Marston Vale 150s

[A0wen]

Unless I'm not paying attention properly - looks like the Marston Vale line only has 150s running on it today - no dogbox.

Anyone know why?

 

[PHILIPE]

Unless I'm not paying attention properly - looks like the Marston Vale line only has 150s running on it today - no dogbox.

Anyone know why?

Perhaps there was no 153 available to change over on Sunday. That would be the logical explanation although could be something else.

 

[DarloRich]

Double 2 car chug action on the Marston Vale as the 153's are away for a few weeks - punctuality has gone through the roof!

 

[PHILIPE]

Double 2 car chug action on the Marston Vale as the 153's are away for a few weeks - punctuality has gone through the roof!

Out of curiosity, where have the 153s gone ?

 

[keithheller18]

The remaining 153's that LM have on the books are falling apart. Years of keeping them going with sticky tape have caught up with Tyseley. In May the 150's are supposed to be going to Northern with 153's taking over the Bedford's. Dont ask how or why. Nobody knows what the diagrams are. But since the 153 had a prang with the car on Marston level crossing last month. Another problem arose. A serious shortage of spare parts. Including a snow plough that was needed to replace the damaged one.

 

[MK Tom]

There are peak workings on the Marston Vale for which a two-car unit is needed and it's a well known fact on here that 2x153 or any 23m 2-car unit won't fit in the platforms / signals at some of the stations on the line.

Frankly I'd rather LM took on a couple of pacers to run this line than tried to run it with just the 153s.

 

[185143]

There are peak workings on the Marston Vale for which a two-car unit is needed and it's a well known fact on here that 2x153 or any 23m 2-car unit won't fit in the platforms / signals at some of the stations on the line.

Frankly I'd rather LM took on a couple of pacers to run this line than tried to run it with just the 153s.

You can have 144012 off us!

 

[HLE]

They just get nosebleeds when they work down south. Seem fine up this way.

Although the frequent stop-start nature of the Marston Vale can't do them much good

 

[Bletchleyite]

I believe running a three-unit service with 153s is being considered. That might actually improve reliability, as I doubt they would run a three-unit service all day, just "peak extras" at busy times, so at some times of day there will be a spare.

 

[DarloRich]

Out of curiosity, where have the 153s gone ?

Spain for a fortnight

I think there is an issue with units stopped for repairs and a lack of available parts for those repairs. In any event the LM 153's are falling apart.

There was also the fatal level crossing crash which took one of the units out of service.

I believe running a three-unit service with 153s is being considered. That might actually improve reliability, as I doubt they would run a three-unit service all day, just "peak extras" at busy times, so at some times of day there will be a spare.

it might but wont address one of the key issues: bikes. They really slow down loading an unloading because of the narrow doors/vestibules.

it also wont make the schools service very easy to run!

 

[Bletchleyite]

it also wont make the schools service very easy to run!

It might work depending on precisely how the services are timed. If it was half-hourly it probably wouldn't work, as they'd all cram on rather than wait half an hour, but if they timed it so the extra train was quite closely timed with the clockface one it probably would, as there's more than one school in Bedford and they will be slightly different walking distances from the station.

In my days in Ormskirk there was heavy use of the northern end of the Merseyrail Northern Line for schools traffic, and with a 15 minute frequency you tended to find there was a split between the train arriving in Ormskirk at about 0815 mainly carrying passengers for Cross Hall School (about 20-25 minutes walk from the station), and the one arriving at about 0830 which mainly carried passengers for Ormskirk Grammar which was only about 10 minutes walk from the station. I'd imagine you could replicate that for Bedford in some way.

Mind you, is there an actual issue with running 2x23m if what was used had SDO? Could they use a couple of 170s, if they do (do they?)

 

[westcoaster]

It might work depending on precisely how the services are timed. If it was half-hourly it probably wouldn't work, as they'd all cram on rather than wait half an hour, but if they timed it so the extra train was quite closely timed with the clockface one it probably would, as there's more than one school in Bedford and they will be slightly different walking distances from the station.

It would not work at the Bedford end due to the single line from St John's through to midland station. That would leave ons sitting for 20 odd minutes at the beginning of the single line section. Plus everyone always goes for the last train to get them to school in time so you would shift the load onto the extra service.

 

[HLE]

For the short platforms why not introduce local door only? It works well in other parts of the country

 

[Bletchleyite]

For the short platforms why not introduce local door only? It works well in other parts of the country

Isn't one of the issues related to a 2x23m unit hanging over a level crossing at at least one station?

 

[pemma]

Out of curiosity, where have the 153s gone ?

The dog kennels were full so they borrowed some dog boxes off LM

 

[railfan100]

The remaining 153's that LM have on the books are falling apart. Years of keeping them going with sticky tape have caught up with Tyseley. In May the 150's are supposed to be going to Northern with 153's taking over the Bedford's. Dont ask how or why. Nobody knows what the diagrams are. But since the 153 had a prang with the car on Marston level crossing last month. Another problem arose. A serious shortage of spare parts. Including a snow plough that was needed to replace the damaged one.

Some of the 150's are quite rotten lots of corrosion issues all over the place. Load bearing areas are also quite rotten on a number of them. All of the 15x units are older than what was considered their design life at the time of construction.

 

[MML]

Due to a fault on a train between Bletchley and Bedford fewer trains are able to run.
Impact:
Train services running through these stations will be cancelled. Disruption is expected until 21:40 01/03.
Customer Advice:
1826 departure from Bedford.
1x 16 seater - calling all stations - Premier Mini Bus
1x 32 seater - semi fast service - Premier Mini Bus
Due to the nature of the issue with the faulty train, road transport will also replace the 2001 dep. from Bletchley and the 2055 dep. from Bedford.

The sooner they have 3 units working this line the better. :roll:

 

[DarloRich]

Chug 2 has lost electrics.

This morning we have 2 x 153 working on the branch. We won't get 3 x units allocated down here any time soon.

 

[DasLunatic]

They just get nosebleeds when they work down south. Seem fine up this way.

Although the frequent stop-start nature of the Marston Vale can't do them much good

I hate to play "pedant", but how do they survive in the Welsh Valleys and Devon/Cornwall, then?

 

[DarloRich]

I hate to play "pedant", but how do they survive in the Welsh Valleys and Devon/Cornwall, then?

indeed!

However distance form depot/servicing centre must be a part of the problem. The chugs are out based at Bletchley for a week at a time but without any real maintenance support beyond the fitter on site.

 

[HLE]

Chug 2 has lost electrics.

This morning we have 2 x 153 working on the branch. We won't get 3 x units allocated down here any time soon.

So all 3 150's are out of service?!

 

[DarloRich]

So all 3 150's are out of service?!

don't know - the one we have allocated to the Vale this week is dumped in the carriage sidings. I assume it is easier to send down another 153

 

[HLE]

I hate to play "pedant", but how do they survive in the Welsh Valleys and Devon/Cornwall, then?

Not being overly familiar with those routes you mention I cannot comment, however the Bedford-Bletchley route is practically the diesel version of the cross city line. Stops literally every two minutes. Let's not forget these units are 30 years old.

 

[DarloRich]

Not being overly familiar with those routes you mention I cannot comment, however the Bedford-Bletchley route is practically the diesel version of the cross city line. Stops literally every two minutes. Let's not forget these units are 30 years old.

the stress cant be that high - the speed is low and the journey takes a long time. It is a typical rural route.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Chug 2 has lost electrics.

This morning we have 2 x 153 working on the branch. We won't get 3 x units allocated down here any time soon.

3x153 is a genuine option. 2x153 is inadequate for the school trains.

If they kept with hourly but added a couple of flighted peak extras for the school traffic that would mean a "spare" with only the peak extras cancelled in the event of a breakdown. Would actually be quite an improvement.

 

[DarloRich]

3x153 is a genuine option. 2x153 is inadequate for the school trains.

If they kept with hourly but added a couple of flighted peak extras for the school traffic that would mean a "spare" with only the peak extras cancelled in the event of a breakdown. Would actually be quite an improvement.

it would be but may required infrastructure upgrades ( signal sections etc) and a will form LM to do so. They don't have long left on their franchise.

 

[Bletchleyite]

it would be but may required infrastructure upgrades ( signal sections etc) and a will form LM to do so. They don't have long left on their franchise.

Isn't the loss of the 150s (barring them being broken) for the next franchise anyway?

Adding a third unit for a couple of peak extras would not require signalling changes, though they wouldn't be able to be flighted very close together. That said, 15-20 minutes apart should be viable even with the Bedford single line section, and certainly when I went to school by train on Merseyrail the traffic in both directions was split between three trains - not totally evenly, but enough to make 153s adequate. Some kids liked to arrive early and chat with their mates before school, some to leave late and do the same, others just to cut it fine. I tended to take the middle one both ways.

 

[DarloRich]

Isn't the loss of the 150s (barring them being broken) for the next franchise anyway?

Adding a third unit for a couple of peak extras would not require signalling changes, though they wouldn't be able to be flighted very close together. That said, 15-20 minutes apart should be viable even with the Bedford single line section, and certainly when I went to school by train on Merseyrail the traffic in both directions was split between three trains - not totally evenly, but enough to make 153s adequate. Some kids liked to arrive early and chat with their mates before school, some to leave late and do the same, others just to cut it fine. I tended to take the middle one both ways.

if we ever go to three trains an hour on the branch we will need re signalling. The limiting factor is the two single line sections at each end. It shouldn't be too hard to sort out but does require the will to do so.

 

[Bletchleyite]

if we ever go to three trains an hour on the branch we will need re signalling.

3 trains an hour? Not really. I'm talking about flighting - running the standard hourly timetable but peak extras, which would be timed such that they work with the existing single line sections.

 

[MML]

Just out of interest, what are the 'peak' traffic flows on the Marston Vale ?

Morning - to Bedford schools ?
Late afternoon - from Bedford schools ?
and is there a significant flow at shift change at the Amazon warehouse at Ridgemont ?