Major incident: Train derailed 23 Jan 13 in Manchester

[Manchester77]

According to a man on BBC NWT 'the damage is cosmetic and they're planning on re railing it' I didn't hear any mention of anything taking it away

Aw I hope this doesn't kill West Coast Railways

 

[E&W Lucas]

There are many possibilities for the derailment and fire and the truth will out in good time, I have got my own opinion as to the cause but it is just my opinion and so not relevant to this incident, I wonder how close I am though as I am normally pretty good at these!

Removed

 

[gimmea50anyday]

According to a man on BBC NWT 'the damage is cosmetic and they're planning on re railing it' I didn't hear any mention of anything taking it away

Well there's still a 47 at the other end, amateur footage of loco burning you could clearly hear the other loco ticking over.

Depends on nature of damage. Might have to recover by road if wheel sets are knackered

 

[455driver]

And I suspect that your mind is working in a similar way to mine......

If ts similar to a certain 86 a few years ago then yes.

 

[TDK]

That rear loco has a tail lamp that could mean it was being dead hauled the batteries SHOULD be out with the loco being dead hauled. It is too early to speculate however my opinion and only mine it seems like it amy well have been a Battery fire as diesel needs to be vapourised before it catches alight, the investigation will reveal all most likely. Sad day for WC railways and the industry as a whole, thankfully all the crew are safe. Just to add it never ceases to amaze me that some want to know the number of the loco before asking whether there are any injuries!!!!!!

 

[E&W Lucas]

If ts similar to a certain 86 a few years ago then yes.

Removed

 

[455driver]

Is there anybody in the world you have respect for except train drivers? :roll:

Yeah anyone that does their job to the best of their ability, 3 fire engines and one bloke with a hose squirting water close to the loco without really getting at the fire doesnt cut it with me, I am sure they will quote chapter and verse of "health and safety" about why they couldnt get any closer etc but it is a wee wee poor show from my view point.

It may surprise you to know that I actually have a "can do" attitude towards things and have had several "discussions" with control when they say it cant be done and I ask "why" and get a bullish answer in return I tend to get a bit arsey with them.

If that was your house burning down with all your personal effects (kids photos etc) would you be happy watching one bloke waft a bit of water in the fires direction while everyone else just stood around watching?

No, didnt think so, but then its only a loco isnt it so it doesnt matter.

The few times I have had dealings with trumpton at work they have strutted around full of their own self importance and just stopped the job for hours for no good reason and wouldnt listen to any of the rail managers telling them the incident was finished until they had "damped down" the over-heating part of the train for 90 minutes, it wasnt even on fire at the beginning never mind the end. So no I dont have a very high opinion of the fire service and have several foam and CO2 extinguishers in my house and car and would deal with it myself rather than let them anywhere near it.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

News reports suggest an explosion, so the suggestion it was the batteries is plausible, but if the engine was ticking over then engine failure is also a possibility. however a loco running at the rear of a train must either be attended or some sort of remote control over fire warning and protection systems, as a dvt does, so can't see the loco running somehow.

must have been one hell of a bang to cause the loco to derail, that I have trouble understanding. I have known derailments to cause a fire but never a fire to cause a derailment.

 

[455driver]

Maybe it was the loco derailing that caused the bang?

100 tonne of loco hitting the deck is going to cause quite a bit of noise.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Just a thought 455 driver but is there a possibility of a misunderstanding of communication here would explain why there was only one guy who looked as tho he was taking a leak? There is OHLE in the area but its only partially complete so they may have played cautious until they could verify wether it was live or not. After all, 25kv does make your hair stand on end and smoke a hell of a lot more than the juice rail might do!

 

[455driver]

They wouldnt even go near the track if they thought the overheads were live, quite rightly.

 

[E&W Lucas]

News reports suggest an explosion, so the suggestion it was the batteries is plausible, but if the engine was ticking over then engine failure is also a possibility. however a loco running at the rear of a train must either be attended or some sort of remote control over fire warning and protection systems, as a dvt does, so can't see the loco running somehow.

must have been one hell of a bang to cause the loco to derail, that I have trouble understanding. I have known derailments to cause a fire but never a fire to cause a derailment.

Removed

 

[northwichcat]

Did anyone see the BBC North West Tonight report on this?

"We know the train was travelling between Ardwick and Carnforth. We have no idea why."

Maybe because the train belongs to a company based in Carnforth?

"We know it is a passenger train as there are tables with lights on them"

Maybe the windows and seats are better clues?

 

[ilkestonian]

You're looking too deep...... think simple, very simple.....

Seized axle?

Breaks, derails, overheats, combusts?

 

[gimmea50anyday]

You're looking too deep...... think simple, very simple.....

Can't help it. Accident investigation is a big interest of mine. Would love to leave my current tail lamp role and makes career out of it!

 

[high camera]

http://www.wishfm.net/news/local/train-was-old-fashioned-passenger-steam-train/

 

[Ferret]

Jcollins, it's the BBC - their journalism is frankly beneath contempt sometimes, and I really hope you aren't surprised by the poor standards you've just highlighted. It's sad really, but the BBC is no longer a good example to the rest.

 

[507 001]

Did anyone see the BBC North West Tonight report on this?

"We know the train was travelling between Ardwick and Carnforth. We have no idea why."

Maybe because the train belongs to a company based in Carnforth?

"We know it is a passenger train as there are tables with lights on them"

Maybe the windows and seats are better clues?

I noticed that, thought it was quite lazy to be honest, a quick google would have given them the details they needed

 

[high camera]

:roll:The travel chaos continues further as all trams on the Metrolink Eccles, Altrincham and South Manchester lines are suspended after a failed tram at Deansgate

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Yeah anyone that does their job to the best of their ability, 3 fire engines and one bloke with a hose squirting water close to the loco without really getting at the fire doesnt cut it with me.

If someone had been criticising the train driver then I'm sure you would have jumped in with the "if you haven't done the job you can't criticise" comments (as you have done before). Talk about pot, kettle and black.

 

[calc7]

At Manchester Piccadilly, passengers for "Scotland" were being told to go to York and take a service from there. I know services through Warrington were running with delays, but is that because they don't want to tell people to walk from Central to Bank Quay? It's a heck of a long diversion to Glasgow.

 

[455driver]

If someone had been criticising the train driver then I'm sure you would have jumped in with the "if you haven't done the job you can't criticise" comments (as you have done before). Talk about pot, kettle and black.

So you consider one bloke wafting a bit of water in the general direction a suitable response to the incident do you?

If I thought the driver had been speeding (I dont) I would be the first to call him an idiot, incidentally cant wait for the RAIB report on the Stafford SPAD, that is going to be hilarious and disturbing all at the same time.

I dont have a problem with people asking questions (if you bothered to check I have answered several recently and loads over my membership here) but what I do have a problem with is people who have never done the job AND have a very limited knowledge on the subject stating things as fact (using the Brighton shunter to rescue the failure is one) and then going off on one when they are corrected, we cannot just ignore rules when it suits no matter how inconvenient they are. Now if they had asked it as a question I would have answered it as such but when they post it as fact I will shoot it down as the misinformed rubbish it is.

Anyway aint you got a preserved line to get ready?

 

[high camera]

http://www.itv.com/news/granada/story/2013-01-23/train-derails-in-manchester/#four-fire-engines-tackle-train-blaze_150705

Apologies ITV not ITN

 

[Ferret]

incidentally cant wait for the RAIB report on the Stafford SPAD, that is going to be hilarious and disturbing all at the same time.

As if the existing internal report wasn't bad enough (I presume you've viewed it!).

As for the Fire Service's response, I'd be inclined to trust them - much as I'd trust you driving a 455!

 

[PR1Berske]

At Manchester Piccadilly, passengers for "Scotland" were being told to go to York and take a service from there. I know services through Warrington were running with delays, but is that because they don't want to tell people to walk from Central to Bank Quay? It's a heck of a long diversion to Glasgow.

A friend of mine works in Salford. He tweeted that he had been sent to Warrington to get back to Preston. How or why this has been proposed is unknown by me but it's certainly a diversion which is under way....

 

[455driver]

As if the existing internal report wasn't bad enough (I presume you've viewed it!).

Hell yeah, I was in stitches and cringing all at the same time reading it, the only thing missing was the "once upon a time" at the beginning.

As for the Fire Service's response, I'd be inclined to trust them - much as I'd trust you driving a 455!

It doesnt look good though does it, one bloke wafting the water around while everyone else looks to be on PNB.

As for the 455 driving, you are very trusting arent you!

 

[Ferret]

Hell yeah, I was in stitches and cringing all at the same time reading it, the only thing missing was the "once upon a time" at the beginning.

I was and still am livid about that report. Cowboys like that have no place on our railway - I'm sure my parents and other loved ones would be utterly chuffed if I was injured or worse as a result of the actions of the persons involved while on duty.

It doesnt look good though does it, one bloke wafting the water around while everyone else looks to be on PNB.

You can say that about us though. How often do we 'not look good', even though we're doing what we should be?

As for the 455 driving, you are very trusting arent you!

Yeah! But you'd be taken off the job if you were c*** at it!

 

[gimmea50anyday]

A friend of mine works in Salford. He tweeted that he had been sent to Warrington to get back to Preston. How or why this has been proposed is unknown by me but it's certainly a diversion which is under way....

Trains run from Warrington bank quay to Preston. It does however require a walk from Warrington central. Of course there is a service from Manchester Victoria...

 

[snail]

Trains run from Warrington bank quay to Preston. It does however require a walk from Warrington central. Of course there is a service from Manchester Victoria...

There are no direct services from Victoria but there is an hourly North Wales service direct to Bank Quay from Piccadilly.

 

[Manchester77]

:roll:The travel chaos continues further as all trams on the Metrolink Eccles, Altrincham and South Manchester lines are suspended after a failed tram at Deansgate

They're not. They haven't been for a long while there just severe delays. SML, ECC, MCU and ALT line services are all running and it wasn't a failed tram

3045 lost power on the ramp. The pantograph went down which only happens during power issues so it was an infrastructure issue