Media picks up on transport disparity between London and "the North"

Killingworth

Established Member
Joined
30 May 2018
Messages
2,195
Location
Sheffield
This paragraph is saying that Crossrail in the South has new trains but they are very slow to enter service. New trains are also coming in the North but they are also very slow to enter service. I don't think it works to use that as an example of how the North is (allegedly) hard done by.
Maybe not, but it's galling to see pictures of all those new electric units lined up unused for what will be years while we're desperate for any more wires and new stock up north
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Killingworth

Established Member
Joined
30 May 2018
Messages
2,195
Location
Sheffield
Manchester to Leeds is much more likely. Same mileage, more potential for traffic.
More likely but as the crow flies the centres of Leeds and Manchester are over 35 miles apart. Manchester and Sheffield are 32. The crow would fly 29 miles direct from Leeds to Sheffield in this northern triangle.

The Leeds to Manchester route is the favourite because there are other built up areas it would also serve although that means more twists and turns to thread through and around old infrastructure and any stops will delay end to end journey times. A 30 minute aspiration will be hard to achieve.

Compare that with Sheffield-Manchester. No setlements near the straight line to be served. Direct, level route would be all underground avoiding, once built, environmental conflicts through the Peak District and in built up areas.

The reason current routes aren't used anywhere is due to levels of current services, and perceptions of distance. Make it 20 minutes from city centre to city centre and it's very different.

However I've no expectation that this idea will get taken forward. The cost would be enormous, although I'd contend that the long term benefits would be a rebalancing of the Northern economy. But we'll be arguing about the details of Leeds-Manchester electrification and services for at least another decade and the final result will remain a hybrid old /new mix of lines and infrastructure woven between intermediate built up areas.

However the North /South divide is nothing to the rivalries within the North! Rivalries that thrive on competing transport schemes, and have done for centuries.

Of course a city centre to city centre journey time of 20-30 minutes is little benefit to me when it might take that long to get to the city centre to start my journey to improve on the 50 minutes it takes me now.
 

ainsworth74

Forum Staff
Staff Member
Global Moderator
Joined
16 Nov 2009
Messages
22,153
Location
Redcar
So, this thread started to go in a couple of interesting, but very off-topic directions. The discussion around cycling and it's role in transport can now be found here whilst the discussion around ENCTS passes and their "abuse" and funding issues can be found here. Please continue those topic on the new threads.

As a general reminder to everyone we do ask that people keep, as much as possible, to the topic of a thread without wandering too far off-topic. If you do see something that you would like to reply to but is off-topic then feel free to start a new thread with a link back to the thread that prompted your response. You can even hit the reply button on the post you want to respond to, copy the text that is generated in the reply box, then start a new thread and paste that text into the post box and when you start your thread a quote will appear of the post you wanted to respond to even though it's in a different thread!

The Forum, thankfully, has no restrictions on the size of our database or the amount of traffic (within reason :lol:) that we can handle. So use it! Start new threads! You're not going to send the Forum into meltdown or bankrupt us!!


*gets down from soap box*
 

DynamicSpirit

Established Member
Joined
12 Apr 2012
Messages
4,707
Maybe not, but it's galling to see pictures of all those new electric units lined up unused for what will be years while we're desperate for any more wires and new stock up north
Oh believe me, it's just as galling for people living along the route in London to see the new trains sitting there unused where a year ago we were being told that they'd be up and running in December 2018. You should see the comments residents were posting in social media when news of the delay suddenly emerged.

In reality of course, Crossrail is coming, just as those desperately needed new trains for Northern and TPE are coming.

EDIT: And coincidentally, immediately after posting this, I clicked on another link (Rail Technology Magazine) and got to this:

RailTechnologyMagazine said:
TPE hails ‘major milestone’ as Nova 1 trains arrive

TransPennine Express (TPE) have welcomed the first of its new Nova 1 fleet of trains, which the rail operator claims will transform the on-board experience for passengers.
 

kevin_roche

Member
Joined
26 Feb 2019
Messages
448
Maybe not, but it's galling to see pictures of all those new electric units lined up unused for what will be years while we're desperate for any more wires and new stock up north
I feel for users of TfL who will be paying for these trains for some time to come through the leasing contract arranged by TfL even though they are crammed into Central Line Carriages.
 

londonmidland

Member
Joined
22 Dec 2009
Messages
1,038
Location
Leicester
Is there any particular, or official, reason platforms 13 and 14 at Manchester Piccadilly can’t be split into A and B ends, so two trains can arrive into the same platform?

There are signals roughly half way down the platforms if I remember correctly.

One reason I can think of is lack of platform space for passengers when waiting further down the platform. Particularly round the sides of the staircases.
 

Top