New contactless Fares from Welwyn Garden City to Blackfriars

[thewaistcoat]

Using the fare finder (https://tfl.gov.uk/fares/find-fares/tube-and-rail-fares/single-fare-finder) I see the contactless fares between Welwyn Garden City (WGC) and Blackfriars (BFR) are Peak £9.10, Off Peak £6.50.

I currently use a combination of Carnet Tickets and Oyster PAYG as I only travel one or two days a week.
Each journeys currently £8.10 + £2.40 = £10.50 outwards, £5.80 + £2.40 = £8.20 return (no evening peak Kings cross to WGC on paper tickets).

So it looks like if I use contactless in the morning, I'll be making a saving. If I return outside of 4pm-7pm I'll also make a saving (otherwise carnet + oyster still wins).

I see that out-of-station interchange between Kings Cross & St Pancras should be valid for flexibility and shouldn't be charged as two journeys.

If I touch in from Blackfriars at 3:55pm, will I still get the off-peak fare despite the train actually departing at 16:04 and OSI being technically in the evening peak? If so I may be able to get away from the dreaded carnet tickets completely and saving a few quid in the process.

Mod edit: Added station names in full to comply with forum rules.

 

[causton]

If I touch in from Blackfriars at 3:55pm, will I still get the off-peak fare despite the train actually departing at 16:04 and OSI being technically in the evening peak? If so I may be able to get away from the dreaded carnet tickets completely and saving a couple of quid.

In short, yes, you can touch in any time up to 1600

 

[island]

If you touch in to start your journey before 16:00 you’ll get off-peak throughout.

 

[some bloke]

Unless it's changed since 2017 the changes between off-peak and peak and vice versa should happen at 6.35, 9.27, 16.05 and 18.57, though there's no guarantee.

(https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/en/request/oyster_card_peakoff_peak_grace_p
and the comment on that page from @MikeWh , whose current page https://www.oyster-rail.org.uk/faqs-and-tips/
has the same timings.)

 

[Wallsendmag]

Wouldn't it be easier to change at Finsbury park?

 

[thewaistcoat]

Wouldn't it be easier to change at Finsbury park?

Not at the moment. If you're quick enough crossing the road at Kings Cross/St Pancras, you usually end up on an earlier train (or two) than you would from Finsbury Park. More so if the train is delayed. The journey planner allows 16 minutes to cross the road so always shows as much longer than it really takes.
It's also dearer with split paper tickets / Oyster as Finsbury Park to Blackfriars is Z2-> Z1. St Pancras to Blackfriars is Z1->Z1. This won't be an issue with contactless to/from WGC though.
On the return journey you're also more likely to find a nice seat at Kings Cross than Finsbury Park.
Once there's more traffic going through the core to/from GN (especially if direct to/from WGC) this will all change.

 

[thewaistcoat]

It's also dearer with split paper tickets / Oyster as Finsbury Park to Blackfriars is Z2-> Z1.

I had ignored the option of using the paper ticket to St Pancras, heading up to ground level, exiting the barriers with the ticket, using Oyster/contactless to tap back in and going back down to the platform, then boarding a train one or two behind the one you were already on from Finsbury Park.
Transferring from paper tickets to Oyster/contactless at St Pancras is not really viable.
Paper ticket from St Pancras to Blackfriars avoiding this faff is also dearer.

 

[soccermad]

WGC is a meaningless code to many Aren't we supposed to spell out the stations in the first post ????

 

[thewaistcoat]

WGC is a meaningless code to many Aren't we supposed to spell out the stations in the first post ????

It's the abbreviation most people use for Welwyn Garden City - especially if you live there or thereabouts. Happily it is also is the station code...

 

[soccermad]

yes but most of us do not live there or thereabouts do we

 

[Failed Unit]

Using the fare finder (https://tfl.gov.uk/fares/find-fares/tube-and-rail-fares/single-fare-finder) I see the contactless fares between WGC and BFR are Peak £9.10, Off Peak £6.50.

I currently use a combination of Carnet Tickets and Oyster PAYG as I only travel one or two days a week.
Each journeys currently £8.10 + £2.40 = £10.50 outwards, £5.80 + £2.40 = £8.20 return (no evening peak Kings cross to WGC on paper tickets).

So it looks like if I use contactless in the morning, I'll be making a saving. If I return outside of 4pm-7pm I'll also make a saving (otherwise carnet + oyster still wins).

I see that out-of-station interchange between Kings Cross & St Pancras should be valid for flexibility and shouldn't be charged as two journeys.

If I touch in from Blackfriars at 3:55pm, will I still get the off-peak fare despite the train actually departing at 16:04 and OSI being technically in the evening peak? If so I may be able to get away from the dreaded carnet tickets completely and saving a few quid in the process.

Glad you highlighted the evening peak. Carnet and oyster remain for me.

I know other members have warned me. Be careful tfl are often more expensive especially at weekends.

 

[Skimpot flyer]

WGC and Hatfield appear to be in the same fare zone, as the Contactless fares to Stonebridge Park, which I sometimes travel to, are the same from either station. If I wasn’t using a Gold Card to discount the off-peak return fare, I’d definitely be using the convenience of Contactless, because avoiding Zone 1 and travelling via Camden Road, 2x £6.20 beats the £14.90 paper fare.

Interestingly, out of mild curiosity, I checked to see if the Single Fare Finder would show fares between Welwyn Garden City and Hatfield, and it gives the following:
Peak: £1.70
Off-Peak £1.40

Given that the Anytime Return (paper) ticket is £3.50, someone can bag a saving of 40p if only one leg of their journey is in the peak period, despite the lack of Railcard discount on the off-peak fare. (Which would be available on a Gold Card, had WGC been ‘Oysterised’)


I guess two off-peak Oyster fares at £1.40 apiece, with a Gold Card discount applied, could have undercut the paper return by a whopping 5p per day !!

 

[thewaistcoat]

I tried the journey yesterday.
Had a 10p charge to my card soon after passing the gates at Welwyn Garden City, then the correct fare charged between 2-3am this morning. As I could start my return journey before 4pm, I saved a handsome £3.10 over carnet tickets + oyster z1-1 combos. I presume the 10p charge will be removed at some point. Not sure if it'll happen every day or just because it was a new card.
As is typical, staying on the train to Kings Cross and walking over to St Pancras allowed me to get on a less packed train (Bedford to Three Bridges) rather than getting on the usually packed Peterborough to Horsham train arriving at Blackfrairs some 6 minutes earlier than if I'd changed at Finsbury Park. The order and timing of the trains from St Pancras is fairly random, but you usually win.
Everything was a lot smoother than using carnet tickets except for on my return, where the gates at Welwyn Garden City didn't initially want to read my card whilst the passengers from both a Moorgate and a Cambridge bound train were all trying to get through the 3 exit barriers at the same time - having to tap out I couldn't use the open staffed gate so could only pick from 2. I had to push my way back towards the platform and wait until the stampede had subsided before being able to try again.
They really need more barriers at Welwyn Garden City, but I've no idea how they'd fit them in.

 

[MikeWh]

I presume the 10p charge will be removed at some point. Not sure if it'll happen every day or just because it was a new card.

The 10p is an authorisation which will drop off shortly. It won't happen every day, but isn't just because it was a new card.

 

[Skimpot flyer]

I used contactless last night to go from Kings Cross to Hatfield, and when checking online banking tonight, saw I was correctly debited £6.50 for the off-peak journey.
The debit shows as ‘TfL Travel Charge’. Does this mean GTR aka Great Northern lose the revenue from such journeys, when Contactless is used ? Or do they have a deal with TfL?

 

[MikeWh]

I used contactless last night to go from Kings Cross to Hatfield, and when checking online banking tonight, saw I was correctly debited £6.50 for the off-peak journey.
The debit shows as ‘TfL Travel Charge’. Does this mean GTR aka Great Northern lose the revenue from such journeys, when Contactless is used ? Or do they have a deal with TfL?

They deal with TfL. TfL act as a central collection point for both Oyster and contactless. Journeys wholly on a TOC will go to the TOC subject to agreements if caps have been reached.