rail Season tickets can only be purchased at a staffed National Rail station and at selected London Underground and London Overground ticket offices, they are not available at Travel Agency outlets or Transport for London Oyster Ticket Stops. Season Tickets are issued for 7 Days, one month or longer periods (maximum 3 months).

7 Tickets cannot be purchased with any Rail Travel Warrants.

8 Transport for London child rate tickets can only be used for travel with a valid Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount card and Oyster card (where appropriate). Child rate season tickets can only be issued on an Oyster card, for a maximum of three months, and will expire no later than the accompanying Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card.

9 All tickets bought with a Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card and pay as you go on Oyster issued against a Jobcentre Plus Travel Discount Card are not transferable."

 

[RJ]

The Job Centre Plus Discount card is certainly intended to be used to travel in connection with helping people get to work, but I'm not aware of any actual restrictions on how it can be used.

I treat JCP card holders like any other customer, but about 80% of time they feel the need to voluntarily profess that they are actively looking for work. It's as if they've encountered other people who have looked down on them for holding that card. But nobody has the right to openly judge people for using a JCP card or question their trip purpose.

 

[Mathew S]

The Job Centre Plus Discount card is certainly intended to be used to travel in connection with helping people get to work, but I'm not aware of any actual restrictions on how it can be used.

I treat JCP card holders like any other customer, but about 80% of time they feel the need to voluntarily profess that they are actively looking for work. It's as if they've encountered other people who have looked down on them for holding that card. But nobody has the right to openly judge people for using a JCP card or question their trip purpose.

It is weird. I definitely felt a sense of, I don't know, embarrassment I suppose. There's a remarkable stigma attached to being unemployed and, even though in my case it was entirely down to ill health, I still couldn't help feeling that people would judge me for having that card.

 

[district]

Sorry to hear you've had trouble, you are right in that you can use it for whatever purpose journey you'd like. Also please never feel bad about using the JCP card, you certainly won't be getting judgement from my window!

 

[gray1404]

Sadly Liverpool South Parkway ticket office is ran by Merseyrail who are often useless at issuing anything for travel off their own network or anything slightly different. I was recently refused a disabled person's railcard discount for a second person travelling with me because the clark didn't think the railcard covered 2 people. Sadly a lot of their staff in their ticket offices have a habit of making up their own rules and this clearly has happened her.

The idea behind the JCP railcard is that it will help those looking for work, however, there are no actual restrictions on the purpose of the journey once issued. Otherwise this would have to be reflected in the terms and conditions of issue. I would certainly make a complaint to Merseyrail by email and attach the tickets you purchased. I would ask them to refund you for the additional fare paid due to error of their staff. Sadly, my experience of Merseyrail customer relations is that you tend to get fobbed off in their first reply so it is sometimes needed to get back in touch asking for a Manager to look at the matter. I find I then often get a good outcome, however there would then be the option of taking the matter to the Ral Ombudsman.

You should certainly not have been getting given incorrect information, threatened with penalty fares or legal action and the ticket office was required to sell the ticket asked for.

 

[Deerfold]

Penalty Fares are specifically designed for when people make mistakes. If there is intent to avoid the correct fare then this is not designed to be disposed of by way of a Penalty Fare.

I see this a lot on this forum - is there anything to back this claim up? I can't find anything on TOC or NR websites that says this. Chiltern seem keen to have no distinction on their website.

https://www.chilternrailways.co.uk/customer-service/penalty-fares

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

I see this a lot on this forum - is there anything to back this claim up? I can't find anything on TOC or NR websites that says this. Chiltern seem keen to have no distinction on their website.

https://www.chilternrailways.co.uk/customer-service/penalty-fares

There has been plenty of discussion on this topic. Here is one thread from a few years ago.

 

[RJ]

I see this a lot on this forum - is there anything to back this claim up? I can't find anything on TOC or NR websites that says this. Chiltern seem keen to have no distinction on their website.

https://www.chilternrailways.co.uk/customer-service/penalty-fares

No, it's just something that is made up and bandied about on this site.