London to Oxford AND Banbury

[A Challenge]

You wouldn't be able to do it the other way, but I want sure about to the period return.

 

[John @ home]

Kew Bridge to Banbury OFF PEAK route NOT VIA LONDON and excess the return half to +ANY PERMITTED (as I don't think you can excess the OFF PEAK DAY R to that can you?)

If returning on the same day as the outward journey, it's perfectly valid to excess one leg of an Off-Peak Day Return to an Off-Peak Return by a different route. This can be necessary where Day Return tickets are available on some but not all of the routes between two stations.

For example, two weeks ago I travelled from Leeds to Manchester using the outward portion of an Off-Peak Day Return Leeds - Manchester Stations route via Hebden Bridge ticket. I wanted to return by a faster train, so I excessed the return leg only to an Off-Peak Return Leeds - Manchester Stations route Any Permitted. There are no Off-Peak Day Return Leeds - Manchester Stations route Any Permitted fares. With a Railcard discount, this cost me £1.75 and met my needs precisely.

Unfortunately, one week ago the Leeds - Manchester route via Hebden Bridge tickets were replaced by Leeds - Manchester route Northern Only, so in future I'll not be able to obtain an excess fare.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

Unfortunately, one week ago the Leeds - Manchester route via Hebden Bridge tickets were replaced by Leeds to Manchester route Northern Only, so in future I'll not be able to obtain an excess fare.

There are plenty of suitable alternatives, which, given your knowledge, I'm sure you'll be more than able to find

 

[suzanneparis]

Thanks again, but.... the plot thickens!

We are now doing two separate journeys. We shall go to Oxford next week. So, tomorrow, Thursday, we are travelling only to Banbury from Kew Bridge, and return the same day. Depart in time to reach Banbury by about 9.30am and depart Banbury for the return journey at about 3.30 pm.

A few questions:
1 Can we buy tickets for this journey from the machine on the platform at Kew Bridge?
2 Some routes show as via Marylebone and some via Reading. Can we travel either route or must we stick to one route out and the second route back.
3 Will the ticket machine offer both routes??? (NRE seems to only off via Marylebone today - a couple of days ago it was also showing via Reading).
4 Strangely, the tickets to Banbury are more expensive from Ealing Broadway (which we can get to on the but outside the door). Why is that and is that a better route.

Thanks again everyone. Sorry to be a bit of a pain.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

Can we buy tickets for this journey from the machine on the platform at Kew Bridge?

According to National Rail Enquiries, there is a National Rail ticket machine at Kew Bridge. This should be able to sell you tickets on the day, or let you pick up any tickets you have bought online for pickup.

Some routes show as via Marylebone and some via Reading. Can we travel either route or must we stick to one route out and the second route back.

Tickets from Kew Bridge to Banbury are routed either "✠ANY PERMITTED" or "NOT VIA LONDON". The former is valid either via London, or avoiding London - it gives you the option of which route you wish to use. A ticket with the latter route is not valid via London, but if you do purchase it and later decide you'd prefer to travel via London (on either leg of the ticket), you can obtain what is known as a "change of route excess". This can be done at a ticket office, or onboard the train. There is no penalty for doing it onboard the train, even where you had the opportunity to do it before boarding.

The amount payable is half the difference between the price of the route you hold, and the route you're excessing it to, for each leg that you're excessing. The only complication is that if you don't excess a "not via London" ticket before reaching the London Underground, you won't be able to excess it there and will indeed need to visit a ticket office to excess it to make it valid for travel on the Underground.

Will the ticket machine offer both routes??? (NRE seems to only off via Marylebone today - a couple of days ago it was also showing via Reading).

You should be offered both routes - NRE will generally only show the fastest routes by default, so any routes that are overtaken, either through the usual timetable, or particular delays or disruption on the day, won't usually come up. If you're in any doubt, you can always buy the tickets online and then pick them up at the ticket machine. If you do this, you might like to book using the Southern site, as, as has recently been mentioned, there is no fee for obtaining a refund if you don't pick up the tickets.

Strangely, the tickets to Banbury are more expensive from Ealing Broadway (which we can get to on the but outside the door). Why is that and is that a better route.

Tickets from Ealing Broadway to Banbury are priced in the same group as tickets from other stations nearer to Reading, such as Acton Main Line and Greenford. Incidentally, certain tickets are more expensive from Ealing Broadway to Banbury - the prices of different routes and ticket types are different for the two stations. If you're unsure what the best ticket is for your journey, you can always check what you are offered on a journey planner online.

Thanks again everyone. Sorry to be a bit of a pain.

No pain; I think we may have complicated the answer a little too much!

So, tomorrow, Thursday, we are travelling only to Banbury from Kew Bridge, and return the same day. Depart in time to reach Banbury by about 9.30am and depart Banbury for the return journey at about 3.30 pm.

For both the outbound and return journeys, it's quickest to go from Ealing Broadway - you could leave at 07:33 and arrive at 09:26, changing at Slough and Oxford; alternatively you could leave at 07:50 and arrive 09:33, changing at Reading. For the return journey, the timetable means it's quicker to go via London - you could leave at 15:39 and arrive at 17:40, changing at London Marylebone, or depart at 15:48 and arrive at 18:07.

To do this with a ticket from Ealing Broadway to Banbury you might like to get an Anytime Day Return route "not via London", costing £38.00, which you then excess the return portion of to the Off-Peak Day Return route "via London". The excess would cost half the difference - so £5.25. You won't be able to buy an excess online, but this doesn't really matter, as there are no seat reservations you're missing out on anyway! If you don't manage to excess the ticket before taking the train from Banbury (e.g. at the ticket office at Slough/Oxford/Reading or even Banbury), you ought to be able to do so at the excess fares window upon arrival at Marylebone. It's at the right hand side of the gateline when you're arriving.

 

[IanD]

No pain; I think we may have complicated the answer a little too much!

I applaud your use of the Royal "We".

 

[Haywain]

Best ticket from Kew Bridge to Banbury, to fit your requirements, is the Off Peak Return at (with your railcard) £31.75, route Any Permitted. You will be able to use this on the 08:37 train from Marylebone, arriving in Banbury at 09:38. As discussed elsewhere this gives you flexibility about the route for your return journey.

In my view this is a no brainer for your preferred arrival time.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Best ticket from Kew Bridge to Banbury, to fit your requirements, is the Off Peak Return at (with your railcard) £31.75, route Any Permitted. You will be able to use this on the 08:37 train from Marylebone, arriving in Banbury at 09:38.

In fact, the Off-Peak ticket is unrestricted leaving London. The Super Off-Peak is the one that's restricted between 06:30 and 08:30 Mondays to Fridays (excluding public holidays).

As such, I'd say the Any Permitted Super Off-Peak (priced at £22.75 with Railcard discount) would be equally valid (and certainly would be with a London to Banbury ticket) but the existence of the "Not via London" Off-Peak Day Return (not valid before 09:30) appears to be causing websites not to offer a Senior Railcard discount on such tickets for departures from Kew Bridge before 09:30!

 

[Paul Kelly]

As such, I'd say the Any Permitted Super Off-Peak (priced at £22.75 with Railcard discount) would be equally valid (and certainly would be with a London to Banbury ticket) but the existence of the "Not via London" Off-Peak Day Return (not valid before 09:30) appears to be causing websites not to offer a Senior Railcard discount on such tickets for departures from Kew Bridge before 09:30!

Which websites are you looking at? In the absence of an Off-Peak Day Return (CDR) fare routed ✠ANY PERMITTED, I'd say it's the restrictions on the Off-Peak Return (SVR) fare that determine the availability of senior railcard discount at that time of the morning. This is how it's showing on TrainsCanBeCheaper.info (see attached).

 

[Haywain]

In fact, the Off-Peak ticket is unrestricted leaving London. The Super Off-Peak is the one that's restricted between 06:30 and 08:30 Mondays to Fridays (excluding public holidays).

As such, I'd say the Any Permitted Super Off-Peak (priced at £22.75 with Railcard discount) would be equally valid (and certainly would be with a London to Banbury ticket) but the existence of the "Not via London" Off-Peak Day Return (not valid before 09:30) appears to be causing websites not to offer a Senior

I hadn't spotted the fact that the ticket is completely unrestricted! However, while it is academic to the OP who was going to Banbury today, my suggestion of the Off Peak Return was based on this:

Depart in time to reach Banbury by about 9.30am

 

[alistairlees]

Which websites are you looking at? In the absence of an Off-Peak Day Return (CDR) fare routed ✠ANY PERMITTED, I'd say it's the restrictions on the Off-Peak Return (SVR) fare that determine the availability of senior railcard discount at that time of the morning. This is how it's showing on TrainsCanBeCheaper.info (see attached).
View attachment 55762

I think it's the Chiltern Railways website. And also National Rail. Both of these are selling a £34.50 fare for the 07.10 outward / 15.39 return tomorrow, with a senior railcard for one adult. In other words, no railcard discount. For route Any Permitted (which this is), I would have thought (as Indigo2 suggests) that it's the SVR that determines "morning peak time" (as it's called on the Senior Railcard website), as this is the least restricted Off-Peak ticket. And, as this ticket is completely unrestricted for outward travel, then I would have thought that means there is no "morning peak time" for this flow; so a Senior Railcard can be used to discount a ticket at any time.

Am I getting this wrong?