Lothian Buses and ECB Discussion

[ScotRail158725]

I think it looks quite good myself, alot cleaner with the extra white.

extra white? only difference is no depot codes and the gold stripe along the skirt panels

 

[CN04NRJ]

extra white? only difference is no depot codes and the gold stripe along the skirt panels

Nevermind, I'm imagining things lol!

 

[ScotRail158725]

Nevermind, I'm imagining things lol!

fair enough ahah

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

With many buses running empty, I wonder if Lothian will reduce frequency again on some routes from 30 minutes to 45 minutes, as I can take a guess some are not picking up anyone on a single run. Or could Lothian cut even more routes and maybe extend others? 3 & 33 copy each other on a large portion so 33 to go?

 

[scotrail158713]

With many buses running empty, I wonder if Lothian will reduce frequency again on some routes from 30 minutes to 45 minutes, as I can take a guess some are not picking up anyone on a single run. Or could Lothian cut even more routes and maybe extend others? 3 & 33 copy each other on a large portion so 33 to go?

I wouldn’t be surprised tbh. I can’t remember the last time I saw a bus with more than 1 passenger on board.

 

[overthewater]

Bar the ERI and the supermarkets, is there actually any essential places within Edinburgh?

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

Not really OTW. Supermarkts are also fairly local so most people could walk to them, and hospitals RIE, WGH, Sick Kids, plus pharmacys which are usually local to people anyway. Most fire fighters will drive in to work too.

Thinknig though again about the 33 and 3. 33 goes to RIE, the 3 does not, so maybe extend the 33 to Gorebridge and axe the 3 for a while could be an option?

 

[overthewater]

Other places around scotland still has Essential place, like factory or call centres. So it's a hard call to get it right.

 

[ScotRail158725]

Not really OTW. Supermarkts are also fairly local so most people could walk to them, and hospitals RIE, WGH, Sick Kids, plus pharmacys which are usually local to people anyway. Most fire fighters will drive in to work too.

Thinknig though again about the 33 and 3. 33 goes to RIE, the 3 does not, so maybe extend the 33 to Gorebridge and axe the 3 for a while could be an option?

think about it the 33 extending to gorebridge could basically replace the 48. and you have the 29 covering gilmerton road

 

[oldman]

Actually there are still people working. Some schools operating, care homes, doctors surgeries have people in them, hardware stores, railways, utilities, council resilience centres, postmen, refuse collection etc. And quite a lot of offices. Obviously most people are driving.

On Monday in about half an hour walking through the Morningside and Oxgangs area I counted 12 people on buses or waiting at stops. Some shoppers but it can be hard in the hilly areas to get to the shops otherwise.

 

[scotrail158713]

think about it the 33 extending to gorebridge could basically replace the 48. and you have the 29 covering gilmerton road

This would definitely make sense

 

[OmniCity999]

With many buses running empty, I wonder if Lothian will reduce frequency again on some routes from 30 minutes to 45 minutes, as I can take a guess some are not picking up anyone on a single run. Or could Lothian cut even more routes and maybe extend others? 3 & 33 copy each other on a large portion so 33 to go?

It's important to remember we're not running buses rent running for profit during this time.

The routes that are running are those running to or past key worker centres, i.e Hospitals/Hospices, Care Homes, Shops and schools (those that are open for key workers children), buses, refuse, council workers and key maintenance staff - the city is still alive. Other routes running are feeder routes to bring people in from further out, your 26's, 31's, 37's, ECB and LCB. Alot of people from further out work in the city.

These serves HAVE TO run. As such, most are being funded or part funded.

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

I do understand that Omni but when they are running empty, it just makes me wonder if it could happen, esp when this is going to last for many months. Also, with the 3, it's also supported by the 30, 33 (if extended) and 29 meaning if it were removed (with 49), you'd still have buses in those areas.

I did not know they were all being funded though, which makes a difference. Fuel is cheaper now but it still costs to run them empty all day.

 

[OmniCity999]

I do understand that Omni but when they are running empty, it just makes me wonder if it could happen, esp when this is going to last for many months. Also, with the 3, it's also supported by the 30, 33 (if extended) and 29 meaning if it were removed (with 49), you'd still have buses in those areas.

I did not know they were all being funded though, which makes a difference. Fuel is cheaper now but it still costs to run them empty all day.

The services that are running are doing so for a reason. If they weren't seen as essential, we wouldnt run them. We can afford to do what we're doing. The rate in which we're running is there for a reason, if you're concerned about it speak to the company, but I dont see why you should be concerned as what we're running is required. Especially in terms of shift starts etc for key workers.

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

I did not say I was concerned not suggest I was, just questoning if it could happen.

 

[Lothianbus703]

am i the only person that thinks the e400XLBs are a waste of time and lothian keep going on about them .

 

[scosutsut]

I guess the problem with changing routes you've got to plan it, reschedule drivers, issue briefings, reschedule all your vehicle movements and then figure out how your going to get proper word out there to the users, and then again when you back it all out again.

Sometimes you chase a benefit too small to justify the associated effort, and a quick win becomes, if you excuse the expression, a complete ball ache.

 

[ScotRail158725]

am i the only person that thinks the e400XLBs are a waste of time and lothian keep going on about them .

i can partially agree. i think they have been going on about them way too much for what they do. they should’ve put the XLBs on the main out of City routes (3/26/31/37) and even at that they still would be a waste off peak even at that i reckon standard length whatever chasis they’d be on would be better. also think they shouldn’t have got a Volvo/ADL product and just bought some standard E400 MMCs instead

 

[SpeedbirdA350]

I think the B8L has its place in the fleet lineup but since they are all based at central, it rules out using it on routes more suited such as 3, 26, 44 etc.. as in peak they are busy as heck. As for waste at off peak, you could argue that about any decker sometimes. Cost wise is not a question really.

There is an order in with ADL for some regular length (singles and deckers) MMCs anyway plus I think more B8Ls (perhaps Omni can confirm that?) which I heard were for Longstone. Although that order will be very much delayed until after COVID-19 has gone so probably 2021 now.

 

[CN04NRJ]

I do understand that Omni but when they are running empty, it just makes me wonder if it could happen, esp when this is going to last for many months. Also, with the 3, it's also supported by the 30, 33 (if extended) and 29 meaning if it were removed (with 49), you'd still have buses in those areas.

I did not know they were all being funded though, which makes a difference. Fuel is cheaper now but it still costs to run them empty all day.

I've been doing 38s and 30s this week and they certainly haven't been empty. From the other buses I've seen I'd say the service level is about right.

 

[Jordan Adam]

am i the only person that thinks the e400XLBs are a waste of time and lothian keep going on about them .

I wouldn't call them a waste, but at a financial perspective it probably wasn't the best idea to buy so many of them in such a short time frame. When it comes to selling them they're probably going to struggle as many smaller firms will be put off them due to their size (Stagecoach had the same issue with the 15M Panthers). I can already envision someone replying to this comment pointing out that many firms have bought Tri-Axle buses off second hand in the past (Ex-HK Olympians, Dublin E500s etc) however what you need to remember is that these are 140CM+ shorter and around the same size as a standard single decker, the lack of steering tag and rear door would probably be a put off too. I think if we're going to talk of wasted investment then the Plaxton Leopards or Wright Streetairs are probably a far better example.

I can't really complain about Lothian banging on about them as when you have something new or different you are going to market it however to the average passenger minus the second door they're not all that different to the Geminis Lothian were buying in previous years. The pedant in me also gets triggered every time i see a media article bragging on about the "Monster 100 seater buses" as in reality they only seat 99!

I'm am surprised though Lothian never bought any singles or shorter deckers to go along side them.

It's important to remember we're not running buses rent running for profit during this time.

The routes that are running are those running to or past key worker centres, i.e Hospitals/Hospices, Care Homes, Shops and schools (those that are open for key workers children), buses, refuse, council workers and key maintenance staff - the city is still alive. Other routes running are feeder routes to bring people in from further out, your 26's, 31's, 37's, ECB and LCB. Alot of people from further out work in the city.

These serves HAVE TO run. As such, most are being funded or part funded.

Thank you for posting this, i think what many on here (and other threads) forget is that the services being run are not being run to make money, but are being run to maintain as best a service possible for those who need it. All operators deserve credit for the way they've handled this pandemic and for keeping as best a service going as possible with the funding provided.

I do see Lothian making more cuts, but probably not to the same extent others have mentioned.

 

[ScotRail158725]

When it comes to selling them they're probably going to struggle as many smaller firms will be put off them due to their size

ive always thought of this. the only real buyer for a the XLBs would be another large city operator but the chances of them buying something 15/16 years old is very slim to none. however another product that could be tricky to sell is the new fuel powered buses such as Hydrogen & Electric powered buses but to keep this lothian related even the B5LHs as smaller companies dont have the money nor the infrastructure to maintain vehicles of the sort

 

[Lothianbus703]

Yeah but its sad how the gemenis are being replaced by them and does anybody have a clue when the Gemeni/B9TL buses will be withdrawn (i mean buses like 826)

 

[Jordan Adam]

ive always thought of this. the only real buyer for a the XLBs would be another large city operator but the chances of them buying something 15/16 years old is very slim to none. however another product that could be tricky to sell is the new fuel powered buses such as Hydrogen & Electric powered buses but to keep this lothian related even the B5LHs as smaller companies dont have the money nor the infrastructure to maintain vehicles of the sort

Deckers tend to do well with independents that have school work or regular even hires, however as i say i suspect the main issue with the XLBs would be their length as many school runs go up tight residential streets which aren't an issue for a 12M Olympian or 12M Ex-Dublin Enviro500, however the XLBs are 13.4M so quite significantly longer, also with school duties it's fairly rare that you'd have a contract that needs 100 seats, they tend to be 50-70 seats, 90 at most. I suspect with Hydrogen/Electric buses it'll probably be more likely that the original operator will keep them until the end of their lives, so resale isn't a huge concern at the moment, hopefully with technical advancements Electric/Hydrogen vehicles can be brought on par with Diesel, certainly in my view (i sound like a broken record ) Hydrogen is and will be the future.

 

[BobScott]

Why the sudden intense interest in selling XLBs? They’re barely a year old and good for ten years or more.

 

[Jordan Adam]

Why the sudden intense interest in selling XLBs? They’re barely a year old and good for ten years or more.

There's not, we were talking further down the line.

 

[ScotRail158725]

Yeah but its sad how the gemenis are being replaced by them and does anybody have a clue when the Gemeni/B9TL buses will be withdrawn (i mean buses like 826)

the remaining 30ish B7s need to go so those wont be going possibly until into 2021 depending how long this pandemic goes on so id estimate the first B9s going until mid next year

 

[scosutsut]

The oldest B9s are from what 2007(?) so I'd imagine the target would be to get them gone by 15 years old so 2022, but that was before Corona - that may change things for years to come across every industry, let alone within Lothian.

When they were treated to FOTF (which imo does not sit on the original fronted ones at all) you knew they had a good few years left in them.

 

[scotrail158713]

Does anyone know if the Airlink 100 is still running? Surely it can’t be getting many passengers with the airport seeing 8 departures all day yesterday.

 

[CN04NRJ]

Does anyone know if the Airlink 100 is still running? Surely it can’t be getting many passengers with the airport seeing 8 departures all day yesterday.

Yes, three buses on it.