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LM Great Escape

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cls

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Booked a ticket for 14th February, looking at the LM website about the Euston - Watford closure it advises other companies can be used :

can I travel with another train operator?
If you have to travel by train during the closure, we advise
you to use alternative train companies where possible.
This will make your journey quicker and easier. If you already
have a valid London Midland ticket, we have arranged for
your ticket to be valid on Chiltern Railways, Thameslink, East
Midlands Trains, London Overground* & London
Underground services on the following dates:

14th - 15th Feb
21st - 22nd Feb

LINK FORM WEBSITE : http://www.londonmidland.com/your-journey/journey-planning/eustonline/

So could I go from Nuneaton via Leicester to London and return using the chiltern line via Birmingham and Coventry back to Nuneaton

Thanks Mark
 
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Bletchleyite

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It wouldn't overly surprise me if the Great Escape was excepted. But I wonder if their marketing people just haven't checked - it makes no sense to sell them at all on those heavily disrupted weekends. Encouraging people onto a network in a messy state is just going to cause them to get upset - rather the opposite of the promotional intentions of the ticket.

Neil
 

Tetchytyke

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It depends where you're going- London Midland's network is much more than just Northampton to London. I'm thinking of going out on one to Shrewsbury, and trains are running fine from north of here.

They've not said you can't use the alternative routes, but I imagine that is an oversight.
 

Bletchleyite

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It depends where you're going- London Midland's network is much more than just Northampton to London.

They've not said you can't, but I imagine that is an oversight.

The Great Escape page mentions bus replacements, which is a fairly strong suggestion they aren't valid on the other routes.

I note the price has increased somewhat, especially on weekends when it has gone up a fiver, and Railcard discount percentage has reduced. Not as good an offer as it was.

Worth noting for anyone wanting to do this sort of thing north of Northampton only - there's also this available off-peak all the time!

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_fares/pr9cb0cc0a040004006ad8690e40c16f.aspx

and includes other TOCs as well, so may actually be better value if a little more expensive, depending on your plan.

Notably it offers Two Together railcard discount but no others.

Neil
 

greatkingrat

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Due to the Chiltern landslip, it looks like this engineering work will be cancelled anyway.
 

185143

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greatkingrat:2064422 said:
Due to the Chiltern landslip, it looks like this engineering work will be cancelled anyway.

I have a VT MAN-STA advance for the forum meet. VT from Manchester don't normally stop at Stafford, so what happens with my advance?
 

Kite159

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VT will instruct you to catch the Virgin service which goes via Crewe from Manchester, and change over to one from Liverpool which stops at Stafford?
 

Starmill

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You can leave earlier if your original train is cancelled and you want to arrive at the same time as your direct train would have. i.e. there will probably be a time penalty, but you can still undertake the journey only on VT.
 

185143

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Fahad:2064801 said:
If his VT is cancelled then yes
Its the 07:35 MAN-RUG
Calling additionally at Stafford and running via the West Midlands.

Trust me trying to be clever and avoid a Voyager!:D
I'm on the 06:50 from Birchwood to Manchester, which is the first train of the day, so if I had to use the VT from MAN-CRE, would I be able to travel later?

I don't suppose if the train is announced as cancelled I'd be able to get a refund and purchase a new XC advance?
 

Starmill

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I thought with Advances you had to stay on the same TOC as booked unless special arrangements have been made for interavailability due to severe disruption.

Neil

Unfortunately the first bit is, I think, true. It's a nonsense really, it should always be in the TOC's interest to get the passenger to their destination as close to the booked time as possible. Their dithering while services depart that could get them there on time but they do not have an automatic right to is one of the leading inefficiencies in terms of how a TOC responds to disruption IMO. Cross-acceptance is arranged a little better now than it perhaps once was, but it still needs to be a lot quicker to reduce delays to passengers.


It is not the passenger's fault if a suitable train is run by another TOC - if the booked train has been cancelled then the TOC is not upholding their end of the bargain, and the TOC restriction should be dropped in favour of reducing delays. If nothing else it would make for fewer delay compensation claims too.
 

Bletchleyite

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It is not the passenger's fault if a suitable train is run by another TOC - if the booked train has been cancelled then the TOC is not upholding their end of the bargain, and the TOC restriction should be dropped in favour of reducing delays. If nothing else it would make for fewer delay compensation claims too.

I would agree with this, though I suppose to an extent the restriction is what you pay for a cheaper ticket.

That said, LM and VT are very good at kicking this in very quickly in the event of disruption, particularly of the Trent Valley stopping service.

Neil
 

Starmill

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I would agree with this, though I suppose to an extent the restriction is what you pay for a cheaper ticket.
Neil

On the contrary, you get the cheaper ticket in exchange for booking in advance of travel and for accepting very restrictive terms - booked train only - and if you miss it your ticket has no value.

ATOC summed it up nicely:

Other Railway Undertakings’ passengers
The nature of the rail network means that many passengers use connecting trains travelling
with more than one Railway Undertaking in a single journey. During disruptive incidents
passengers should not be discriminated against on the basis of operator and efforts should
be made to deliver the same high standards to everyone. This includes passengers travelling
on Railway Undertaking-specific tickets who have been re-routed onto another Railway
Undertaking’s trains because of disruption.

Source: ATOC Approved Code of Practice – Passenger Information During Disruption July 2014
 

Bletchleyite

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On the contrary, you get the cheaper ticket in exchange for booking in advance of travel and for accepting very restrictive terms - booked train only - and if you miss it your ticket has no value.

Surely you get a cheaper ticket in exchange for *all* its restrictive T&Cs, not just the ones you happen to like?

With airline tickets, unlike rail tickets more generally, you get treated better in disruption with a full IATA fare business class ticket than the cheapest economy ticket, for instance. You'll still get your EU money (though often have to argue for it) but you'll get served quicker and on another flight quicker, certainly. So there are parallels.

Neil
 

Kite159

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I would agree with this, though I suppose to an extent the restriction is what you pay for a cheaper ticket.

That said, LM and VT are very good at kicking this in very quickly in the event of disruption, particularly of the Trent Valley stopping service.

Neil

Agreed, I've been at Euston a few times when a LM Birmingham service has been canned and the "LM trains only" restriction lifted for passengers to travel on the next Virgin service if they were travelling to the places served by it (Coventry, International, Rugby).
Saves mass overcrowding on the next LM service
 

185143

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As the Watford Junction works have now been cancelled, I have tweeted VT/NRE to enquire what will happen with the ticket and VT said more information would be available tomorrow and an amended timetable has yet to be agreed. Surely it will be a normal Saturday service?

If it is a normal service, and my train doesn't call at Stafford, would I be entitled to a refund as my train has been advertised as cancelled before travel?
The way I see it is that VT's side of the contract is to provide me a service from Manchester to Stafford on the 07:35 on the 21st Feb only. If my train is not going to Stafford, they have failed the agreed terms when the ticket was sold?

I booked on the Virgin Trains service for two reasons.
1)it was cheaper than XC
2)I'm not exactly the biggest fan of Voyagers:D
(Note to Mods:This should probably be in a new 'Watford works Cancelled' thread tbh.)
 
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The Great Escape page mentions bus replacements, which is a fairly strong suggestion they aren't valid on the other routes.

I note the price has increased somewhat, especially on weekends when it has gone up a fiver, and Railcard discount percentage has reduced. Not as good an offer as it was.

Worth noting for anyone wanting to do this sort of thing north of Northampton only - there's also this available off-peak all the time!

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_fares/pr9cb0cc0a040004006ad8690e40c16f.aspx

and includes other TOCs as well, so may actually be better value if a little more expensive, depending on your plan.

Notably it offers Two Together railcard discount but no others.

Neil

Same prices as last time, if memory serves me correct all tickets weren't taken up as in previous promotions when the price was the same whatever day you travelled and no restrictions
 

Starmill

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184143, you will get a refund. But honestly it's hardly worth the bother. Keep your ticket, check one or two days before you travel what the schedule shows. If the 0735 is definitely not calling at Stafford, take your ticket to a ticket office if you're so inclined, they will probably be able to verify it won't be stopping there and get you another seat reservation on the next VT from Crewe to Stafford.

If that isn't what you want, and you would prefer to travel by direct train, either VT customer relations or a VT ticket office is the place to go. But why you'd want to get XC I don't know... If it were me, my preference would be to take the booked train as far as either Crewe or Stoke depending where it goes, and then next available connection to destination, which may actually be LM.

What I wouldn't do is refund your ticket and then have to buy a more expensive replacement.
 

PermitToTravel

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As the Watford Junction works have now been cancelled, I have tweeted VT/NRE to enquire what will happen with the ticket and VT said more information would be available tomorrow and an amended timetable has yet to be agreed. Surely it will be a normal Saturday service?

If it is a normal service, and my train doesn't call at Stafford, would I be entitled to a refund as my train has been advertised as cancelled before travel?
The way I see it is that VT's side of the contract is to provide me a service from Manchester to Stafford on the 07:35 on the 21st Feb only. If my train is not going to Stafford, they have failed the agreed terms when the ticket was sold?

I booked on the Virgin Trains service for two reasons.
1)it was cheaper than XC
2)I'm not exactly the biggest fan of Voyagers:D
(Note to Mods:This should probably be in a new 'Watford works Cancelled' thread tbh.)

NRCoC 26b said:
if the train you intend to use is cancelled, delayed or your reservation will not be honoured, your ticket or relevant portion of it is completely unused, you decide not to travel and you submit a claim for a refund within 28 days of the expiry of the ticket to the Ticket Seller you will be given a full refund as shown in Condition 27 as soon as practicable and in any case within one month of your claim being received.
-----
 

Starmill

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Although if anyone plans on getting Piccadilly Ticket Office to act on their Condition 26 obligations then all I can say is good luck to them.
 
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