Keolis Amey Wales - Future Rolling Stock

AventraFlex

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Hi all,

Not sure if there's a thread already discussing this, and if there is my apologies, but recently Keolis Amey was awarded the Wales & Borders franchise and I'm sure the promise of new trains was one of them. I'm wondering whether they'll order brand new trains or obtain already existing stock.

Also, will the South Wales Metro be a new Crossrail-type network, and what will happen to the current stock?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-44221184
 
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PHILIPE

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Hi all,

Not sure if there's a thread already discussing this, and if there is my apologies, but recently Keolis Amey was awarded the Wales & Borders franchise and I'm sure the promise of new trains was one of them. I'm wondering whether they'll order brand new trains or obtain already existing stock.

Also, will the South Wales Metro be a new Crossrail-type network, and what will happen to the current stock?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-44221184
Here

/www.railforums.co.uk/threads/keolis-amey-to-take-over-wales-and-borders.164805

and here

www.railforums.co.uk/threads/south-wales-metro.117763
 
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Rumourmill has it that the new company will operate short HST formations on the North Wales Coast.
Sounds rather fanciful.
Just the North Wales Coast or North Wales to South Wales?

There are by my calculations (happy to stand corrected though) 43 GWR Class 43s going off lease with no home, so there's plenty of scope for it.

Queue complaints though about 30 year old trains being replaced by 40 year old trains if this is true.
 

Bletchleyite

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Rumourmill has it that the new company will operate short HST formations on the North Wales Coast.
Sounds rather fanciful.
But would be VERY, VERY popular.

Queue complaints though about 30 year old trains being replaced by 40 year old trains if this is true.
There's been the odd whinge in Scotland, but realistically trains are like houses, not cars (as long as they're not rotting to bits you just gut and refit, engines included, and they're as good as new) and so I think the Scottish HSTs will be very popular indeed. That indeed is the whole basis behind the D-train.
 
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There's been the odd whinge in Scotland, but realistically trains are like houses, not cars (as long as they're not rotting to bits you just gut and refit, engines included, and they're as good as new) and so I think the Scottish HSTs will be very popular indeed. That indeed is the whole basis behind the D-train.
You don't need to tell me that!

I'm just waiting from the back lash on twitter and from the second rate media in Wales.
 

Bletchleyite

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I think if they spin it right, and they go for things like First Class and buffets (ideally in a 5-car set but certainly not 3) done to the same high standard as the Scottish ones with a dedicated livery and brand, "proper InterCity trains for the North Wales Coast, no more nasty little DMUs" would be easy to put a positive spin on. And it'd free up enough 158s for them to be dedicated to the Cambrian line, allowing the long-awaited fully hourly Aberystwyth service to go ahead. And similarly enough 175s to allow the Manchester services to all run as 4, 5 or 6-car according to demand, as well as a couple for the new Liverpool run.

You'd basically (restaurant aside) be upgrading all the Holyheads to the same standard as Gerald. It'd be hard to be negative about that. (You could still *have* Gerald as a traditional named train, but it'd just share the same stock pool). The old Mk3s could go to Chiltern, I'm sure they could find a use for another set.

And it's a quick win compared to the 3 year ish minimum lead time on new.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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Rumourmill has it that the new company will operate short HST formations on the North Wales Coast.
Sounds rather fanciful.
That would give a maintenance problem if they are to be focussed in the north.
There is no history of HST maintenance anywhere on the W&B system outside Cardiff/Swansea.
The former HSTs on Euston-Holyhead came from the GW pool at Old Oak.
GWR and Scotrail can use existing HST bases for their trains (Edinburgh, Plymouth).
 

Bletchleyite

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That would give a maintenance problem if they are to be focussed in the north.
There is no history of HST maintenance anywhere on the W&B system outside Cardiff/Swansea.
It does fit fairly well with the WAG's prized Holyhead-Cardiff operation, though, as heavy maintenance could take place in Cardiff and those through services provide a useful way to get them there.
 

kje7812

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That would give a maintenance problem if they are to be focussed in the north.
There is no history of HST maintenance anywhere on the W&B system outside Cardiff/Swansea.
The former HSTs on Euston-Holyhead came from the GW pool at Old Oak.
GWR and Scotrail can use existing HST bases for their trains (Edinburgh, Plymouth).
Slight correction: AIUI whilst short term some work will be done at Craigentinny, the Scotrail HSTs will be maintained at Haymarket once the necessary improvement works are done. Craigentinny will then be the base for the 80Xs and 385s.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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Slight correction: AIUI whilst short term some work will be done at Craigentinny, the Scotrail HSTs will be maintained at Haymarket once the necessary improvement works are done. Craigentinny will then be the base for the 80Xs and 385s.
Yes I was deliberately vague about Scotrail.
But the expertise and facilities are already in the area, unlike in the north-west.
 

gingertom

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I think if they spin it right, and they go for things like First Class and buffets (ideally in a 5-car set but certainly not 3) done to the same high standard as the Scottish ones with a dedicated livery and brand, "proper InterCity trains for the North Wales Coast, no more nasty little DMUs" would be easy to put a positive spin on. And it'd free up enough 158s for them to be dedicated to the Cambrian line, allowing the long-awaited fully hourly Aberystwyth service to go ahead. And similarly enough 175s to allow the Manchester services to all run as 4, 5 or 6-car according to demand, as well as a couple for the new Liverpool run.

You'd basically (restaurant aside) be upgrading all the Holyheads to the same standard as Gerald. It'd be hard to be negative about that. (You could still *have* Gerald as a traditional named train, but it'd just share the same stock pool). The old Mk3s could go to Chiltern, I'm sure they could find a use for another set.

And it's a quick win compared to the 3 year ish minimum lead time on new.
only problem I can see is how long it will take to get the MK3 slam doors changed at Wabtec, they seem to be having problems with throughput. The ROSCOs will be rubbing their hands with glee at the prospect of not having to scrap these machines just yet
 

Gareth Marston

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only problem I can see is how long it will take to get the MK3 slam doors changed at Wabtec, they seem to be having problems with throughput. The ROSCOs will be rubbing their hands with glee at the prospect of not having to scrap these machines just yet
Mark 3's as good as they are pre date computer controlled laser precession body shell cutting. The door apertures display variances from coach to coach and even between doors on the same coach. This presents problems for retofitting power doors. You can bet that the easiest ones to do have already been cherry picked. It's not a quick win.
 

DenmarkRail

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I haven’t really read this thread, as I’m mainly outside doing other stuff, but here for the odd look.

How about HST-GI sets for the Aberystwyth to Birmingham service?

Would also love some extra stops in Stafford ;)
 

PHILIPE

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I haven’t really read this thread, as I’m mainly outside doing other stuff, but here for the odd look.

How about HST-GI sets for the Aberystwyth to Birmingham service?

Would also love some extra stops in Stafford ;)
There won't be any change from 158s on the Aberystwyth route for the foreseeable as the 158 fleet has been specially modified to work with ERTMS signalling system. No paths via Stafford
 

driver_m

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That would give a maintenance problem if they are to be focussed in the north.
There is no history of HST maintenance anywhere on the W&B system outside Cardiff/Swansea.
The former HSTs on Euston-Holyhead came from the GW pool at Old Oak.
GWR and Scotrail can use existing HST bases for their trains (Edinburgh, Plymouth).
The Virgin sets were maintained at Longsight, as they were also used on Manchester runs and occasionally sent to Laira for anything heavy. That's why the Porterbrook translator was at Longsight.
 

Gareth Marston

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Definitely a teaser but can we believe the "Metro" branding on it? If it means that the light rail conversion of Valley Lines has been kicked into touch and its heavy rail with bi modes with the wires going up in stages north of queen St that will be a major (and pleasant) surprise.
 

AventraFlex

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I see Stadler WINKs also being used. Potentially something to replace the 150s and 153s, as they're designed for rural routes
 

transmanche

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Definitely a teaser but can we believe the "Metro" branding on it? If it means that the light rail conversion of Valley Lines has been kicked into touch and its heavy rail with bi modes with the wires going up in stages north of queen St that will be a major (and pleasant) surprise.
I'm always a bit wary of artist's impressions since seeing this one for the proposed Picc-Vic tunnel in Manchester. :D

I think I'll wait until Monday before getting too excited...

 

WatcherZero

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Shades of the old BT logo:

https://ih1.redbubble.net/image.458880223.7422/mug,standard,x400,left-bg,ffffff.u4.jpg

I'm always a bit wary of artist's impressions since seeing this one for the proposed Picc-Vic tunnel in Manchester. :D

I think I'll wait until Monday before getting too excited...
Whats wrong with that, at the time back in the 60's they were considering a setup very similar to the LU surface lines, so no surprise the concept rolling stock looked similar to the designs of the day.
 

Gareth Marston

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Surprised it wasn't CAF?

Still on a real and urgent practical level what will be in the announcement to sort out the Class 158 reliability? We've had a bad two weeks with a lot of services short formed on the Cambrian and West Midlands. Currently the fleet overnights at 8 different locations with only 5 diagrams out of the fleet of 24 starting from their home base of Machynlleth each day. There getting old there high mileage and they spend time away from any preventative maintaincence.

Concentrating the fleet on the diagrams that go through Machynlleth and cutting out Crewe as an overnight location plus getting the Cambrian mainline hourly should con trade the fleet better and help reliability.
 
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transmanche

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Whats wrong with that, at the time back in the 60's they were considering a setup very similar to the LU surface lines, so no surprise the concept rolling stock looked similar to the designs of the day.
Apart from looking nothing like any LU surface stock?... nothing! :D

But in the context of this thread, you have proved my point. An artist's impression simply includes "rolling stock [which looks] similar to the designs of the day".
 

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