Lickey Incline - are freight trains given a running start?

[Bunting14]

Are unbanked freights given a running start at the Incline from a few miles away as a matter of course or are there no particular considerations given.

 

[pompeyfan]

Although not realistic, I think i remember the signals on simsig not clearing on the bank until the entire bank is clear?

 

[onein37]

Unbanked freights sometimes go up from a standing start, normally when they have been looped to allow passing passenger. I think the bank is always clear before a banked freight starts the climb but not necessarily for an unbanked freight. A banker is only required if the trailing load exceeds a certain amount or lead loco has problems.

 

[The Planner]

Its about 1100 tonnes before you need a banker IIRC.

 

[exdeus]

These two photos from Gloucester PSB show the max tonnages banked and unbanked per loco. Interesting the 70 got put down for the same as the 66.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/llangollen_signalman/14545175978/in/set-72157645880526091

https://www.flickr.com/photos/llangollen_signalman/14731809435/in/set-72157645880526091

 

[snowball]

Shock horror! The words "double amber" appear on that panel.

 

[HSTfan!!!]

Sometimes get a standing start from the loop, you tend to be doing the same speed by the top if you get a standing start as if you took a run up at it.

 

[ilkestonian]

Shock horror! The words "double amber" appear on that panel.

But in connection with warning states rather than signals, methinks.

 

[headshot119]

Shock horror! The words "double amber" appear on that panel.

In relation to a bridge strike category and not a signal.

 

[daikilo]

Are unbanked freights given a running start at the Incline from a few miles away as a matter of course or are there no particular considerations given.

IIRC, the maximum loads for a given class of locomotive are determined by max continuous tractive effort and starting tractive effort. The latter will always be higher than the former, hence continuous is the more relevant.

In the case of the Lickey, the incline is so long that if the trailing load is excessive, taking a run will only determine where the train comes to a stand, not whether it gets over the top.

If the load is correct, a run will get the train up in less time, and it will reach its balancing speed determined by the continuous tractive effort peak further up the climb. Listen to the sound on any Youtube video taken toward the top and the engine note is the same from end to end, they just slog it out.

 

[The Planner]

These two photos from Gloucester PSB show the max tonnages banked and unbanked per loco. Interesting the 70 got put down for the same as the 66.

30 tonnes out, i'll take that.

 

[Gareth Marston]

Some stuff that should go up the Lickey goes via the Severn Tunnel and Marches, so it can break down there's instead of on the Lickey

 

[50010 Monarch]

Some stuff that should go up the Lickey goes via the Severn Tunnel and Marches, so it can break down there's instead of on the Lickey

Indeed, the Marches is suffering at the moment from freight failures stuffing up the job for hours on end but there's already a thread on that!!

 

[6Gman]

Indeed, the Marches is suffering at the moment from freight failures stuffing up the job for hours on end but there's already a thread on that!!

Hence the emoticon I think ....

 

[onein37]

More impressive is to see an unaided freight restart after stopping on the bank. Slipping back is not an option with the catch points.

 

[50010 Monarch]

Hence the emoticon I think ....

 

[D1009]

I suppose the point is that if the railway was nationalised there would be a continuous banking loco at Bromsgrove, and more freight would go that way. But the way passenger services have developed since privatisation, there are few paths on the route anyway and we've ended up with the situation that the FOC that inherited the banking arrangements from BR is the only one that runs loaded freight up there.

 

[The Lad]

67's are very weak and watery!

 

[tjlrailblue]

there are trap points set to derail run away trains on the mainline then? is this v common on the network?

Tim

 

[hello]

there are trap points set to derail run away trains on the mainline then? is this v common on the network?

Tim

no longer on the lickey they are scotched and clipped

 

[onein37]

When we're they clipped?
Freightliner use there own banker when needed. Colas was banked by DB the other day. All FOCs use the bank but to what loadings I don't know.

 

[RichmondCommu]

When we're they clipped?
Freightliner use there own banker when needed. Colas was banked by DB the other day. All FOCs use the bank but to what loadings I don't know.

It's interesting to read that DBS were prepared to assist a rival freight operator up the Lickey.

I do wonder whether it would make more operational sense for Network Rail to hire a loco and use that to push freights up the Lickey.

 

[onein37]

But Colas did convey a DB 59 the one day. So maybe a bit of scratching each others backs.

 

[edwin_m]

The rail freight companies generally seem to be happy to assist a competitor, but no doubt only if the price is right.

 

[HSTfan!!!]

DBS charge a small fortune to bank you up there. I've only taken one loaded train up there under GBRf and we banked it up ourselves. Everything else we run up there is empty.