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Leeds Station Improvement

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Wharfe106

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A thread on another forum indicates that Network Rail’s Leeds Station improvement website says that Platform Zero at Leeds station will be complete early next year

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/runni...tes/north-and-east/leeds-station-improvements

But Network Rail’s Enhancement Delivery Plan of October 2019 says the whole project will not be completed until the end of 2021, for which read May 2022 given delays caused by the virus.

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/who-we-are/publications-and-resources

Am I right in concluding that once Platform Zero is open, Platform 5 or 6 (I'm not sure which) will close for platform, track and signalling alterations in that part of the station, so we are still more than two years away from seeing all the benefits?
 

Class195

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How long will it be before platform zero is at capacity?

Why not just get rid of the car park and put in another two bays?
 

Halifaxlad

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How long will it be before platform zero is at capacity?

Why not just get rid of the car park and put in another two bays?

I suspect they would have done if the car park wasn't they're!

It could be re-provided upon the opposite side of the River Aire, although whenever or not that should be done is for the 'Speculative Ideas' forum!
 

YorksLad12

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I suspect they would have done if the car park wasn't they're!

It could be re-provided upon the opposite side of the River Aire, although whenever or not that should be done is for the 'Speculative Ideas' forum!

Er, assuming by "opposite side" you mean north of the river, that's where I live - so no they blinking well couldn't!

The car parks will be income generators (someone has to pay for this), and are well used by TOC staff judging by the people in uniform I sometimes spot.

I suspect one of the reasons for digging up the old platform face and running the track behind the multi-storey car park was that the amount of space required for a buffer stop and suitable gap behind would have made the platform length too small (plus the multi-storey would have been in the firing line of any over-running train). Any new bays would have the same problems, as the walking route off them would have been alongside the car park. You'd have to get rid of the multi-storey... or rebuild it over the top! It's a shame, as the old Wellington site is the only space available to build anything (new) now.
 

edwin_m

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The six-inch map on the NLS site shows tracks at Wellington going right up to the edge of the Aire, including the area where the multi-storey car park now is. That's consistent with how what is now the northern concourse has former platform entrances along the whole length of its west side. So there's probably no reason why the multi-storey couldn't be demolished and more platform added to the north of the new platform zero if necessary. However with all trains formed by MUs that can turn around more quickly than steam locos, there is less need for platform capacity than historically and the line capacity of approaching routes may be more of a limit.
 

Halifaxlad

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Er, assuming by "opposite side" you mean north of the river, that's where I live - so no they blinking well couldn't!

The car parks will be income generators (someone has to pay for this), and are well used by TOC staff judging by the people in uniform I sometimes spot.

Has this seen been developed then ?

Personally I can't quite remember of the top of my head and since you live they're your probably better off to tell us than I am.

lEEDS.png
 

achmelvic

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Has this seen been developed then ?

Personally I can't quite remember of the top of my head and since you live they're your probably better off to tell us than I am.

View attachment 76516

Nope, that site is still very much the car park as shown. As far as I know it's still officially going to be built on at some point however like plenty of those sites around the city centre it may be delayed even further in to the future given the current economic outlook.

As for demolishing the multi-storey and building yet more platforms I wouldn't be surprised if it happens at some point, especially as Leeds City Council are increasingly keen to discourage private cars driving into the city centre, for example the gradual reduction in lanes to fit in cycle and bus routes along with the upcoming clean air zone charge.
 

YorksLad12

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^ What he say. It's an odd area here: Wellington Plaza is almost complete now, but only one building has gone up on the other side of the river & canal (where the YP & YEP are based now), they've only just given fresh permission for a residential development opposite (south of) that and a Premier Inn was built on some green space next to the Novotel instead of on that car park.

Once you get that far away from the main station / gateline, you might as well use the old Whitehall platform ;)
 

Neptune

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Of course getting rid of car parking at Leeds station will solve all capacity issues as there’d be no staff to run any trains as there’s nowhere to park at 4.00 in the morning because the staff car park is now platforms. Brilliant idea.
 

Rikki Lamb

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Wellington street station platforms once covered the entire area up to the river now taken by car parking and the multi storey up until the 60s when it became a parcels depot and the former platform 1/2 became lorry loading space and later the car park.

The entrance currently next to the side of Wetherspoons i.e. to the pick area, was the entrance/exit to Wellington street platforms 1/2.
 

edwin_m

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Of course getting rid of car parking at Leeds station will solve all capacity issues as there’d be no staff to run any trains as there’s nowhere to park at 4.00 in the morning because the staff car park is now platforms. Brilliant idea.
You just deck over the platforms, preferably the ones that are only used by electrics.
 

modernrail

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There's businesses down there which need access, and they are a thoroughfare. I'm sure criminals would love that too.
There is a lot of unused space down there that could be made secure.

Anyway its a bit academic for now as there are no immediate plans to use that space up top. My only point is that somewhere can be found for the cars to go elsewhere if valuable railway land is ever needed for a railway. Clearly not an insurmountable problem.
 

edwin_m

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Is vehicle access to the dark arches still possible after the HS2 station is built, pedestrianizing Neville Street? I can imagine them becoming a posh shopping arcade like at London Bridge.
 

Revaulx

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That’s really interesting. So the old Wellington is going to be completely reinstated, right up to the river? Shame about the sacred car park...

With all those extra westward-facing platforms, surely something will have to be done with the western approaches, despite the addition of the HS2 approach. Grade separation of the ex-GN lines?
 

quantinghome

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That’s really interesting. So the old Wellington is going to be completely reinstated, right up to the river? Shame about the sacred car park...

With all those extra westward-facing platforms, surely something will have to be done with the western approaches, despite the addition of the HS2 approach. Grade separation of the ex-GN lines?
What conflicts would that grade separation resolve? At present the platforms are allocated in a fairly logical way which minimises conflicting moves. I imagine that additional platforms on the former Wellington site will simply shift everything a bit to the North. A lot of the additional platform capacity will be catering for longer trains rather than more frequent trains, so the current 6-track approach may still be sufficient. Ultimately any remodelling of the western approaches will be governed by the routing of HS3/NPR/whatever-they're-calling-it-today.
 

edwin_m

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That document is an architecture-focused masterplan and doesn't necessarily reflect what rail operational facilities might be provided. However it does indicate that a certain area is set aside for extra platforms if they are needed.

I did raise the issue of throat capacity a few posts back, which may become more of a constraint than platform availability. Because the services on the various lines from these platforms are mostly self-contained (with some exceptions such as London-Harrogate), if this becomes a problem the solution might be more parallel tracks rather than grade separation.
 

Mollman

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What conflicts would that grade separation resolve? At present the platforms are allocated in a fairly logical way which minimises conflicting moves. I imagine that additional platforms on the former Wellington site will simply shift everything a bit to the North. A lot of the additional platform capacity will be catering for longer trains rather than more frequent trains, so the current 6-track approach may still be sufficient. Ultimately any remodelling of the western approaches will be governed by the routing of HS3/NPR/whatever-they're-calling-it-today.

Although that presumably kills off the idea for cross-Leeds services coming off the Shipley route and on to 'East Leeds Parkway'
 

quantinghome

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Although that presumably kills off the idea for cross-Leeds services coming off the Shipley route and on to 'East Leeds Parkway'
I don't see why it wouldn't, although I don't see why that particular route would be better than (say) Bradford Interchange or Morley.
 

edwin_m

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Although that presumably kills off the idea for cross-Leeds services coming off the Shipley route and on to 'East Leeds Parkway'
East Leeds Parkway is to some extent a substitute for more west-facing platforms at Leeds, so building the one may remove the need for the other.
I don't see why it wouldn't, although I don't see why that particular route would be better than (say) Bradford Interchange or Morley.
It probably works better for those routes in fact, because they have less easy access to the bay platforms at Leeds so if they turn around there they probably have to block a through platform.
 

YorksLad12

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That document is an architecture-focused masterplan and doesn't necessarily reflect what rail operational facilities might be provided. However it does indicate that a certain area is set aside for extra platforms if they are needed.

I did raise the issue of throat capacity a few posts back, which may become more of a constraint than platform availability. Because the services on the various lines from these platforms are mostly self-contained (with some exceptions such as London-Harrogate), if this becomes a problem the solution might be more parallel tracks rather than grade separation.

I always like documents like these. It's like being a crayonista, but you get paid for it... That said, some of the Council-funded works are happening around Leeds, so perhaps I'm just being my usual Captain Grumpy self.

On the other hand: it suggests a new multi-storey car park on Whitehall Road, where the open car park we mentioned earlier is now. Let's assume Network Rail and Leeds City Council persuade the land owners to build it. They'd have to decant the existing contract parkers somewhere... but Wellington Square is almost complete. And even if they do build it, is it aimed at staff or passengers? Whoever parks there will face a 400m walk to get to the site of the existing car park which will be turned into... a car park, with commercial above it. I wouldn't like to do that walk in the wet, anyway!

On topic: the work area is really, really quiet at the moment, apart from the four-ish hours a day when it's really, really busy (and noisy). So they're managing to get some work done. Residents have been promised an update - I'll let you know if one comes our way.
 

skyhigh

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20200502_110228.jpg20200502_110225.jpg20200502_110219.jpg20200502_110156.jpg
Work on the temporary platform 1 is coming on (taken while on my way to work if anyone is wondering!)
 

edwin_m

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The fact it's going to be straight and parallel, and has to miss the car park, is probably the main reason for the removal of the ex-MR canopy being discussed a page or two back. It also means there's a bit more space available to create yet more platforms by removing the car park if that is ever needed, without having to re-align it.
 

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