Latin at school, other languages?

[Typhoon]

Due to a move of region and school, I ended up studying "The Merchant of Venice" twice. I duly brought out some of the interpretations suggested by the teacher at the first school and they were dismissed as rubbish by the teacher at the second. That suggested to me that the whole things was highly subjective, one reason why I'm highly cynical about the compulsory study and examination of literature and (for slightly different reasons) of creative writing. I did come back to theatre in my 20s, but not to Shakespeare.

At various times I have been an Assistant Examiner (marker) for GCSE Maths and ICT. I wouldn't touch English Lit and a few other subjects for the very reason you give.

Returning to Latin, I wonder whether there is any traction in trying to enthuse students by having Latin translations of the lyrics of popular tracks which they have to identify (no titles, that's a give away)? No good asking me what constitutes a 'popular track', the music I am listening to was released in 1979!

 

[MotCO]

Returning to Latin, I wonder whether there is any traction in trying to enthuse students by having Latin translations of the lyrics of popular tracks which they have to identify (no titles, that's a give away)? No good asking me what constitutes a 'popular track', the music I am listening to was released in 1979!

If I recall, there is no word in Latin for 'Yes', so something like 'She loves you yeah, yeah, yeah' may be impossible to translate!

 

[Bayum]

Due to a move of region and school, I ended up studying "The Merchant of Venice" twice. I duly brought out some of the interpretations suggested by the teacher at the first school and they were dismissed as rubbish by the teacher at the second. That suggested to me that the whole things was highly subjective, one reason why I'm highly cynical about the compulsory study and examination of literature and (for slightly different reasons) of creative writing. I did come back to theatre in my 20s, but not to Shakespeare.

Welcome to the modern world. This has always been my bug bear with English literature and the way it is taught in other schools. I was lucky in that my GCSE schooling taught me to be able to critically analyse paragraphs, themes, nuance of vocabulary etc and as long as we were able to give a decent literary explanation to back our points it was considered fine. There were particular aspects that we were taught by rote, e.g. the historical timing of Frankenstein, Darwin’s theory of evolution and its impact on writers thereafter etc. which you wouldn’t expect 14/15/16 year olds to know. With the new syllabus, it seems to have gone the opposite way in that pupils have so much to revise and recite from memory that much of the critical analysis is learnt by rote; fine for the ‘seen’ texts aspect of the paper but not so much for the unseen.
Back to the points about Latin, I regularly throw in a Latin/Greek lesson here and there with my 7/8/9 year old class. When a good number of prefixes and suffixes are Latin/Greek in origin, it makes sense to teach these so when a child knows the prefix ‘exo’, they’re (hopefully!) better able to understand what an ‘exoskeleton’ is and utilise their word knowledge that way to better understand what they’re reading.

 

[Gloster]

We were taught that Animal Farm, which we studied in the run-up to O-Levels, was a purely anti-communist parable. Any suggestion that there was a wider anti-totalitarian aspect to the text was vehemently denied. It is fair to say that, even in a public school where masters tend to be to the right of the political spectrum, the master who taught us was somewhat extreme.

 

[Bevan Price]

I studied Latin in the 2nd year at grammar school, but in the 3rd year, I was put in a group that studied more scientific options than "artistic" options, and Latin was not included for us. French was the preferred foreign language, and I did manage to pass GCE O Level French, but through lack of use, I have now forgotten much of it. One French teacher could also teach German, but very few pupils got that option, so I had to wait until Uni to learn enough German to read scientific texts (many of the historic texts on chemistry were written in German.)

 

[Busaholic]

If I recall, there is no word in Latin for 'Yes', so something like 'She loves you yeah, yeah, yeah' may be impossible to translate!

That's interesting, which perchance is another word with no direct Latin translation. Actually, wouldn't yeah x 3 become sic x 3?

 

[eMeS]

Entering a Direct Grant grammar school in 1950, I studied Latin for 4 years, and got a Pass at "O" Level. For my first two years, I also did Maths, English, French, Geography & History. We also did some "Art" and simple Science - More useful were the lessons in wood and metalwork. In my 3rd & 4th years, I moved to a more scientific curriculum, and did Physics & Chemistry along with Maths, History & Latin. I also remember reading several of Shakespeare's plays. "O" Levels were taken after 4 years.
After two years in the 6th form, I did "A" & "S" Levels in Maths, Physics & Chemistry, along with English OA and a "General Paper" - something required by the local examinations board. 6 months later I sat separate university entrance exams, and my really big problem was the translation paper - of which language out of the many offered, to attempt a translation? I wasted a lot of time really struggling with the Latin - after all, I did have a recent "O" Level in it. I then tried the French, found it much easier, and fortunately, I must have done well enough to get through.
After completing my 3rd year in the Sixth form, I started National Service in the RAF, spent around 11 months learning about servicing ground based radars at RAF Locking, and was then posted to 2nd TAF in West Germany for the remaining year of service. When I did get to University in 1959, I was then with boys two years younger than myself, as National Service had finished soon after I had started my two years. Several of my contemporaries went to university after 2 years in the 6th form, missed National Service and entered the job market 3 years before me.

[English Literature - we read several of the standard classics during my later years at school, including "Wuthering Heights", and "Pride & Prejudice".
I enjoyed "Wuthering Heights" and got good marks for my essay. I didn't understand at all the world described by Jane Austen in "Pride and Prejudice", and I think my essay got a "0".]

 

[Typhoon]

If I recall, there is no word in Latin for 'Yes', so something like 'She loves you yeah, yeah, yeah' may be impossible to translate!

To most of those starting secondary education in September (so those who might be the target for the Latin Project), I reckon The Beatles could be almost as much a part of history as Latin. After all, its possible that they had broken up before their grandparents were born.
I may go well out of my depth here but I'm thinking more about Ed Sheeran, The Weeknd, Billie Eilish, Anne-Marie, Dua Lipa. (I knew there would be some of reading the entertainment pages of The Metro some day.) Whether the lyrics are suitable, no idea.

 

[takno]

To most of those starting secondary education in September (so those who might be the target for the Latin Project), I reckon The Beatles could be almost as much a part of history as Latin. After all, its possible that they had broken up before their grandparents were born.
I may go well out of my depth here but I'm thinking more about Ed Sheeran, The Weeknd, Billie Eilish, Anne-Marie, Dua Lipa. (I knew there would be some of reading the entertainment pages of The Metro some day.) Whether the lyrics are suitable, no idea.

FWIW The Beatles were already a rather minority taste growing up in the 80s. Music lyrics in any case don't hold quite the same totemic place in culture that they once did. Maybe some Latin subtitles on Netflix, or something on Roblox.