New Cross Country

[332 > 444]

Snooze, you lose unfortunately.

 

[PeterH]

will this change anything for me going from Bristol Parkway to Tamworth on a Voager id dont have to change trains with all me bags of photographic eqp when going to Glamour studios


Many Thanks

 

[virginjon]

I dont think the AXC staff are going to be too happy moving from a shop to a trolly, heaving it all the way through 5 coaches. I bet there will now be a fight at EDB to get into working on the VWC Brum-Scotland services!

No they won't. They'll be kicking themselves though, as Virgin staff at Edinburgh decided a couple of months ago whether they wanted to work for XC or WC, and as from the May timetable change they've been rostered either down the East coast or West coast ready for November. Looks like those that chose WC will be breathing a sigh of relief!

As for removing a toilet and the shop from voyagers, it's complete lunacy! Having worked on them since introduction the toilets aren't the most reliable, and quite often they'll be at least 1 out of use, causing queues at the others, over use, so the tanks fill up faster, so they themselves can't be used!
Removing the shop to make more seats/ luggage space? Goodbye to chilled drinks, goodbye to hot food, goodbye to freshly ground cappuccinos and lattes. Hello to warm sandwiches and warm instant coffee out of an urn. Sandwiches which if aren't bought within 4 hours have to be thrown out, but still have to be paid for by the compoany, resulting in price increases across the range.
It's not very often that a train is so full that people can't get to the on board shop. But it only takes a few bags in aisles to stop a trolley going though the train.
Thank God i'm transferring to Virgin West Coast in November!:-P

 

[voyagerdude220]

Well I really am bothered about Arriva now that I've heard all the news about them ripping out the shop on the Voyagers they get, and also a toilet!!

Why on earth are they taking out the shop, when It's probably made VXC a reasonable sum in terms of profit, with it being quite busy on the average XC Voyager.

Also, I notice that the New XC website mentions having hot snacks in FC, replacing the snack box rubbish. Where abouts is this food going to be prepared on the train- Are they keeping the galley/TM's office the same?
I don't think FC passengers will be happy if the FC trolley is the same one going through SC, which is stuck 3 carriages down, because of a big, heavy suitcase in the way..

Does anyone know If the New XC trains will continue to have Value singles?
Arriva do their own range in Wales at the moment..

 

[Tom]

Seeing as you always travel in FC you obviously don't have a clue about how busy SC can get.

More seats are required in the Voyagers - not a shop or a toilet. There are already plenty of toilets on the units.

I expect the TMs office/galley will remain and stay the same, however.

 

[voyagerdude220]

you obviously don't have a clue about how busy SC can get.

Excuse me, you don't have to be like that.

You may be surprised Tom, but i DO know just how busy Voyagers can get, especially seeing I regularly travel on them, and specialise in them.

I know very well how busy they get, especially (but not exclusively) to services, around the 16:00-19:00 time scale.

Just because I travel FC, doesn't mean to say I don't sometimes have a walk down the train, to see how busy it is, and also to see If any engines are out.
(Alternatively I sometimes ask the TM if they know me)

 

[tubenutter]

doesn't mean to say I don't sometimes have a walk down the train, to see how busy it is

Aww you sad little thing :P

 

[Tom]

Tell me this - would you rather see people sitting down in chairs or sitting on bags or in vestibules because of the excessive amount of wasted space?

 

[voyagerdude220]

Tell me this - would you rather see people sitting down in chairs or sitting on bags or in vestibules because of the excessive amount of wasted space?

I know that Voyagers really need seats, but the trolley is not a good replacement of the shop at all.

If the DFT allowed VXC to order longer Voyagers in the first place, Arriva may not be looking at removing the shop at this stage.

I totally agree that the huge toilets are a waste of space however, and have said over on rail chat a while ago, about the pheaseability of replacing them with an ordianary sized toilet/ removing one/two completely.

 

[devon_metro]

Generally though, everybody on a Voyager is there to sit down whereas not every customer goes to the shop which IMO is a waste of space and when somebody is at the counter can often cause jams in the isle.

 

[Daniel]

Just to say, First Class passengers won't have to worry. There may be a trolley service, but their website specifically says that hot food will be available. Despite the removal of the shop, the kitchens will still remain, meaning proper hot meals can be made. I would imagine that first class passengers will receive an at seat service with proper meals, while standard class will be able to have warmed up sandwiches.

 

[87015]

If the DFT allowed VXC to order longer Voyagers in the first place, Arriva may not be looking at removing the shop at this stage.

Virgin have lined their pockets with enough of my taxes thank you very much. They cocked up in the first place with completeley unsuitable Voyagers, they should have been made to pay for sorting the mess out themselves.
Best thing for the Voyagers would be a quick export and some refurbed MkIIIs to CIE standards with a new TRAXX sparky and decent passenger type 5....

 

[voyagerdude220]

Just to say, First Class passengers won't have to worry. There may be a trolley service, but their website specifically says that hot food will be available. Despite the removal of the shop, the kitchens will still remain, meaning proper hot meals can be made. I would imagine that first class passengers will receive an at seat service with proper meals, while standard class will be able to have warmed up sandwiches.

I would like to mention at this point, that I do not wish SC passengers to be treated any differently to FC passengers.

I'm probably going to travel SC sometimes, If the New XC don't have a discounted Value First range of tickets, preferbly with a YP discount.

*off topic*- I'm still waiting a proper response from VT, to confirm if they are or aren't offering the YP discount on Value First Tickets. I sent the original question nearly a week ago.**

I'd be very happy to see proper food returning to XC, and inturn, with an hourly service Manchester to Bristol, would definately get my vote.

Is there any chance of any HSTs/loco hauled trains being used to/from the North West, or is it just specifically NE-SW?

Edit: Is there a specific date when a guide timetable for the New XC services will be released?

 

[Ascot]

As a midlander and the heart of Voyagers here there and everywhere i'v had my fare share compared to some of those here who have better tocs to travel on

The shop is very useful Tom for Voyagers and i'd say even the commuters use it alot between Brum and Tamworth etc...

Also Tom they do couple up 2 Units together and that evens it all out beautifully.. the only thing that should be changed it maybe give better toilets, replace the plastic tops to stop the rattling and add more coaches

I'v only done First Class twice on a Weekday (yes valid) and the service is nice i think, not as good as West Coast on a weekday but the fact someone goes to the shop for you and brings you something nice to eat rather than something you can call a packed lunch.

 

[voyagerdude220]

The shop is very useful Tom for Voyagers and i'd say even the commuters use it alot between Brum and Tamworth etc...

Exactly Ascot, It is well used on busy XC services. Whenever I've been down there myself, there's usually been a few other customers there as well.

Also Tom they do couple up 2 Units together and that evens it all out beautifully.. the only thing that should be changed it maybe give better toilets, replace the plastic tops to stop the rattling and add more coaches

Unfortunately, this normally only happens at weekends, when fewer Voyagers are required to run around, because of scheduled engineering work.
The 08:00 Birmingham New Street to Edinburgh, is usually a double set, even on weekdays. I don't know how busy this specific service is, but would think that a Glasgow to Penzance/ Penzance to Dundee/ Edinburgh to Bournemouth services would benefit more, than just this Birmingham to Edinburgh service.

 

[Daniel]

I would like to mention at this point, that I do not wish SC passengers to be treated any differently to FC passengers.

Really? Then why pay extra for a First Class ticket?

 

[voyagerdude220]

Really? Then why pay extra for a First Class ticket?

Big reclining seats, quieter carriages, at seat service, very nice relaxing journey etc

And also a three-course meal thrown in when I go Primo style in August

 

[paul1609]

Callufrax, they can't simply add another coach to each train, as the production line no longer exists. Also, if the production line was to be re-tooled and reopened, each new carriage would have to be a trailer as the QSK19 engines are no longer in production.

Whilst the QSK19 engine in the Voyager is as you say no longer in production. The QSK engine is still a current cummins product. If you wanted the current low emmisions model Im sure Cummins could sell it to you.

 

[Lewisham2221]

Tell me this - would you rather see people sitting down in chairs or sitting on bags or in vestibules because of the excessive amount of wasted space?

I'd rather sit down on a bag/the floor in a vestibule and be able to get a nice cold drink and something decent to eat, rather than sitting in a seat and paying a fortune for something that taste's awful.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Just to let you know, that I've created a poll, for you to vote for what you think should happen to the Voyager shops, once Arriva take them over.

 

[Techniquest]

My views on Arriva are spread across the Internet, particularly on here and WNXX, many times over so I won't repeat them again now.

Suffice to say it'll be a sad day when Virgin XC is no longer in existance...I do however reckon after 6 months (probably before) XC will go down the drain. It's not half-bad at the moment (there are bad days like there are everywhere but generally speaking XC runs brilliantly), but Arriva are not known for running a franchise well...

 

[Lewisham2221]

you obviously don't have a clue about how busy SC can get.

Neither, quite clearly, do you. Otherwise you would realise that 15 or so extra seats is going to make bugger all difference...but will annoy/inconvenience many more than the 15 who now have a seat, because they won't be able to get something half decent to eat or drink. Not to mention the almost inevitable PR piffle that they'll no doubt come out with, shouting about 'more seats on our trains' leading to more people using the train, and hence more overcrowding.

 

[Tom]

I'm quite aware that removing the shop would cause problems - but it's needlessly huge. A modified version of it (FWIW, I've voted for that in the poll) would be far better, possibly only taking the space of the current buffet on a class 444. This would allow at least 10 more seats to be fitted - while keeping buffet facilities at a central location on board the train.

 

[Lewisham2221]

Would it still be worth spending all that money doing the modifications, for a few seats that would still make next to no difference?

 

[Tom]

Seeing as Arriva have already committed themselves to a refurb - yep. A refurbishment implies ripping out the interior and starting again.

 

[me123]

Suffice to say it'll be a sad day when Virgin XC is no longer in existance...I do however reckon after 6 months (probably before) XC will go down the drain. It's not half-bad at the moment (there are bad days like there are everywhere but generally speaking XC runs brilliantly), but Arriva are not known for running a franchise well...

I agree. Virgin XC was a fantastic franchise, with helpful staff and comfortable trains (when they didn't smell) and generally punctual services in my experience. Even an apology for arriving early.

I know the staff and trains won't change (aside from a refurbishment, naturally), but I hope Arriva continues the high standard set by Virgin. I know they haven't got a good track record, but give them a chance. They are taking over a good franchise, maybe it will inspire them.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Neither, quite clearly, do you. Otherwise you would realise that 15 or so extra seats is going to make bugger all difference...but will annoy/inconvenience many more than the 15 who now have a seat, because they won't be able to get something half decent to eat or drink. Not to mention the almost inevitable PR piffle that they'll no doubt come out with, shouting about 'more seats on our trains' leading to more people using the train, and hence more overcrowding.

I'm just annoyed with Tom, for saying I "obviously know nothing about how busy SC can get" when he doesn't know alot about the over crowding either.
Do you work for VXC Tom? I can bet alot of money that you don't!

I wouldnt' have minded Tom putting the point differently, it's just that I feel it was a bit blunt.

 

[plikma]

Y'know what, instead of axeing the shop and disabled loos perhaps they should axe First Class. Then you'ld have a lot of spare seats. I'm fed up with FC and its rediculously overspaced seats.

 

[Tom]

Voyagerdude, I know a fair bit about the overcrowding - every time I go to London I always get a Voyager for some part of my journey. I can tell you for a fact that the majority of people on board would rather have a seat than have a chilled drink or something silly like that. Considering the average XC journey is 80 miles then I think it speaks huge amounts.

 

[Ascot]

Voyagerdude, I know a fair bit about the overcrowding - every time I go to London I always get a Voyager for some part of my journey. I can tell you for a fact that the majority of people on board would rather have a seat than have a chilled drink or something silly like that. Considering the average XC journey is 80 miles then I think it speaks huge amounts.

Thing is though Tom beyond Reading up north is alot more Network for long distance and even Commuters... baring in Mind they based in Birmingham they do not really care for much whats beyond Manchester, Reading, York, Bristol like with all TOCs for that matter.