London Buses Discussion

[GusB]

The discussion about standee vs seated layouts, while relevant to London, has a wider scope and therefore would be better having a separate thread. Before anyone starts a new thread, it may be worth using the search facility to find out whether this has been discussed previously.

 

[chopperman21]

Stagecoach are currently loaning Enviro 400's from RATP to operate the Route 173 until new electric buses arrive. Such as 80457

 

[chopperman21]

Last Saturday saw the extension of Route 383 to Finchley Memorial Hospital, the fully refurbished and branded 605 (or ex RATP SDE11 SK07HLM) is the extra bus required for the extension. With the Ex Go-Ahead London WS46 now becoming the spare bus. Lots of background info about the extension is found here.

 

[700007]

Some of the new electric buses for route C3 have arrived at Tower Transit's Westbourne Park garage waiting introduction but no start date yet.

 

[Mikey C]

Some of the new electric buses for route C3 have arrived at Tower Transit's Westbourne Park garage waiting introduction but no start date yet.

A brave choice to choose the electric Metrodekker...

 

[MotCO]

A brave choice to choose the electric Metrodekker...

Why?

Metroline have some for route 134 (31), and Tower Transit for routes 23 (27) and C3 (10) and Go-Ahead have ordered some for route 200 (17), a total of 85. The only competitor is BYD/Enviro 400, and these have appeared on routes 43 (37), 106 (14?), 212 (12?), 230 (11?), 357 (7?) and 94 (29), and those for routes 173 (19) and 174 (27) are in the course of delivery, a total of 156. Therefore the number of electric double deckers is split roughly 1/3rd Optare and 2/3rds ADL, so quite a few people are being 'brave'.

 

[chopperman21]

Some of the new electric buses for route C3 have arrived at Tower Transit's Westbourne Park garage waiting introduction but no start date yet.

Some have now started to enter service on the Route 23 - OE34002

 

[700007]

Route 328 confirmed to be operating from Metroline's Cricklewood (W) garage when the company takes over from Tower Transit next summer. It is expected it will use the current Gemini 3 hybrids in use on route 7 at the moment.

Route 7s new hydrogen double deckers - first of their kind - should be arriving shortly. Route 7 was also retained by Metroline last week for another 5+2 years.

 

[londonbridge]

Can someone please clarify the position on adults using the 'school services'? Was waiting for the bus yesterday, there were about five kids at the stop, when the bus arrrived it had the 'school service' board at the front. The kids got on and started heading upstairs, I could see downstairs was totally empty, as I went to board the driver shut the doors and drove straight off. Are adults not meant to use these buses under any circumstances, seems stupid to stop someone from travelling when there was no-one sitting downstairs and hence plenty of room to distance.

 

[700007]

Can someone please clarify the position on adults using the 'school services'? Was waiting for the bus yesterday, there were about five kids at the stop, when the bus arrrived it had the 'school service' board at the front. The kids got on and started heading upstairs, I could see downstairs was totally empty, as I went to board the driver shut the doors and drove straight off. Are adults not meant to use these buses under any circumstances, seems stupid to stop someone from travelling when there was no-one sitting downstairs and hence plenty of room to distance.

The official stance from TfL is that drivers should 'encourage' adults to wait for a non school bus but they are not allowed to deny anyone from boarding.

 

[londonbridge]

Right, I'll email them then as he didn't say anything, just shut the door in my face and drove off before I could bang on the door to maintain his attention.

 

[philthetube]

If I was driving and five kids got on a bus and you had not got on the bottom step I would assume that you did not want the bus.

 

[Robertj21a]

Right, I'll email them then as he didn't say anything, just shut the door in my face and drove off before I could bang on the door to maintain his attention.

The whole point is that it is intended for school children.

 

[Westcountryman]

The whole point is that it is intended for school children.

Did you see post 430?

 

[Robertj21a]

Did you see post 430?

If you mean 340 then yes - it still doesn't alter what I said.

 

[Busaholic]

The whole point is that it is intended for school children.

There are plenty of reports of journeys not so designated by TfL arriving with the school journeys blind showing when it shouldn't be, either through driver 'error' or not.

 

[Robertj21a]

There are plenty of reports of journeys not so designated by TfL arriving with the school journeys blind showing when it shouldn't be, either through driver 'error' or not.

Yes, I know - but this appears to have been a genuine school bus (where social distancing isn't required). To my mind it just requires us to all try to be as helpful and sensible as possible through these unusual times.

 

[matt_world2004]

The official stance from TfL is that drivers should 'encourage' adults to wait for a non school bus but they are not allowed to deny anyone from boarding.

The purpose of the school buses is buses designated for school children only are allowed to operate at a higher capacity because coronavirus legislation deems dedicated school buses to be operating within the schools "coronavirus bubble" this seems to be disregarding the fact that school buses serve multiple schools in London .
It is not just the 600x school routes that have them but any bus route that has a significant amount of school kids.

The capacity on school buses is 60 verses 30 on standard double deckers. Iirc

The school bus is allowed to take children and their carers .

Seperately TfL run "Non School Services" which aren't supposed to be boarded by school children and their carers.

The purpose of the statement that drivers should encourage adults not to board school buses . Is that if an adult insists on boarding TfL dont want the driver put at risk through the conflict this creates. There are also some exceptions where a driver can use their judgement in allowing adults to board (For example a near empty bus at the end of their route there is no harm in having adults or school children board buses they wouldn't otherwise be allowed to board)

 

[Mikey C]

I'd be wary of getting on a fairly empty school bus anyway, in case in 2 stops time another load of school children pile on...

 

[matt_world2004]

I'd be wary of getting on a fairly empty school bus anyway, in case in 2 stops time another load of school children pile on...

There are situations when enforcing the school bus rule would not be in the best interests of the customer. The 482 going towards Heathrow Terminal 5 is one that has several buses running as school buses enforcing that rule from Hatton cross onwards when there is next to no chance of school children boarding would not be customer friendly.

 

[chopperman21]

Tower Transit's Electric Optare Metrodeckers are now starting to appear on Route C3, such as OE34002. However still only 4 have been used and not all at the same time.

 

[Snow1964]

Another batch of TfL bus tenders out today.

About 80 more new double deck electric buses (exact number depends up spares and unknown split of new and existing on route 180).

 

[700007]

Another batch of TfL bus tenders out today.

About 80 more new double deck electric buses (exact number depends up spares and unknown split of new and existing on route 180).

Full tenders are:
49* awarded to London United, currently Abellio London
63/N63* awarded to Abellio London, currently Go Ahead
132* retained by Go Ahead
156 retained by Abellio London
160* awarded to Stagecoach London, currently Arriva London
180* awarded to Stagecoach London, currently Go Ahead
332 retained by Metroline
344 retained by Abellio London
414 awarded to Tower Transit, currently Abellio London

*routes marked with an asterisk are to get brand new electric double deckers. Route 180 will receive a mixture of new electric buses and existing hybrid buses.

All contracts commence between August and November 2021.

General belief is that route 49 will be returning 'home' to Shepherds Bush garage, route 63 at Walworth Garage, route 160 to Catford garage, route 414 to Westbourne Park garage and 180 to Plumstead garage.

The 414 is very likely to use the Gemini 3 buses coming off route 328 next year when that route passes to Metroline. The 156 will be using the 2014 plated Enviro 400 hybrids coming off route 49.

 

[chopperman21]

Electric school buses.... BYD1472 is seen at Southgate Station while working on the School Route 699

 

[chopperman21]

136 (BJ11DVV) and 137 (BJ11DVW) have started there transition into the main Ensignbus Fleet, both now feature LED blinds and are currently being used on extra TfL School work, but could soon be painted into the main Blue and Silver livery.

 

[700007]

According to London Vehicle Finder, an LT (Boris bus) was on the 133 this afternoon between Liverpool Street and Streatham Station. First time it has happened. Are these blinded, and has anyone seen this?

 

[chopperman21]

According to London Vehicle Finder, an LT (Boris bus) was on the 133 this afternoon between Liverpool Street and Streatham Station. First time it has happened. Are these blinded, and has anyone seen this?

It wasn't blinded and displayed a hand written number 133 in the drivers windscreen

 

[700007]

It wasn't blinded and displayed a hand written number 133 in the drivers windscreen

Wow that is quite the sight!

 

[Robertj21a]

It wasn't blinded and displayed a hand written number 133 in the drivers windscreen

High time that TfL adopted LED screens for route numbers and destinations. Blinds are just so outdated, inflexible and costly to change.

 

[700007]

High time that TfL adopted LED screens for route numbers and destinations. Blinds are just so outdated, inflexible and costly to change.

I am split truth be told, on the matter. Blinds are cheaper to install, maintain and replace but at the same time the clarity of smart blinds is second to none. No LED can ever replicate that quality. But of course, LED as you say is much more flexible and can show multiple messages and be updated instantly.

In the case of this one off isolated incident it is fair to say the LT shouldn't have been on the 133 anyways so the blinds work fine for the job they do.