London Bridge reconstruction works

[GW43125]

There's a description here, from March. No idea if it is 100% current, but it seems to fit with what has been discussed before:
https://www.railengineer.uk/2017/03/22/thameslink-signalling-update/

May well have come up in a different thread than this though, the route issues and rolling stock appear in so many different places other than this thread...

That actually explains a fair bit, but isn't quite certain where the boundaries would be. At least keeping the lineside signals will allow southern fast services to run normally. It's not entirely certain though whether the changeover will be on the fly or if it'll have to stop and restart.

 

[Bald Rick]

That actually explains a fair bit, but isn't quite certain where the boundaries would be. At least keeping the lineside signals will allow southern fast services to run normally. It's not entirely certain though whether the changeover will be on the fly or if it'll have to stop and restart.

Changeover is on the move. The transition zones are (roughly):

1) on the Bermondsey flyover
2) just north of Elephant & Castle
3) just south of Kentish Town
4) Canal Tunnels

 

[takno]

5xxx berths are starting to appear in the signalling data feed between normal signals in the area suggested here (except not yet in London Bridge/Bermondsey). I don't know if that indicates that the ATO is being tested or used.

 

[ComUtoR]

I've noticed that some of the block markers are short of the RLU marks through the core. Anyone know how that will impact needing to stop at the RLU and being required to stop at the block marker ?

I've haven't been ATO/ERTMS trains as yet so I'm a little clueless as to how it will work.

 

[carriageline]

How do you mean mate? The Block Markers are just a fixed point up to which you get a movement authority too, so essentially like virtual signals.

Inside the platform, you “should” never have to stop at a block marker. You’ll only get a movement authority up to the block marker when the train ahead starts moving out of the platform. They work identically to the mid platform closing up signals we have throughout the core.

Any questions, give me a message as I’m fairly gamed up with ERTMS now as I’ve been living and breathing it this year!

 

[collexions]

How do you mean mate? The Block Markers are just a fixed point up to which you get a movement authority too, so essentially like virtual signals.

Inside the platform, you “should” never have to stop at a block marker. You’ll only get a movement authority up to the block marker when the train ahead starts moving out of the platform. They work identically to the mid platform closing up signals we have throughout the core.

Any questions, give me a message as I’m fairly gamed up with ERTMS now as I’ve been living and breathing it this year!

I have to pick your brain further when you're down with us for HL17 CS/NKE simulator FAT in a couple of weeks.

 

[felixthebadger]

NR moves into final stages of London Bridge works.

http://www.railtechnologymagazine.c...ridge-works-with-track-and-signalling-upgrade

A vital piece of track and signalling work at London Bridge has been completed by Network Rail, paving the way forward for Thameslink services to resume through the station next year.

Engineers have worked to deliver the improvements between London Bridge and Blackfriars ahead of cross-London Thameslink trains being reintroduced from May 2018 after a three year hiatus that has seen NR rebuild the platforms and re-lay track through London Bridge.

When complete, this will be the first time trains on the cross-London route between Brighton and Bedford have called at London Bridge since January 2015....

 

[FOH]

Passing through the station this evening it looked like the great wall was starting to be taken down. There’s still a lot of work to be done in the entertainment zone and the erection going on there is seemingly slow going.

 

[hwl]

There’s still a lot of work to be done in the entertainment zone and the erection going on there is seemingly slow going.

Probably because it isn't meant to open till Easter and the rest has priority till then.

 

[ijmad]

Passing through the station this evening it looked like the great wall was starting to be taken down. There’s still a lot of work to be done in the entertainment zone and the erection going on there is seemingly slow going.

Entertainment Zone?! Is that what they're calling the area on the upper level outside the Shard concourse?

 

[FOH]

Entertainment Zone?! Is that what they're calling the area on the upper level outside the Shard concourse?

Ha, well that’s my terminology. I think it’s all restaurants and bars

 

[ijmad]

Ha, well that’s my terminology. I think it’s all restaurants and bars

Made me giggle. Should be the official name for sure.

 

[tsr]

Because what everyone desperately needed was more drunk people running across the concourse on a Friday night...

 

[GW43125]

They work identically to the mid platform closing up signals we have throughout the core.

Question, how actually do these "closing up signals" work? I've seen an RLU parked in Blackfriars with another unit at the top of the bank but not drawn up to the mid platform signal-is this related to the overlaps?

 

[ComUtoR]

I've seen an RLU parked in Blackfriars with another unit at the top of the bank but not drawn up to the mid platform signal-is this related to the overlaps?

Yes. The unit in front is still in the overlap so the signal in the rear cannot clear. As the unit in front passes out the station it will clear the mid point overlap and allow the unit behind to creep in whilst it is still exiting the station. Traditionally a unit will need to clear the entire platform and the starters' overlap before it can enter. The midpoint allows units to 'close up' to each other.

 

[bengley]

A lot of drivers won't enter the platforms in the core until the mid platform signal is off, thus making them completely pointless and removing the capacity benefits. I go in when they're still on myself, not had to stop at one yet!

 

[carriageline]

You ‘shouldnt’ have to stop at one, unless your coming in quite quick, or the other unit is slow, or stops. They are quite cleverly designed, the London Bridge ones know if ‘certain’ signals are at danger, then it stops a second train entering the platforms, as 12 cars will overhang the overlap if stopped at said signals, thus it would cause trains to stop at the mid plats.

 

[ComUtoR]

ooooh is that why the headway seems to dramatically increase when heading towards Ewer Street ? Those are really tight coming across the bridge. You head towards Ewer Street under restrictive and then pop ! everything drops to green.

 

[ijmad]

So I looked at the Jan/Feb timetable now up on RealTimeTrains, and it seems like Thameslink services through London Bridge are shown entirely as 'pass' rather than 'call':
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/sea...18/02/01/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt

I've heard from various sources that this 4tph would be stopping at the new platforms until the wider timetable revisions in May brings 16tph.

Wondering if this is a mistake or provisional timetable, or represents the actual plan, and we won't actually see any Thameslink trains calling at London Bridge until May.

 

[kentman]

From : Thameslink’s 24tph introduction held over to 2019
"Speaking exclusively to RAIL on November 15, Chris Gibb, chairman of the Thameslink Programme Industry Readiness Board, said that as soon as drivers were trained, GTR services would be diverted via London Bridge from January instead of May, and via the Canal Tunnels from April."

And : Another milestone achieved allowing the reintroduction of cross-London Thameslink services
"From May 2018, Thameslink services will resume calling at London Bridge after a hiatus of three years, during which time Network Rail rebuilt the platforms and re-laid track through London Bridge, which is being entirely redeveloped as part of the Thameslink Programme. "

Which sounds like the original plan was to call from May, but they are now go via London Bridge (not calling) from Jan.

 

[Bald Rick]

A lot of drivers won't enter the platforms in the core until the mid platform signal is off, thus making them completely pointless and removing the capacity benefits. I go in when they're still on myself, not had to stop at one yet!

Fortunately, ATO won't be so picky...

 

[FOH]

I always thought it was 4tph to call at London Bridge from January though they’d still be timed end to end via Herne Hill hence would arrive quite early at London Bridge and wait for scheduled departure time.

 

[ijmad]

I always thought it was 4tph to call at London Bridge from January though they’d still be timed end to end via Herne Hill hence would arrive quite early at London Bridge and wait for scheduled departure time.

Yeah, I'd read that too.
Looks like the RealTimeTrains data is wrong as right now it's just showing the 'official' timetable.
Probably the stops will show up as alterations?

 

[FOH]

From looking at other forums it seems this may be correct and full service not planned now until December 2019

 

[ijmad]

From looking at other forums it seems this may be correct and full service not planned now until December 2019

Boo. I see the detailed post in https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...onsultation-part-2.149023/page-5#post-3209413 says only 12tph through London Bridge from May 2018 to December 2019. That is disappointing. I'd surmised from previous sources that when they had 20tph crossing London in May, all 16tph would go via London Bridge and it would be the Catford Loop trains that would terminate at Blackfriars. Sounds like they might phase in some more in Dec 18 though.

 

[N/100]

Platforms 4 and 5 now clear of construction material. Interesting to see how different this island is to the southeastern platforms; with the raised section for wheelchairs, different information screens, even the emergency exits look different.

 

[FOH]

Platforms 4 and 5 now clear of construction material.

Just in the nick of time for them not now to be needed for another 6 months

 

[KingJ]

Platforms 4 and 5 now clear of construction material. Interesting to see how different this island is to the southeastern platforms; with the raised section for wheelchairs, different information screens, even the emergency exits look different.

Is it me, or do they also look slightly narrower than 6/7 8/9 as well?

 

[Skimpot flyer]

Entertainment Zone?! Is that what they're calling the area on the upper level outside the Shard concourse?

Could attract the wrong sort of 'customers', if it becomes known the area has an Entertainment Zone and mention of 'an erection going on there'

 

[swt_passenger]

Is it me, or do they also look slightly narrower than 6/7 8/9 as well?

They aren't exactly the same, and I think this has been asked earlier in the thread. However assuming they've been built as per the planning drawings they are the same widths alongside the majority of the central areas of the operational lengths, ie alongside the lifts and escalators, but then all the platforms taper to some degree at the country ends to fit the overall site. I'd estimate that there is probably about a 9 car length where the widths are all the same. The P2/3 and P4/5 islands are very similar, P6/7 and P8/9 are slightly wider at the country end, but slightly narrow at the London end.

Some platforms have slightly longer, narrower ends than others because the emergency exits are not aligned neatly to one another but to the routes through the lower levels.

There was a drawing posted here:
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/london-bridge-reconstruction-works.108509/page-42#post-2876255