New Northern lines at Keighley

Deerfold

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At all three entrances to Keighley station platforms there's now a line on the floor with the repeated slogan "cross the line, risk a fine".

I'm guessing this isn't quite the case, but thought I'd ask.

I occasionally pop onto the platforms to meet people, sometimes when the ticket office is closed.

I'm all for everyone paying when they travel, but do I need to make sure I don't venture onto the platform if I'm not doing (I do know some people use both entrances on one platform for a short cut)?
 
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Watershed

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At all three entrances to Keighley station platforms there's now a line on the floor with the repeated slogan "cross the line, risk a fine".

I'm guessing this isn't quite the case, but thought I'd ask.

I occasionally pop onto the platforms to meet people, sometimes when the ticket office is closed.

I'm all for everyone paying when they travel, but do I need to make sure I don't venture onto the platform if I'm not doing (I do know some people use both entrances on one platform for a short cut)?
It's fundamentally false because Northern doesn't have any Compulsory Ticket Areas AFAIK! In fact Chiltern and T&W Metro seem to be the only operators that have gone for that approach (along with TfL but that operates under a different legal regime as concerns Penalty Fares anyway).

So you could quite legally pass the line without a ticket as long as you're not travelling. In any case, Northern don't have the power to impose 'fines' although of course I recognise that's the vernacular for Penalty Fares.
 

yorkie

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It sounds like Northern Rail are being disingenuous/misleading.

They have no authority to issue "fines" and there is no compulsory ticket area at any station managed by Northern.

I doubt the people who put such signage up actually understand the relevant laws, nor have any concept of compulsory ticket areas. I think they just make it up as they go along.
 

Deerfold

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A little pic I got this morning
 

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John Webb

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I assume the strange symbol is meant to be a whistle? (Only if it's a signal arm it's the wrong way round!)
 

jon0844

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A little pic I got this morning

Might be a clever advertising style trick there. Get people to read things a certain way, while actually not saying what you think it does (a bit like Trainline's claims in adverts).

Yes there's a line, which you'd assume is the line it is referring to - but it could just be referring to someone 'crossing the line' by doing something wrong. It could indeed be interpreted a number of different ways, which gives them the perfect disclaimer!
 

Kite159

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If it makes some passengers who think paying for fares is optional, stop and actually buy a ticket for their local journey rather than only buying a ticket if the guard comes round.

It carrys the same legal weight as signs in some hotels threatening £100+ "Fines" if you get caught smoking etc.
 

XAM2175

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I had been quite sceptical based on the description in the original post but now I see that the full phrase is "travelling without a ticket?" and so on I'm not so concerned.

I assume the strange symbol is meant to be a whistle? (Only if it's a signal arm it's the wrong way round!)
Yes, it is a whistle.
(But it's also the correct way around for a signal arm in a country with right-hand running ;) )
 

jonnyfan

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It's just some PR awareness to remind people to buy before you board. No one is getting a fine for standing on the platform.
 

Wallsendmag

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It sounds like Northern Rail are being disingenuous/misleading.

They have no authority to issue "fines" and there is no compulsory ticket area at any station managed by Northern.

I doubt the people who put such signage up actually understand the relevant laws, nor have any concept of compulsory ticket areas. I think they just make it up as they go along.
Looks fine to me , no mention of the fine coming from Northern.
 

Bletchleyite

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It's just some PR awareness to remind people to buy before you board. No one is getting a fine for standing on the platform.

Is there a particular reason why, if they want to have Compulsory Ticket Areas at particular locations, they don't simply apply to have them designated as such? There is a process for it, though few TOCs seem to use it.
 

jonnyfan

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Is there a particular reason why, if they want to have Compulsory Ticket Areas at particular locations, they don't simply apply to have them designated as such? There is a process for it, though few TOCs seem to use it.
I'm not sure why they haven't gone down the Compulsory Ticket Area, perhaps it is a lot of paperwork and cost! The PR campaign is targeted at high fare evasion stations so maybe if it does not work, then more formal Compulsory Ticket Areas may come into force.
 

Bletchleyite

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These "virtual gatelines" are common in a number of other countries. Sometimes you even get metal Sheffield-stand-like bars delimiting it (placed like a row of bike racks, so you walk between them, sometimes with validating machines mounted on them if that system uses them) so you really feel like you are walking through a "barrier", even though it isn't really one*. So I see no issue with using them here, but really they should be accompanied by a Compulsory Ticket Area being properly applied for and put in place.

* A bit like the gated-off fast lines on the WCML are not locked but provide a considerable psychological barrier to going onto those platforms if a train is not indicated.
 

DB

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They are not traveling so the message does not apply to them.

Correct. It is highlighting the need to buy a ticket before you board.

It is strongly implying that anyone passing that line needs a ticket, which is not the case.

If it was intended to say 'Ticket required to travel on the trains' it could have said exactly that.
 

Bletchleyite

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It is strongly implying that anyone passing that line needs a ticket, which is not the case.

If it was intended to say 'Ticket required to travel on the trains' it could have said exactly that.

The same setup with "you must have a ticket to travel" on it would also work as a psychological barrier, but a proper CTA would be better.
 

XAM2175

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It is strongly implying that anyone passing that line needs a ticket, which is not the case.

If it was intended to say 'Ticket required to travel on the trains' it could have said exactly that.
Read in full it says "Travelling without a ticket? Cross the line, risk a fine!"

Is it a brilliant bit of work? No, not really, but neither do I think it constitutes an intent to create a Compulsory Ticket Area.
 

Deerfold

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Read in full it says "Travelling without a ticket? Cross the line, risk a fine!"

Is it a brilliant bit of work? No, not really, but neither do I think it constitutes an intent to create a Compulsory Ticket Area.
Surely the message would be more accurate with "board a train, risk a fine".
 

Deerfold

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There is now a new ticket machine on the Leeds-bound platform at Keighley station (something I've thought would be useful ever since I moved here). You do of course have to "cross the line" before you get to it - although now, I'm unlikely to make much use of it now that getting a pdf ticket on my phone is so much easier (so long as you don't buy from Northern).
 

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