New homes for ex-Caledonian Sleeper Mark 2 and 3 stock

[fgwrich]

Reported elsewhere that Mk2 9810 taken from Ferme Park to Derby RTC today.

Mark

Owned by Eastern Rail Services but going on hire to Network Rail (the toilets being of the CET variety being a big plus for NR).

 

[fgwrich]

Eastern Rail Services have bought most of the Mark 2 coaches and 4 Sleepers, there is a summary in the latest Rail Express.

ERS Mk2 fleet is as follows:

ERS purchases Caledonian Sleeper vehicles

ERS has agreed to purchase the entire Caledonian Sleeper Mk2 fleet consisting of the following vehicles:
- Mk2f RFO lounge 1210/1220
- Mk2f RLO lounge 6702/6704/6705/6706/6707/6708
- Mk2e BUO brake 9801/9802/9803/9804/9805/9806/9808/9809/9810
There are plans for a number of the vehicles but they are likely to be moved to the Weardale Railway for the time being. There are also 4 Mk3 sleeper coaches transferring to the ERS fleet in due course.

http://easternrailservices.co.uk/news.htm

 

[Journeyman]

I saw 10580 at Bo'ness recently. The plan is to eventually display it in the museum, as a walkthrough exhibit with the last surviving wooden bodied LNER sleeping car, showing the history of Anglo-Scottish sleeper services. The LNER vehicle is painted blue and grey, with one compartment restored in original 1930s condition and another in final 1970s condition.

 

[Mogz]

I wonder if an open-access sleeper operation could ever be profitable?

 

[jagardner1984]

Surely the PRM costs would be prohibitive ? That is after all one of the reasons CS bought new stock.

Does make you wonder what ERS plan to do with all those non compliant lounge cars

 

[Journeyman]

I wonder if an open-access sleeper operation could ever be profitable?

No.

Next?

 

[The47Wanderer]

Went past the SVR the other day and they seem to almost have a full rake of the mk3s! Does anyone have any details of their purpose there? Just storage or?

 

[matt]

Went past the SVR the other day and they seem to almost have a full rake of the mk3s! Does anyone have any details of their purpose there? Just storage or?

Storing them for Locomotive Services Ltd

 

[The47Wanderer]

Storing them for Locomotive Services Ltd

Ah spot on, thanks!

 

[43 302]

Storing them for Locomotive Services Ltd

Do you (or anyone else) happen to know the numbers please?

 

[alexl92]

What do LSL want with sleepers? A Northern Belle-type service perhaps?

 

[fgwrich]

Do you (or anyone else) happen to know the numbers please?

I'll see if I can find them. What I do know so far is that LSL received the following 15 on the 24th of October. However that number will have gone down a little since as some have been moved around and sold on. The 4 in brackets have since moved on to the East Lancs with LSL understood to be retaining 9.

37667 + 10683 + 10519 + 10543 + 10597 + (10529 + 10565 + 10714 + 10719) + 10513 + 10520 + 10650 + 10648 + 10675 + 10504 + 10688

Most are also now stored in the Severn Valley Railways carriage sheds at Kidderminster on behalf of LSL.

 

[fgwrich]

What do LSL want with sleepers? A Northern Belle-type service perhaps?

I would hazard more of a guess at a Royal Scotsman type operation than Northern Belle - the Statesman seems to have need upgraded to become a NB rival, while neither offer sleeping accommodation. Whereas the Royal Scotsman does.

 

[alexl92]

I would hazard more of a guess at a Royal Scotsman type operation than Northern Belle - the Statesman seems to have need upgraded to become a NB rival, while neither offer sleeping accommodation. Whereas the Royal Scotsman does.

That's a better comparison. Am I right in thinking that the NB used to include some MK3 sleepers? Maybe they were staff accomodation though.

 

[fgwrich]

That's a better comparison. Am I right in thinking that the NB used to include some MK3 sleepers? Maybe they were staff accomodation though.

It still does, but your right in that they are only for staff accommodation for when the Belle was touring away from its base.

Whether or not LSL will upgrade the Statesman further or create an entirely new rake with Mk3s remains to be seen. But LSL are rather secretive with it's plans as they seem to be concentrating on building up quite the fleet.

 

[43 302]

Does anyone know the location of 6701, 6705 and 6708? They are the only three RLO coaches that haven't been bought by Eastern Rail Services AFAIK.

 

[popeter45]

is the plan still to use some for a far-north sleeper service or is that plan dead/on hold/no longer gonna use Mark 3's?

 

[DBS92042]

Does anyone know the location of 6701, 6705 and 6708? They are the only three RLO coaches that haven't been bought by Eastern Rail Services AFAIK.

I think 6708 went to LSL and is now used on the Statesman. Not too sure on the other two though.

 

[StephenHunter]

is the plan still to use some for a far-north sleeper service or is that plan dead/on hold/no longer gonna use Mark 3's?

Think that one's dead.

 

[sng7]

is the plan still to use some for a far-north sleeper service or is that plan dead/on hold/no longer gonna use Mark 3's?

As far as I am aware transport scotland rejected it as the subisidy it would need was too expensive (See Here).

 

[43 302]

I think 6708 went to LSL and is now used on the Statesman. Not too sure on the other two though.

Thanks.

 

[47827]

I watched an old holiday programme posted on the Internet last night. It showed Judith Chalmers travelling around Scotland on a luxury IC landcruise with 3x dining Mk1 seating coaches and enough sleepers for a total of about 130 passengers. The Royal Scotsman only carries 30 to 40 passengers typically and is extensively rebuilt to a low capacity standard with spacious bedrooms and lounges. The Statesman train is of a good standard but not anywhere close to that extent.

I put my bet on a return to the late 1980s landcruises with meals and accommodation all or partly aboard the train. The carriages and cabins could be upgraded to Statesman standards but I'd expect the price tag to be half or less that of the Scotsman and the focus to be on London and Midlands to Highland weekends away across the year, especially in summer when hotel availability and charges prohibit the current style of landcruise from being easily possible.

Time will tell, but the financial resource to make it happen does seem to exist and the sorts of characters who would try and pull it off.

The company is accumulating electric traction (currently 4 locos) and a fleet of 37s which are cleared for Oban and looking at opening a depot in Scotland. The ethos is very ambitious even if some goals are met more quickly than others.

 

[Clansman]

As far as I am aware transport scotland rejected it as the subisidy it would need was too expensive (See Here).

Surprised Transport Scotland still had subsidy limits these days!

 

[fgwrich]

Does anyone know the location of 6701, 6705 and 6708? They are the only three RLO coaches that haven't been bought by Eastern Rail Services AFAIK.

IIRC I thought all the Mk2 fleet had been purchased by ERS and was subleased back to Caley Sleeper? There is also a RLO currently sat rubbed down outside Brodies Kilmarnock. So this will either be 6701 or 6705.

 

[43 302]

IIRC I thought all the Mk2 fleet had been purchased by ERS and was subleased back to Caley Sleeper? There is also a RLO currently sat rubbed down outside Brodies Kilmarnock. So this will either be 6701 or 6705.

I couldn't see those vehicles on their website but that could be the case.

 

[43 302]

10527 has just been moved to Didcot Railway Centre by 66063.

 

[59CosG95]

I recall that 10597 was preserved by the Ecclesbourne Valley Railway (and moved by road). 10543, also moved by road, went to the Telford Steam Railway.

 

[fgwrich]

I recall that 10597 was preserved by the Ecclesbourne Valley Railway (and moved by road). 10543, also moved by road, went to the Telford Steam Railway.

Thanks for that. In which case, we now should have Mk3s:

Mk3

LSL: 10683, 10519, 10513, 10520, 10650, 10648, 10675, 10504, 10688
ESR: 10501, 10502, 10600, 10699
ELR: 10529, 10565, 10714, 10719
GWR: 10551, 10553
BR: 10526, 10690, 10693
MNR: 10607, 10666
EVR: 10597
TSR: 10543
DRC: 10527
BKR: 10580
EVR: 10597

Mk2

RLO:
ERS on hire to LSL: 6708 (Now operating in The Statesman set and named "Mount Helicon" / The Hippocrene Bar)

BUO:
ESR/NR: 9081, 9803, 9806, 9808

LSL - Locomotive Services Limited
ERS - Eastern Rail Services at Bishop Auckland
ELR - East Lancs Railway
GWR - Great Western Railway (TOC)
EVR - Ecclesbourne Valley Railway
TSR - Telford Steam Railway
DRC - Didcot Railway Centre
BR - Bluebell Railway
MNR - Mid Norfolk Railway
BKR - Bo'ness
EVR - Ecclesbourne Valley Railway

This is just a rough list and doesn't include those in storage at Long Marston. The Mk2 fleet was purchased by Eastern Rail Services and most should be at Bishop Auckland with the exception of a number of BUOs - now being hired to Network Rail and RLOs.

 

[StephenHunter]

Which types are those?

 

[43 302]

Those are ex Caledonian Mk3 SLEP, SLE and SLEd coaches.
SLEP 10501 - 10617
SLE/SLEd 10648 -10723