Misuse of Spouse travel Pass

[bramling]

I disagree. It’s to his or her employees. With them, there is no company.

I'd say this depends on the individual concerned though. There's certainly managers out there would purr with delight when one of their staff has been caught out on something, whilst others will sigh and think "what is the best way to resolve this?". It doesn't help that the industry has difficulties with performance management in places, so disciplinary issues are sometimes jumped on as a way of getting rid of problem people, in lieu of their performance having been effectively managed over time.

 

[43096]

I'd say this depends on the individual concerned though. There's certainly managers out there would purr with delight when one of their staff has been caught out on something, whilst others will sigh and think "what is the best way to resolve this?". It doesn't help that the industry has difficulties with performance management in places, so disciplinary issues are sometimes jumped on as a way of getting rid of problem people, in lieu of their performance having been effectively managed over time.

How does it help by not telling them in this situation? Either way, the RPI’s report lands on their desk. If the employee is up front about it, then the manager already has some context. If nothing is said, it’s not a good starting point.

 

[najaB]

This. Manager's first and primary loyalty is to the company.

I disagree. It’s to his or her employees. Without them, there is no company.

Like I said: they're split.

 

[Brissle Girl]

I'd say this depends on the individual concerned though. There's certainly managers out there would purr with delight when one of their staff has been caught out on something, whilst others will sigh and think "what is the best way to resolve this?". It doesn't help that the industry has difficulties with performance management in places, so disciplinary issues are sometimes jumped on as a way of getting rid of problem people, in lieu of their performance having been effectively managed over time.

That's also likely to depend on the general attitude of the member of staff prior to the incident. If one has been cooperative and helpful over time then that is likely to result in a different approach to that where the employee is perceived by the manager to adopt a more confrontational attitude or is someone who rather than going the extra mile will do the bare minimum and not even that given half the chance. That's partly human nature, but it also makes the manager slightly more wary as to the story being told, if they don't have complete confidence in the person needing help.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I disagree. It’s to his or her employees. Without them, there is no company.

It's in reality a bit of both. Sometimes the company is better off without a given employee, e.g. one who (not the OP) has acted dishonestly.

 

[najaB]

It's in reality a bit of both. Sometimes the company is better off without a given employee, e.g. one who (not the OP) has acted dishonestly.

That's loyalty to the employees (as a body) rather than a specific employee.

 

[Hanson]

Update: went through the investigation last week for the misuse of the pass.
I honestly answered as much as I can, and emphasised indeed I had no knowledge about the usage which was due to Rocky marriage and constant disagreement always going on (and btw I’m already looking for a place of mine now to stay separate)

But my union Rep still just adviced I wait till report is compiled by the investigative manager and I can have an idea what I’d be facing, but my concern is, the rep isn’t reassuring me of anything, which is worrying.

After reading about the coercion and controlling behaviour stated by @LondonExile, I have now realised I could have been commiting that offence which by the way carries a 5years sentence truely by monitoring her (my spouse) and asking about the pass even though I couldn’t remember due to the state of the marriage and coercing her as she wouldn’t even talk to me at all, matters would have been worse as that would even make a bad situation even worse.

Now I’m thinking is it worth stating this out to the rep, as I’m pretty sure he does even know this...!

Also with this law, that means I couldn’t have done anything else actually since I have stated to her the conditions, it’s even stated in the card which I pointed out to her from the start.

Does this now mean that the travel policy which state “employees must make sure dependant are aware of the conditions” only ends there as clearly one could be committing a crime when one is constantly monitoring a partners life about how they travel within a struggling and crumbling marriage.

 

[island]

Making someone aware of the conditions is a one-off event. It does not (and cannot) say that the staff member must ensure the family members abide by them.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Update: went through the investigation last week for the misuse of the pass.
I honestly answered as much as I can, and emphasised indeed I had no knowledge about the usage which was due to Rocky marriage and constant disagreement always going on (and btw I’m already looking for a place of mine now to stay separate)

But my union Rep still just adviced I wait till report is compiled by the investigative manager and I can have an idea what I’d be facing, but my concern is, the rep isn’t reassuring me of anything, which is worrying.

After reading about the coercion and controlling behaviour stated by @LondonExile, I have now realised I could have been commiting that offence which by the way carries a 5years sentence truely by monitoring her (my spouse) and asking about the pass even though I couldn’t remember due to the state of the marriage and coercing her as she wouldn’t even talk to me at all, matters would have been worse as that would even make a bad situation even worse.

Now I’m thinking is it worth stating this out to the rep, as I’m pretty sure he does even know this...!

Also with this law, that means I couldn’t have done anything else actually since I have stated to her the conditions, it’s even stated in the card which I pointed out to her from the start.

Does this now mean that the travel policy which state “employees must make sure dependant are aware of the conditions” only ends there as clearly one could be committing a crime when one is constantly monitoring a partners life about how they travel within a struggling and crumbling marriage.

I’m not a lawyer, or a union rep, or a railway worker (I was once, but that’s more then twenty years ago so is hardly current experience) but I can’t see much mileage in this argument. You seem to be arguing that because you didn’t do something that you did not know might not be the right thing to do, then you shouldn’t face any punishment.

At the very least, that feels like grasping at straws. But if that does turn out to be your only way of not running into problems because of this incident, then I think you will need a very experienced advocate to present your case. So I think that for the moment it makes sense to follow your union rep’s advice - wait until the report is compiled before doing anything else.

 

[357]

I would just be honest and say that you showed your partner the letter - and confirmed your partner understood the restrictions.

When your relationship became problematic you had other things on your mind, and forgot she even had the passes.

You should call/email Rail Staff Travel and ensure they don't send her any more passes, and keep a copy of the email. That will help in any investigation.

I think the company should take pity on you, however remember that investigations start with a Q and A - in my experience, these things tend to get to disciplinary hearing, where you need to ensure you give a good defence, and then you will get a "suitable letter of advice".

If you tell the company what you told us, and it is the truth, then your job is safe, your passes are safe, and I would be surprised if you even get a warning. But, they will try to scare you and show you how serious the situation is.

I am a railway worker of many years and a former union rep.

 

[philthetube]

If you are not comfortable with what your rep is telling you ask if they have taken any advice on this, and if not have a chat with another one, poss higher up.

Everything is going to come out, you are not going to be able to hide the truth, nor should you, so get all the advice you can.

 

[Bald Rick]

And talk to your manager!!

 

[Hanson]

If you are not comfortable with what your rep is telling you ask if they have taken any advice on this, and if not have a chat with another one, poss higher up.

Everything is going to come out, you are not going to be able to hide the truth, nor should you, so get all the advice you can.

I will be doing this tomorrow. Will try speak to another rep that I know
Thank

I would just be honest and say that you showed your partner the letter - and confirmed your partner understood the restrictions.

When your relationship became problematic you had other things on your mind, and forgot she even had the passes.

You should call/email Rail Staff Travel and ensure they don't send her any more passes, and keep a copy of the email. That will help in any investigation.

I think the company should take pity on you, however remember that investigations start with a Q and A - in my experience, these things tend to get to disciplinary hearing, where you need to ensure you give a good defence, and then you will get a "suitable letter of advice".

If you tell the company what you told us, and it is the truth, then your job is safe, your passes are safe, and I would be surprised if you even get a warning. But, they will try to scare you and show you how serious the situation is.

I am a railway worker of many years and a former union rep.

During the interview, I totally told them everything and to be honest the psd was the last thing on my mind. But I answered I also told her the regulations of the pass and she knows. When the most recent one got delivered she was totally aware of the conditions but still due to the total break down in communication and my state of emotional distress didn’t even think of it. I have clearly stated this to them during my interview as well. Things were really tough for me. I couldn’t have physically be monitoring when and how she uses it as I trusted her as an adult she confirmed she understand she couldn’t use it to work when she had it.

I have just emailed RSTL to not send any pass in her name anymore and take her off as my dependent. This might be coming from me a bit late but I will have the copy of the email to show during my defence hope that would help...

I’m not even expecting not to get some sort of reprimand or loss of my pass as well due to this, I am just concerned about keeping my job.

 

[RunawayTrain]

...Everything is going to come out, you are not going to be able to hide the truth, nor should you, so get all the advice you can.

+1

Take some comfort in this. The whole truth is likely to emerge. Get the best advocate, put forward your best case, be open and and truthful. The cards will then fall how they fall, and you can deal with that then. The world will keep turning, you can move on with your life. Best of luck.

 

[Hanson]

I’m not a lawyer, or a union rep, or a railway worker (I was once, but that’s more then twenty years ago so is hardly current experience) but I can’t see much mileage in this argument. You seem to be arguing that because you didn’t do something that you did not know might not be the right thing to do, then you shouldn’t face any punishment.

At the very least, that feels like grasping at straws. But if that does turn out to be your only way of not running into problems because of this incident, then I think you will need a very experienced advocate to present your case. So I think that for the moment it makes sense to follow your union rep’s advice - wait until the report is compiled before doing anything else.

No all. I am totally expecting some sort of punishment definitely, I’m just concerned about my job due to this. I couldn’t have physically monitored her, I totally didn’t remember anything about pass. Was just concerned about my son and my own well being.
I just hope they understand been in an emotion distress due to pressure in my marriage and constant arguments This has caused a miss use of travel facility and I get a severe reprimand or even loss my pass but not my job, that’s just my main concern MY JOB!

 

[najaB]

I am totally expecting some sort of punishment definitely, I’m just concerned about my job due to this. I couldn’t have physically monitored her, I totally didn’t remember anything about pass. Was just concerned about my son and my own well being.

Obviously we can't make any promises, but to my mind if you have an otherwise clean disciplinary record your job isn't likely to be at risk. I'd expect travel facilities to be revoked, and for you to get some kind of formal reprimand.

 

[357]

From the information you have given us - I think your job is safe.

Like I said earlier, I think you will get a letter of advice, but given the situation I doubt it will be more.

At a push, the most I can see is a written warning. These drop off your file after a year or two anyway.

I don't even think your own passes are at risk, providing you don't lie to them and are honest.

The company surely can't punish you for your marriage breaking down!

 

[Hanson]

Obviously we can't make any promises, but to my mind if you have an otherwise clean disciplinary record your job isn't likely to be at risk. I'd expect travel facilities to be revoked, and for you to get some kind of formal reprimand.

Thanks I know. Haven’t got any disciplinary record, I haven’t had any issue with any management member, I have always been diligent at work, just the spouse that has got me into this, due to the sour marriage conditions we were in.
Hopefully they understand, it’s just an anxious wait for me and stressful

From the information you have given us - I think your job is safe.

Like I said earlier, I think you will get a letter of advice, but given the situation I doubt it will be more.

At a push, the most I can see is a written warning. These drop off your file after a year or two anyway.

I don't even think your own passes are at risk, providing you don't lie to them and are honest.

The company surely can't punish you for your marriage breaking down!

Thanks. Please what is a letter of advice??
And to be honest I will be more than happy with a written warning, as I think it would serve as a lesson learnt for me.

I have told them the whole truth really, it’s depressing! My marital struggles has got me in this really

 

[221129]

Please what is a letter of advice??

Slap on the wrist, don't do it again.

 

[357]

Thanks. Please what is a letter of advice??

It's basically as above, a slap on the wrist saying don't do it again.

In future, it stops someone saying the management ignored the issue.

The issue has been raised, and management need to be seen to do something. The letter is kept on your record and management can say to anyone who asks "The situation did not call for formal disciplinary action, but we did send a letter reminding the staff member of their responsibilities".

 

[WesternLancer]

I will be doing this tomorrow. Will try speak to another rep that I know
Thank


During the interview, I totally told them everything and to be honest the psd was the last thing on my mind. But I answered I also told her the regulations of the pass and she knows. When the most recent one got delivered she was totally aware of the conditions but still due to the total break down in communication and my state of emotional distress didn’t even think of it. I have clearly stated this to them during my interview as well. Things were really tough for me. I couldn’t have physically be monitoring when and how she uses it as I trusted her as an adult she confirmed she understand she couldn’t use it to work when she had it.

I have just emailed RSTL to not send any pass in her name anymore and take her off as my dependent. This might be coming from me a bit late but I will have the copy of the email to show during my defence hope that would help...

I’m not even expecting not to get some sort of reprimand or loss of my pass as well due to this, I am just concerned about keeping my job.

Not offering any advice - just a message of good luck in what is clearly a very difficult and stressful time. I hope the managers who hear the case will be able to appreciate that some aspects of life are complex and not easy to say the least, and not fully within your control for reasons you have explained. Best wishes and good luck to you Hanson.

 

[philthetube]

Thanks. Please what is a letter of advice??

commonly known as being suitably advised.

 

[Hanson]

Not offering any advice - just a message of good luck in what is clearly a very difficult and stressful time. I hope the managers who hear the case will be able to appreciate that some aspects of life are complex and not easy to say the least, and not fully within your control for reasons you have explained. Best wishes and good luck to you Hanson.

Thanks, I really hope so.

 

[HSP 2]

I hope everything works out well for you.

But I'm a bit surprised in that the union rep. nor your manager has mentioned getting it touch with the staff welfare department for any help and advice. More to do with your domestic life rather than your work. It can be a surprise how much they can help.

When I was reping a number of years back if I did not feel confident with a case I would be in contact with the branch office and see what they had to say.

I wish you well.

 

[LCC106]

I may be wrong but I interpret the slap on the wrist as anything from a quiet word in your ear to a possible warning on your record. It’s easy for us to say from the outside looking in but if you are an open and honest person it will be ok in the end. Worst case scenario just make sure you continue as an honest employee. Great advice from the former rep on here.

 

[Hanson]

I would just be honest and say that you showed your partner the letter - and confirmed your partner understood the restrictions.

When your relationship became problematic you had other things on your mind, and forgot she even had the passes.

You should call/email Rail Staff Travel and ensure they don't send her any more passes, and keep a copy of the email. That will help in any investigation.

I think the company should take pity on you, however remember that investigations start with a Q and A - in my experience, these things tend to get to disciplinary hearing, where you need to ensure you give a good defence, and then you will get a "suitable letter of advice".

If you tell the company what you told us, and it is the truth, then your job is safe, your passes are safe, and I would be surprised if you even get a warning. But, they will try to scare you and show you how serious the situation is.

I am a railway worker of many years and a former union rep.

I need everyone help and advice please...
This is what I got back today.
All my circumstances hasn’t been considered at all all here, which is really hurting me, my union rep don’t seem to be experienced enough as well and literally going with what the company has said

what can I do, has anyone got a strong rep I can talk to please

 

[221129]

I need everyone help and advice please...
This is what I got back today.
All my circumstances hasn’t been considered at all all here, which is really hurting me, my union rep don’t seem to be experienced enough as well and literally going with what the company has said

what can I do, has anyone got a strong rep I can talk to please

This is well beyond the scope of this forum. I would suggest speaking to an alternative union rep as a matter of urgency as it looks like your job is very much on the line here.

 

[ukkid]

Get a solicitor. They will understand better and articulate better.

Things like coercive control mentioned earlier in the thread, would be better understood by a solicitor, and if it can be argued, articulated better.

How do you provide evidence a marriage is rocky and stressful.

 

[Hanson]

Get a solicitor. They will understand better and articulate better.

Things like coercive control mentioned earlier in the thread, would be better understood by a solicitor, and if it can be argued, articulated better.

How do you provide evidence a marriage is rocky and stressful.

I don’t know how to provide evidence, I’m willing to get statements from the friend the helped me with accommodation staying with him when things were really bad... as he can testify to all what was happening
But my union rep ain’t helping he just keep saying I was responsible for the pass and so on... but not considering the circumstances I was in and around me, last thing on my mind was the pass
Don’t know what to do now

How do I get a Solicitor please

 

[Haywain]

You can’t take a solicitor into a disciplinary hearing, so that is not the appropriate advice at this point. I would suggest, in the first instance, phoning your union’s regional or head office and requesting their assistance, explaining your lack of confidence in the local rep. I would hope (but not be certain) that they can put you in touch with a more senior and more experienced officer.