Long term social distancing: Impact on public life & public transport?

[Class 170101]

This sounds like the sensible thing to do. And a lockdown as the other poster has mentioned is quite simply out of the question. People will not respond to it in quite the same spirit as they have done this time. Indeed, just yesterday, the Culture Secretary Oliver Dowden spoke at the Press Conference and admitted that they expect compliance with any future lockdowns to be considerably less than this one and that's why they are trying to avoid this happening - they know it won't work again.

I think compliance with this lockdown has been generally less as its gone on but frankly if the death rate spikes like the current lockdown people will stay inside out of fear for the disease rather than any threat of fines the government could impose.

A lockdown this summer is unlikely and the scientists have said effective the diease should be less now, but come winter its bound to increase.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I think compliance with this lockdown has been generally less as its gone on but frankly if the death rate spikes like the current lockdown people will stay inside out of fear for the disease rather than any threat of fines the government could impose.

Some people will. I'd venture that certainly those under 30 mostly won't, because there is very near to no chance they will die of it.

 

[Class 170101]

Some people will. I'd venture that certainly those under 30 mostly won't, because there is very near to no chance they will die of it.

Unless they are in an at risk group, I also wonder if pubs, clubs etc will open quickly? Pritti Patel was on, was last weekend or the weekend before, and mentioned the crime rate was down and also hospital admissions especially on Friday and Saturday nights, I could imagine the police and the NHS having a view on that. That might keep some of the under 30s home too - nothing to do.

 

[Huntergreed]

Unless they are in an at risk group, I also wonder if pubs, clubs etc will open quickly? Pritti Patel was on, was last weekend or the weekend before, and mentioned the crime rate was down and also hospital admissions especially on Friday and Saturday nights, I could imagine the police and the NHS having a view on that. That might keep some of the under 30s home too - nothing to do.

I wouldn’t imagine pub/club owners and staff letting the government keep them shut just because it’s “a bit less trouble”, they’ll be reopened as soon as is practical, or it’ll cause unnecessary damage which is exactly what we’re trying to avoid right now.

 

[43066]

For question of what is allowed by legislation, see https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/what-travel-is-currently-allowed-by-the-legislation.204411/

The only journeys that people should be making right now - using any transport mode - are those journeys which allowed by the legislation.

Any journey that is allowed by legislation CAN be made by train but people are asked to walk or cycle wherever possible; that's not always practicable and therefore people who are able to travel by car are requested to do so, but anyone whose journey is only practicable by train is allowed to do so.

Any journey that is NOT allowed by the legislation cannot be made by ANY transport mode whatsoever.


The term "essential" is a misnomer; what is allowed is any journey that is permitted by the legislation.

What is encouraged is for people to cycle or walk if at all possible for their journey; people making longer journeys or who have mobility issues will not be able to walk or cycle and they are encouraged to travel by car if possible. But if that's not possible, the use of public transport is permitted.

As others have explained, it depends on your definition of "essential". If an individual feels that it's essential for the sake of their mental or physical health to make a train journey to the country or the seaside then that is very much permitted and, in my opinion, should be encouraged.

Unbelievably, the woman running through transport usage figures at today’s Downing St briefing again stated that trains and buses are to be used by key workers only.

That has never been the case. No wonder people are confused!

 

[yorksrob]

Unbelievably, the woman running through transport usage figures at today’s Downing St briefing again stated that trains and buses are to be used by key workers only.

No wonder people are confused.

That's the problem. Transport is a sort of afterthought, so they don't even bother to get their own message right.

 

[Bikeman78]

Why is it utterly pointless? Clearly people won't be able to double up when every bay is full.

What are they going to do then? By the time they have walked through a carriage or two and found all the permitted seats occupied, the doors will be shut and the train will be on the move.

 

[greyman42]

Exactly, and sooner or later the general public will realise this and I imagine won’t be too happy. They need to take action sooner rather than later otherwise it will be a case of financial discrimination against those who can’t afford a car or to learn to drive.

The government has been encouraging us for years to get rid of our cars and use public transport so it cannot seriously expect people to have the money to suddenly go out and buy a car.

 

[Bantamzen]

But even with a form of lockdown, lots of the economy/business ARE still continuing. Plenty of factories, warehouses, distribution firms are as busy as normal, if not busier. Inevitably, we're losing the hospitality, tourism & leisure industries, so there is a massive economic impact, but it's not as if the entire economy has closed down. I think the monthly "cost" of govt support and loss of tax revenue etc., will rapidly fall as each month passes, especially with the withdrawal of the furlough scheme - it's a massive wake up call for employers and employees to plan for the next phase.

We are currently talking about up to ten million people currently not working, with a further 2.1 million people now claiming Universal Credit. So a very large portion of the economy has closed down, and some of it may never recover.

 

[Bikeman78]

By the middle of june when the shops start opening up in the town centres and the kids go back to school there is going to be chaos on the buses and trains. i had to go into sheffield city centre last week and the bus had to stop picking up passengers due to the 18 passenger limit (in a normal peak hour bus queue where i live there can have that many people waiting so how they are going to cope i don't know)

Social distancing is incompatible with anything resembling normal life. Have a think about things you did pre virus. Most of them will be impossible or so tedious they are no longer worth doing.

 

[LAX54]

I don't agree. If that were the case, no country would have had issues with hospitals getting overwhelmed.

Hospitals get overwhelmed every year, last few years it has been Ambulances sitting outside Hospitals for 8+ hours ! Oh how we soon forget ! and there have been in this outbreak, Hospitals that have been like 'Ghost Towns' empty, and those phrases come from Nurses & Doctors !

 

[duncanp]

Unbelievably, the woman running through transport usage figures at today’s Downing St briefing again stated that trains and buses are to be used by key workers only.

This confirms my belief that decisions regarding public transport policy are made by those who do not use public transport themselves, and have very little idea of how it works.

 

[YorksDMU]

And yet, Northern are continuing with the Key Worker timetables....

https://www.northernrailway.co.uk/key-worker-timetables

 

[CaptainHaddock]

And yet, Northern are continuing with the Key Worker timetables....

https://www.northernrailway.co.uk/key-worker-timetables

True, but I would take this quote on that link to mean that leisure travel is still permitted;

"Though we continue to run services, the Government is advising that, if possible, you should avoid non-essential public transport. If your only option is to travel by train, try to avoid rush hour, vary your usual travel times to prevent crowding and follow instructions at the station and on board the train. "

 

[CaptainHaddock]

And yet, Northern are continuing with the Key Worker timetables....

https://www.northernrailway.co.uk/key-worker-timetables

It's very noticeable that the through trains from Sheffield to Brid and Scarborough still aren't running; instead there's a Sheffield-Hull service and a Hull-Scarborough one. In both directions one train arrives in Hull about a minute before the connection departs, making connections pretty much impossible. It's almost as if they deliberately want to stop people visiting the seaside!

 

[Antman]

Unbelievably, the woman running through transport usage figures at today’s Downing St briefing again stated that trains and buses are to be used by key workers only.

That has never been the case. No wonder people are confused!

What's unbelievable about it? With greatly reduced capacity for the foreseeable future why shouldn't key workers have priority? Or do you want empty supermarket shelves?

 

[Antman]

Social distancing is incompatible with anything resembling normal life. Have a think about things you did pre virus. Most of them will be impossible or so tedious they are no longer worth doing.

Nobody is saying it will be a bundle of laughs.......... but it's that or risk another wave of covid.

 

[Antman]

The government has been encouraging us for years to get rid of our cars and use public transport so it cannot seriously expect people to have the money to suddenly go out and buy a car.

Nobody could have possibly forseen the current situation.

 

[underbank]

The government has been encouraging us for years to get rid of our cars and use public transport so it cannot seriously expect people to have the money to suddenly go out and buy a car.

They may have been "encouraging" people to do that, but in reality, car usage/ownership has continued to increase due to public transport being pretty poor in many areas. Obviously, places like London and maybe a couple of other major cities are very different because of their good public transport systems.

 

[Andy Pacer]

It makes me wonder whether the government will ever formally change their guidance from 'essential travel only' or whether they will just let things gradually change. The problem with explicitly lifting that restriction is everyone jumping on the next bus or train they can!

 

[Butts]

What's unbelievable about it? With greatly reduced capacity for the foreseeable future why shouldn't key workers have priority? Or do you want empty supermarket shelves?

How many Key Workers are actually using the Train though ?

I get the 1725 Falkirk to Edinburgh and the 0619 Edinburgh to Falkirk back.

Both have 6 carriages and about the same number of passengers (on a good day).

Perhaps it is different in other parts of Scotland or the rest of the UK ?

 

[underbank]

This confirms my belief that decisions regarding public transport policy are made by those who do not use public transport themselves, and have very little idea of how it works.

Or more likely, policy made by London politicians who enjoy a pretty good public transport system but show no interest in how bad it is in most other places.

 

[yorksrob]

What's unbelievable about it? With greatly reduced capacity for the foreseeable future why shouldn't key workers have priority? Or do you want empty supermarket shelves?

There's a difference between key workers having priority and having exclusive use of the transport system.

Plus, the advice has always been that you should go to work if you can't work from home. How are those non-key workers who don't drive supposed to get to work ?

 

[Andy Pacer]

There's a difference between key workers having priority and having exclusive use of the transport system.

Plus, the advice has always been that you should go to work if you can't work from home. How are those non-key workers who don't drive supposed to get to work ?

It's not sustainable to effectively ban people indefinitely. 'Public' Transport.

 

[nedchester]

What's unbelievable about it? With greatly reduced capacity for the foreseeable future why shouldn't key workers have priority? Or do you want empty supermarket shelves?

But if 'non' key-workers' cannot get to work they could potentially become unemployed. Just because you are not a key worker doesn't mean you should be denied access to trasport to work with the risk of losing your job, livelihood ability to pay mortgage and feed your family.

Therefore, transport is going to have to go to 'social distancing where possible'.

 

[Andy Pacer]

But if 'non' key-workers' cannot get to work they could potentially become unemployed. Just because you are not a key worker doesn't mean you should be denied access to trasport to work with the risk of losing your job, livelihood ability to pay mortgage and feed your family.

Therefore, transport is going to have to go to 'social distancing where possible'.

Or the government will have to step in (in terms of buses) to provide subsidies to operators to provide more capacity.

 

[CaptainHaddock]

Nobody is saying it will be a bundle of laughs.......... but it's that or risk another wave of covid.

I think most of us will take risking another wave of covid. We can't stay in lockdown forever, nor can we ever be 100% safe from viruses so let's just get out there and take our chances!

 

[Antman]

There's a difference between key workers having priority and having exclusive use of the transport system.

Plus, the advice has always been that you should go to work if you can't work from home. How are those non-key workers who don't drive supposed to get to work ?

I assume the exclusive use bit applies to peak hours, obviously some people have to use public transport for shopping, medical appointments etc. I think the message is basically don't use public transport unless you have to, I know it goes against everything that we've been told in the past but such is the unprecedented situation that we're currently in.

 

[yorksrob]

I assume the exclusive use bit applies to peak hours, obviously some people have to use public transport for shopping, medical appointments etc. I think the message is basically don't use public transport unless you have to, I know it goes against everything that we've been told in the past but such is the unprecedented situation that we're currently in.

According to the poster on here, there was no such qualification in the broadcast.

Infact I don't even think there's been any explicit mention of people being allowed to use public transport in the other circumstances you mention.

This is a big part of the problem. It's just not good enough, relying on people to assume things.

 

[Butts]

According to the poster on here, there was no such qualification in the broadcast.

Infact I don't even think there's been any explicit mention of people being allowed to use public transport in the other circumstances you mention.

This is a big part of the problem. It's just not good enough, relying on people to assume things.

No one is going to check whether you are a Key Worker or not, in 8 weeks I've never been asked for my letter.

On Scotrail the Guards are rarely seen.

Once again can I emphasise the Trains are emptier than the majority of bus services I have seen in Scotland.