MML Electrification: progress updates

[ABB125]

In truth this and other schemes got “Network Rail GWR 500% electrification costoveruned" rather than "Grayinged"

"Graylinged" is rather more politically convenient though. And it's much less if a mouthful to type!

 

[Meerkat]

I can't say how detailed or serious it was but I've seen a plan of the Dore West Junction area showing a feeder station to the north of that junction.

Feeder from where - I can’t see any nearby power lines or substations on Google maps??

 

[59CosG95]

Feeder from where - I can’t see any nearby power lines or substations on Google maps??

Might be a TSC or SATS @Killingworth had seen. Would make sense to have sectioning arrangements there, but a feeder station is unlikely.

 

[edwin_m]

Based on nothing better than the OS map, several Grid lines converge at a site just east of Chesterfield, one of which runs alongside the A617 towards the town but disappears (presumably underground) just before the railway. So my guess would be a feeder just south of Chesterfield station.

 

[ABB125]

Based on nothing better than the OS map, several Grid lines converge at a site just east of Chesterfield, one of which runs alongside the A617 towards the town but disappears (presumably underground) just before the railway. So my guess would be a feeder just south of Chesterfield station.

Open Infrastructure Map

Map of the world's electricity, telecoms, oil, and gas infrastructure, using data from OpenStreetMap

openinframap.org

They appear to be mainly 132kV, with a couple of 275kV lines as well.

My (totally amateur) predictions are for stations at Ratcliffe/Kegworth (as mentioned upthread): https://openinframap.org/#12.13/52.85727/-1.26247 and, if another is needed (I have no idea; perhaps not if only London to Sheffield is being done) at Brinsworth on the line which avoids Sheffield (I don't know the official name), at M1 junction 33: https://openinframap.org/#11.99/53.39948/-1.35708. I suspect that this may be an ideal site if further electrification around Sheffield is planned.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Based on nothing better than the OS map, several Grid lines converge at a site just east of Chesterfield, one of which runs alongside the A617 towards the town but disappears (presumably underground) just before the railway. So my guess would be a feeder just south of Chesterfield station.

Chesterfield is a NG 275kV bulk supply point so a potentially suitable connection point but a few miles from the railway though. The beauty of the Midlands is with the plethora of Coal Fire Power stations built in the 60's and 70's there is a very dense 275/400kV system across the area so plenty of connection points are on offer. However, given its unlikley to have the traffic density of WCML/ECML the load demands may be suitable for connection at lower voltages using SFCs which could provide a quicker connection time.

 

[ohgoditsjames]

Unlikely to happen, but at Meadowhall the National Grid to Northern Powergrid Wincobank substation has 275kV available.

 

[hwl]

Underground 275kV cable to Jordansthorpe substation a couple of km due east of Dore and Totley would make the most sense for Killingworth saw

 

[Meerkat]

However, given its unlikley to have the traffic density of WCML/ECML the load demands may be suitable for connection at lower voltages using SFCs which could provide a quicker connection time.

With HS2 on top the load would be quite high wouldn‘t it?

Underground 275kV cable to Jordansthorpe substation a couple of km due east of Dore and Totley would make the most sense for Killingworth saw

In that case I apologise to Killingworth!
Would it make sense to have the feed at Dore so it could provide a separate feed to a later electrification of the Hope Valley?

 

[ohgoditsjames]

With HS2 on top the load would be quite high wouldn‘t it?

In that case I apologise to Killingworth!
Would it make sense to have the feed at Dore so it could provide a separate feed to a later electrification of the Hope Valley?

There was a site marked around Dore a while ago. I work for the regional DNO and we usually get National Grid plans but I can’t for the life of me find it.

 

[InTheEastMids]

Link to an FOI response by Network Rail on the topic of MML electrification substations from 2017:
FOI2017 00821.pdf (whatdotheyknow.com)

"The proposed locations of the four National Grid supply points were:

Sundon, Bedfordshire
Braybrooke, near Market Harborough
Kegworth, near East Midlands Parkway
Hasland, near Chesterfield"

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

With HS2 on top the load would be quite high wouldn‘t it?

Fair point so lets hope they are future proofing the connections as its cost 5-10% more to double the MVA connection rating of supergrid transformers now as opposed to having to reinforce it in the future. Also with the lead time on getting grid connections being driven by outage availability on the NG as well as acquiring land can also take time if it has to be through compulsory purchase order.

 

[unlevel42]

Unlikely to happen, but at Meadowhall the National Grid to Northern Powergrid Wincobank substation has 275kV available.

Steelmaking in Sheffield/Rotherham has left a legacy of old and underused Grid substations next to railway track:
Meadowhall(Potential for using Brightside sidings. Towards Swinton for Doncaster, Moorthorpe. Renew Tinsley, Catcliffe, Old Road?). Neepsend on the Stocksbridge spur and Tinsley Park. Hasland seems a good simple new location

 

[Flying Phil]

The work on the Braybrooke substation has started. Ground has been cleared and some trenches have been dug.


There is no sign of any other work North of Kettering(Glendon Junction). The masts in that area, on the west MML side, still have no "bits" dangling.

 

[59CosG95]

The work on the Braybrooke substation has started. Ground has been cleared and some trenches have been dug.
View attachment 99511

There is no sign of any other work North of Kettering(Glendon Junction). The masts in that area, on the west MML side, still have no "bits" dangling.
View attachment 99512

Has the missing pile been driven in adjacent to the Fasts south of the bridge at Glendon, @Flying Phil?

 

[Flying Phil]

Here is a Pic to the South of the bridge

 

[James Kevill]

Here is a Pic to the South of the bridge
View attachment 99513

Are they electrifying these lines as well? The other ones are already electrified.

 

[swt_passenger]

Are they electrifying these lines as well? The other ones are already electrified.

Yes, the last couple of months of this discussion are about extending from these “fast lines” as far as Market Harborough. The very latest news covers extending northwards from Market Harborough.

 

[James Kevill]

Yes, the last couple of months of this discussion are about extending from these “fast lines” as far as Market Harborough. The very latest news covers extending northwards from Market Harborough.

That's great news. Since Corby railway station is already electrified like today now, so I guess that Leicester, Derby, Nottingham and Sheffield will be electrified at this point as well. It's just my guess.

 

[59CosG95]

Here is a Pic to the South of the bridge
View attachment 99513

Looks like it hasn't gone in yet then. Thought as much - the main piling contractor seem to be working on Carstairs at the same time so they may only be able to do so much at once!
Edit: I've marked where the pile could go with a red line on MS Paint (parallel to the structure on the Corby lines); position A is on the Dn Fast, while B is in the 10-foot between the Up Fast & Dn Corby. I suspect that there could also be a buried obstruction at this location which needs dealing with, which might be why this mast is still the outlier.

 

[Flying Phil]

Looks like it hasn't gone in yet then. Thought as much - the main piling contractor seem to be working on Carstairs at the same time so they may only be able to do so much at once!

Where is the missing pile? I can see the two foremost ones on the western side and 5 or 6 more for the "fast" MML lines in the middle of the four tracks then spans across all four tracks.......Should there be one more on the western side?

 

[59CosG95]

Where is the missing pile? I can see the two foremost ones on the western side and 5 or 6 more for the "fast" MML lines in the middle of the four tracks then spans across all four tracks.......Should there be one more on the western side?

There should be one beyond the second structure on the Fasts side looking south - whether it's going next to the DF or UF remains to be seen.

 

[Eskimo]

What happens with the OLE when it finishes in non-terminal station? Does it end within the station area or continue to allow for turn backs / over runs.
Also if it’s specially for the MML into Sheffield / Nottingham, do you wire only the platforms that tend to accommodate the MML services, and leaving the bays out? Would seem ludicrous to wire the north bays at Sheffield!

 

[snowball]

What happens with the OLE when it finishes in non-terminal station? Does it end within the station area or continue to allow for turn backs / over runs.
Also if it’s specially for the MML into Sheffield / Nottingham, do you wire only the platforms that tend to accommodate the MML services, and leaving the bays out? Would seem ludicrous to wire the north bays at Sheffield!

It's up to the designer. It can depend on local circumstances and current (no pun intended) thinking. There are changes in fashion.

In the original WCML south electrification, practically every siding was wired. When it was extended to Glasgow, it was much more limited.

When electric services from Liverpool Street towards Cambridge only ran as far as Bishop's Stortford, the wires continued for about an extra mile for no obvious reason.

 

[WestRiding]

It's up to the designer. It can depend on local circumstances and current (no pun intended) thinking. There are changes in fashion.

In the original WCML south electrification, practically every siding was wired. When it was extended to Glasgow, it was much more limited.

When electric services from Liverpool Street towards Cambridge only ran as far as Bishop's Stortford, the wires continued for about an extra mile for no obvious reason.

It would make sense to wire all Sheffield station while they were at it, for if ever it goes to South Kirkby and Doncaster. Wiring 3 and 4 though would no doubt cost an extra 30 billion pounds though......

 

[2192]

Snwball said: "Before this and other projects got Graylinged there was an article in Modern Railways that mentioned a series of bridges in Belper. The article was not confined to the MML and also discussed bridges on other lines, and a custom design of OLE for Sydney Gardens, Bath." Post 4385.

IIRC the problem at Belper was a series of attractive but listed bridges, all of which were too low, and the end one was the A6, and very close to the bridge over the river, which could not be lowered; and the solution was to demolish the bridge next to the river bridge, straighten out the awkward bend in the road at this point, build a modern bridge to an attractive design; and lower the track under all the other bridges. Permission to demolish one listed bridge was thought likely to be given, as the scheme improved the main road at the same time.

 

[Killingworth]

It would make sense to wire all Sheffield station while they were at it, for if ever it goes to South Kirkby and Doncaster. Wiring 3 and 4 though would no doubt cost an extra 30 billion pounds though......

We'll be wanting to wire South Kirkby to Church Fenton as well for that money!

For now wiring to the North of Sheffield first needs major consideration of old platforms constructed over a river and how they should all be reconfigured. That still leaves the very big challenge caused by the viaduct across the heavily developed Don valley. I suspect the Northern end will remain unwired for a long time.

 

[Eskimo]

It's up to the designer. It can depend on local circumstances and current (no pun intended) thinking. There are changes in fashion.

I see. I suppose it depends how collaborative the Hope Valley / MML upgrade teams decide to be. If indeed OLE is considered for the former.

 

[Killingworth]

I see. I suppose it depends how collaborative the Hope Valley / MML upgrade teams decide to be. If indeed OLE is considered for the former.

Certainly being considered, although the three long tunnels make that rather challenging without long blockades and a lot of cash. Bimodes with wired and unwired sections could make an amusing digression that is best parked here! That said the outline HS2 plans seemed to suggest wiring from Dore Station Junction a short way south on the Hope Valley tracks roughly to the station

 

[unlevel42]

Hasland, north of Chesterfield, is future proofing.
It can supply MML, Old Road to Swinton, HS2, Hope Valley, down towards Erewash and Nottingham and any new depots.